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ROBERT JONES Lyndon Road

The Dennis Jones that died in Surrey 1979 is definitely your Dennis. You have info that puts him there and his dob on his death registration matches that on the 1939 register in Solihull.

His probate and Sutton ERs confirm the marriage in 1965 to Jane Jamieson and it also confirms a connection to a Helen Jones, which your info suggests is his daughter.

However, as far as I've read the info you've been given doesn't confirm that Jane is Helen's mother. For all we know Helen could be the result of an affair Dennis had and it was in fact she that was living in Sutton at the time of his divorce and he moved there then.
 
This gets even weirder Jane jones and Jane Martin lived together in the 1976 census Jane jones also lived with a Mary and Leonard Gilbody a lot thought maybe they are parents but can’t find a connection
 
Who said he married? If Gwendoline had an affair which resuted in children then Dennis might have as well.
 
NickieJ said:
This gets even weirder Jane jones and Jane Martin lived together in the 1976 census Jane jones also lived with a Mary and Leonard Gilbody a lot thought maybe they are parents but can’t find a connection
Click to expand...
I assume you mean eroll not census.
1970 eroll
1680358369279.png
 
1967 eroll
1680360004868.png
Address 2 Fairview Road Sutton

By 1969
1680360081991.png
The High Street Flat given as his address when he died.

They must have split in 1967 as on the eroll for that year Jane is back with Mary Gilbody.
 
I think we just don't have enough information about Helen to sort things out. We don't know who her mother was or Dennis's relationship with her. There's nothing to suggest that her mother was Jane Jamieson/Martin.

Jones is just too common a name to try and work backwards. And if she did come about through an affair then she may have been registered under a different name and changed it to Jones later (similar to Gwendoline's children with Leonard Joiner).
 
It sounds like maybe Dennis didn’t know of the affair, and she tried to pass the 3 children of as his that’s why they all had Jones surname to start with
 
Access to Sutton erolls should reveal when Helen was first listed at 163a. That might indicate when she could vote but she could simply have been elsewhere.
 
Walter jamieson was born in abt 1913
Married Jane Ann Martin 15 Jul 1939 Cheam, St Dunstan, Surrey, England
Father Walter Robinson Jamieson
 
Joanne and her two brothers don’t know who there dad was, they just know it wasn’t Dennis and Gwendoline met Leonard when Joanne was 5. All this secrecy back then doesn’t make things difficult
 
An extra-marital affair is not something that's gonna be shouted about. There are probably many people whose father isn't who they thought it was and never knew.

From a strictly relationship stand point, all of Gwendoline's other children and Jane's (Jamieson) children from her first marriage are irrelevant to your family tree - only Barry and the elusive Helen.

Though of course they may provide relevant info, as it seems to be the case here.
 
Yeah i know i did add them to my tree to see if any hints came up but nothing we didnt now already unfortunately
 
I can appreciate that, I've done whole trees to try and attract relations of second husbands/wives etc. And it worked in one case when a nephew of my grandfather's second wife contacted me, though others have drawn a complete blank.
 
MWS said:
I can appreciate that, I've done whole trees to try and attract relations of second husbands/wives etc. And it worked in one case when a nephew of my grandfather's second wife contacted me, though others have drawn a complete blank.
Click to expand...
Hit and miss it’s worked for me on some Robert and Arthur jones no problem Dennis proving to be harder with this Helen and no electrol roll for Surrey after 1970.
 
Thank you for all your help it’s greatly appreciated.I’m looking for Williams brother and sisters birth certificates, I’ve found Arfon but can’t find Jane Idwal or David Owen with the information I have it’s the same mothers maiden name it’s strange.
 
I gave a Jones recap here...

ROBERT JONES Lyndon Road

If there is no blank after Robert then I'd guess that it's Dennis despite being 'out of order'. Arthur shouldn't be blanked but as we know that doesn't mean he isn't. Apologies the blank must be Robert. I read it in a hurry as multitasking this mornng o_O
birminghamhistory.co.uk

And this would be my best guess for each but with names like Jones and Williams I wouldn't be totally confident...

David Owen - Mar qtr 1896 Bangor
William - Mar qtr 1898 Carnarvon
Jane - Jun qtr 1901 Carnarvon
Idwal - Jun qtr 1903 Merthyr Tydfil
Arfon - Sep qtr 1910 Merthyr Tydfil
 
You need to be careful with Idwal as there is another reg in Carnarvon also with mmn Williams.
Similarly there is a David reg in 1896 in Carnarvon

As MWS says - he has put the best guess but it is very difficult to be sure.
 
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Can I ask what your reason for buying it is? Is it to find out some information or do you just want it (nothing wrong with that in itself)?

For me the only 2 certificates I would consider would be William's birth certificate and his parent's marriage, and only if they didn't help with further research would I move on to others. And even then I might consider William's too uncertain.
 
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