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Birmingham Steam Buses 1824-1910.
Aidan
master brummie
Any last minute entries for the colouring competition? So far I have three "outrageous" entries and no "historical" ones. Not much to go on really. I'll give it another 24 hours and then --- judgement day![/SIZE][/FONT]
The terror of st albans mops his manly brow, casts his eyes upwards (resists the urge to say hullo clouds, hullo sky) and forecasts the winner of the comp, sadly not the gorila of 3B but such is life, chiz.
Thylacine
master brummie
Saracens Head.
The curiously named "Saracens Head" at Kings Norton (pictured with the Tangye steamer in Aidan's post #23) must be one of the oldest surviving Birmingham buidlings, apparently dating to the 15th century (parts of it anyway). The buidling is much photographed, but I can't find a detailed account of its history. Can anyone help?
The curiously named "Saracens Head" at Kings Norton (pictured with the Tangye steamer in Aidan's post #23) must be one of the oldest surviving Birmingham buidlings, apparently dating to the 15th century (parts of it anyway). The buidling is much photographed, but I can't find a detailed account of its history. Can anyone help?
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Thylacine
master brummie
Lloyd, thanks to your tip, I've discovered that I already have MS Office Picture Manager (being a fully paid-up member of the MS Office community). Good heavens, I was once (1973-1995) a professional computer scientist, but now I don't even know what software I have on my PC!
Thylacine
master brummie
Here is a bookseller's advertisement for:
Richard E Huss. Dr Church's "Hoax": An Assessment of Dr William Church's Typographical Inventions in Which is Enunciated Church's Law. Lancaster, Philadelphia: Graphic Crafts, 1976.
The ad includes the following quotation from the book (my emphasis):
"Every new mechanical device or method must have a beginning and an inventor. This monograph is concerned with a man and a subject that have received inadequate treatment in the annals of printing history. On 21 March 1822, application was made for a British patent that when enrolled on 21 September 1822 startled the English-speaking world of print by describing an astounding invention which combined three machines in one system. It scared the hand compositors, and its impact was so startling in that year 1822 that printers declared it was impossibility. The inventor was an American Dr William Church (1799 - 1863) native of Vershire, Vermont, who had trained in New England for the medical profession, but abandoned his practice to follow mechanical engineering."
The birth year for Church given here is in conflict with that in his Wikipedia biography (c 1778). It is given elsewhere as 1779. But Vershire, Vermont, is a long way from Washington or Worthington, Massachusetts (posts #82-83). And I wonder what "Church's Law" was.
Richard E Huss. Dr Church's "Hoax": An Assessment of Dr William Church's Typographical Inventions in Which is Enunciated Church's Law. Lancaster, Philadelphia: Graphic Crafts, 1976.
The ad includes the following quotation from the book (my emphasis):
"Every new mechanical device or method must have a beginning and an inventor. This monograph is concerned with a man and a subject that have received inadequate treatment in the annals of printing history. On 21 March 1822, application was made for a British patent that when enrolled on 21 September 1822 startled the English-speaking world of print by describing an astounding invention which combined three machines in one system. It scared the hand compositors, and its impact was so startling in that year 1822 that printers declared it was impossibility. The inventor was an American Dr William Church (1799 - 1863) native of Vershire, Vermont, who had trained in New England for the medical profession, but abandoned his practice to follow mechanical engineering."
The birth year for Church given here is in conflict with that in his Wikipedia biography (c 1778). It is given elsewhere as 1779. But Vershire, Vermont, is a long way from Washington or Worthington, Massachusetts (posts #82-83). And I wonder what "Church's Law" was.
Thylacine
master brummie
So the 1852 "Tangye" steamer of was not built at Tangye's Cornwall Works (ex-Rabone Hall, ex-Smethwick Hall). And we need not ponder on the distance between Soho and Kings Norton. The question is, where was young Richard Trevithick Tangye living in 1852? Perhaps closer to Kings Norton.
Thylacine
master brummie
Mike, your modesty becomes you, but sometimes you remind me of Stitcher going on about how he's not a bus enthusiast, but ...
Actually, Stitch, where are you? You would be very welcome in this classroom.
Thylacine
master brummie
Lloyd
master brummie
In 1851 census, all the 'Tangye' names are in Cornwall. (No help there! There must be a transcription error I can't yet break into).
In 1861, Joseph Tangye, 34, a Hydraulic Machinist, is in Alston St, Ladywood with wife Jane, 30, and daughter Annie Jane, 3 mths; lodger Theodore Candler, 16, a Machinist born Saxlingham, Norfolk; servant Lucy Brooks, 14, b. Birmingham.
Further down the same census page (so nearby) at one of several "no name, no number" houses / streets is Richard Tangye, 26, an 'Engine Maker', wife Caroline, 25, b. London; boarder Edward Ph (Philip?) Bastin, 18, apprentice, b. Redruth, Cornwall; and servant Mary Ann Smith, 17, b. Tamworth, Staffs.
All the male Tangyes are born Illogan, Cornwall, as are Edward Tangye, 28, and George Tangye, 25, both engineers, lodging at 16 Spring Hill, All Saints with Mary Wiggerham and her daughters Harriet and Ellen. Another engineer lodging at the same property is Fritz Simmonds, 32, b. Germany; as is draughtsman Thomas A Weston, 28, b. Shirley, Warwickshire.
In 1861, Joseph Tangye, 34, a Hydraulic Machinist, is in Alston St, Ladywood with wife Jane, 30, and daughter Annie Jane, 3 mths; lodger Theodore Candler, 16, a Machinist born Saxlingham, Norfolk; servant Lucy Brooks, 14, b. Birmingham.
Further down the same census page (so nearby) at one of several "no name, no number" houses / streets is Richard Tangye, 26, an 'Engine Maker', wife Caroline, 25, b. London; boarder Edward Ph (Philip?) Bastin, 18, apprentice, b. Redruth, Cornwall; and servant Mary Ann Smith, 17, b. Tamworth, Staffs.
All the male Tangyes are born Illogan, Cornwall, as are Edward Tangye, 28, and George Tangye, 25, both engineers, lodging at 16 Spring Hill, All Saints with Mary Wiggerham and her daughters Harriet and Ellen. Another engineer lodging at the same property is Fritz Simmonds, 32, b. Germany; as is draughtsman Thomas A Weston, 28, b. Shirley, Warwickshire.
Aidan
master brummie
...The birth year for Church given here is in conflict with that in his Wikipedia biography (c 1778). It is given elsewhere as 1779. But Vershire, Vermont, is a long way from Washington or Worthington, Massachusetts (posts #82-83). And I wonder what "Church's Law" was.
There is still much to learn about Dr William H Church. In fact just about everything from BMD to whether he practically achieved anything apart from blowing up a few railmen on his "Surprise".
The dates & places of birth is my excuse for not finding the census info the first time around. It seems to me that the census's found are most likely to be correct, although not certain. There are many reasons why the info differs - eg he could have lied (what Church? Never!) about his age to reporters to add gravitas, he could have been born in Vershire but moved at early age and grew up in Worthington/Washington MA (only 150 miles S, his college even closer at 22miles S) so gave his POB there. But it would be nice to tie something down about him..
I think the definition of Church's Law is a good subject for the next quiz!
Thylacine
master brummie
Well, Gentlemen, I'll leave things in the capable hands of the day shift. It's 6 pm here now, so I'm going to have my tea [Aussie for "cooked main (evening) meal"]. I'll check back afterwards.
Just a reminder to our many classmates, viewers and fanboys: entries in the "Church" colouring competition will end tomorrow at 8 am (Tassie time). Which gives you about fourteen hours to get busy with your crayons. [Please! :coolcheesy:]
Just a reminder to our many classmates, viewers and fanboys: entries in the "Church" colouring competition will end tomorrow at 8 am (Tassie time). Which gives you about fourteen hours to get busy with your crayons. [Please! :coolcheesy:]
Lloyd
master brummie
Mentioned before, but here in more detail, are the graves of Thomas Scaife and Joseph Rutherford who were the two unfortunate employees of the Birmingham and Gloucester Railway who tragically lost their lives when the boiler on William Church's steam locomotive "Surprise" exploded at Bromsgrove on 10th November 1840.
Re: Saracens Head.
You are half right apparently Thylacine (only one point !). Judging by the entry below for Tangye in the 1862 PO directory, the steamer likely was built at the Cornwall works - just not the same Cornwall works, as the previous factory in Clements st seems to have also been given that name.
The advert in the directory is given below.
I have marked in red on a 1890 map approximately where I think Tangye’s was . I am not sure of the exact position, and think that buildings may have changed between them being there and 1890. The firm seem to have remained there till between 1873 and 1876
mike
You are half right apparently Thylacine (only one point !). Judging by the entry below for Tangye in the 1862 PO directory, the steamer likely was built at the Cornwall works - just not the same Cornwall works, as the previous factory in Clements st seems to have also been given that name.
The advert in the directory is given below.
I have marked in red on a 1890 map approximately where I think Tangye’s was . I am not sure of the exact position, and think that buildings may have changed between them being there and 1890. The firm seem to have remained there till between 1873 and 1876
mike
Aidan
master brummie
Smart Mike - Streetview is all modern but at least red-brick so not quite so offensive on the eye https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=52...=mMxVvdGNJyGpe4ALIKXBng&cbp=12,165.21,,0,6.82
Do I get an extra point for noticing that the top of current Sand Pits is still called Parade and is shown top right of Mike's map
Do I get an extra point for noticing that the top of current Sand Pits is still called Parade and is shown top right of Mike's map
Lloyd
master brummie
Yes, one extra house point to you Aidan. Here in Clement St, the far wall must represent the factory as suggested by mikejee
Aidan
master brummie
I'm on a roll now....
Birth: 24 Nov 1833
Baptised: 29 Dec 1833 https://pilot.familysearch.org/reco...=recordimage&c=fs:1473014&r=r_949226118&pn=p1
1841C: https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&...logan,+Redruth,+Cornwall,+United+Kingdom&z=12
1851C: Apprentice teacher at the Quaker "Boys and Girls School" Sidcot, as a young man. His siblings and other relatives also attended
Married: 24 Jan 1859 to Caroline Jesper in Birmingham
1861C: https://forum.birminghamhistory.co.uk/showthread.php?t=31888&p=326094#post326094
1871C: Gower House, St Mary, Ealing, Middlesex - Engineer employing 800 men
1881C: Gilbertstone, Coventry Rd, Solihull - Magistrate & Mechanical Engineer Employing 14 Hundred Persons
1891C: ?
Knighted: 1894
1901C: Sir Richard Tangye, Kingston Surrey
Telephone: P.O.Kingston 326 (of Coombe Bank)
Death: 14 Oct 1906 in Kingston
British and Irish Biographies 34.001 (1900) Men of Note (In Finance & Commerce)
TANGYE, Sir Richard, J.P. (Cornwall and Warwickshire); F.R.G.S. Born at Cornwall 24 Nov 1833. Educated at Sidcot school, Somersetshire.
Chairman of Tangyes Ltd., engineers of London and Birmingham. Member of the City Liberal and National Liberal Clubs. Business address:
Cornwall Works, Birmingham. Residences: Coombe Ridge, Kingstone-on-Thames; Glendorgal, New Quay, Cornwall.
The London Gazette 24 Jan 1862
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership lately subsisting between us the undersigned, William Brunton, Walter Pike, Susan Daniell, Peter
Alfred Renfree, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye, Richard Tangye and George Tangye in the trade or business of Patent Fuse
Makers, at Penhellick Fuse Works, near Truro, Cornwall, and trading under the style or firm of William Brunton and Co., was dissolved by mutual
consent, as and from the 7th day of July 1860, so far as regards the said James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye, Richard Tangye,
and George Tangye.
The London Gazette 31 Aug 1869
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership heretofore subsisting between us, the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye,
Richard Tangye, George Tangye, and Stephen Holman, in the trade or business of Machinery Agents and Manufacturers, at No.10, Laurence
Pountney-lane, in the city of London, trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers, and Holman, was dissolved by mutual consent, as and
from the 1st day of June instant, so far only as regards the said Edward Tangye. All debts due to and owing by the said firm, will be respectively
received and paid by the said James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye, George Tangye, and Stephen Holman, by whom the said
business will in future be carried on...
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership subsisting between us the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye, Richard Tangye and George Tangye, in the trade or business of Engineers, at Birmingham, in the county of Warwick, and at Smethwick, in the county of
Stafford, trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers, was dissolved by mutual consent, as and from the 1st day of June instant, so far only
as regards the said Edward Tangye. All debts due to and owing by the said firm will be respectively received and paid by the said James Tangye,
Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye, and George Tangye, by whom the said business will in future be carried on...
The London Gazette 31 Jan 1873
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership heretofore subsisting between us, the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye,
George Tangye and Stephen Holman, in the trade or business of Engineers, and Machinery Agents, at 10, Lawrence Pountney-lane, in the city of
London, trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers and Holman, was dissolved by mutual consent, as on and from the 31st day of
December last, so far only as regards the said James Tangye and Joseph Tangye. All debts due to and owing by the said firm, will be respectively
received and paid by the said Richard Tangye, George Tangye, and Stephen Holman, by whom the said business will in future be carried on...
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership heretofore subsisting between us, the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye,
and George Tangye, in the trade or business of Engineers, at Birmingham, in the county of Warwick, and at Smethwick, in the county of Stafford,
trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers, and in the trade or business of Engineers and Machinery Agents, at Newcastle-upon-Tyne, in
the county of Northumberland, under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers and Rake, was dissolved by mutual consent, as on, and from the 31st
day of December last, so far only as regards the said James Tangye and Joseph Tangye. All debts due and owing by the said respective firms will
be respectively received and paid by the said Richard Tangye and George Tangye, by whom the said business in future will be carried on...
The Times 7 Sep 1879 Partnerships dissolved
Tangye Brothers and Steel, Newport, Monmouthshire and Swansea, engineers; as far as regards R. and G. Tangye
The Times 7 Jul 1880 Proposed Art Gallery at Birmingham
The Mayor of Birmingham (Alderman Richard Chamberlain) read to the Town Council on Monday a communication from Messrs Richard and
George Tangye, the well-known engineers, offering, if the Council will make provision for a permanent art gallery, to contribute a sum of £5,000 for the purchase of specimens of art for exhibition. Should an equal sum be subscribed by other persons, Messrs Tangye offer to give a further sum
of £5,000 for the same purpose. On the motion of the Mayor, seconded by Alderman Collings, M.P., a resolution was adopted thanking Messrs
Tangye for their generous offer, and expressing the desire of the Council to comply with the conditionsl and the General Purposes Committee
were instructed to confer with the Free Libraries Committee and report on the subject.
The Times 15 Oct 1906 Obituary
We regret to announce the death of Sir Richard Tangye, which occurred yesterday afternoon at his residence, Coombe-bank, Kingston-hill. He
had been ill for some time. Latterly there had been signs of improvement, but he had a relapse on Friday. The career of Sir Richard Tangye forms
an interesting chapter in the romance of industry. His father had started life as a Cornish miner, and afterwards became a small shopkeeper and
farmer. The grandfather on the mother's side was an agricultural labourer, possessed a few acres of common land, and belonged to a family of
which for generations one branch had earned their living as smiths. Richard Tangye himself was born on November 24, 1833, at Broad-lane, in
the parish of Illogan, Cornwall, and received his early training at the British school there, with no other immediate prospect before him than that of
earning a living through some form of manual labour. But when he was nine years old he broke his right arm in such a way that the doctor
predicted he would never be able to use it for hard work; and so the boy had two or three years at a better school in Redruth, and, after that, the
father being a Quaker, a year's good training at the Friends' School at Sidcot. His aspirations were for a commercial life, and though, much against
his will, he consented to become a schoolmaster, he abandoned that career at the age of 18. At the end of 1852 Richard Tangye took a situation
as clerk at £50 a year in a small engineering establishment in Birmingham owned by Mr Thomas Worsdall, whose father had made the first railway
"coaches" for the London and North-Western Railway Company. Soon afterwards he induced his younger brother, George, to join him in the same
office as junior clerk, and then, after about three years' experience of Birmingham life, he wrote to his brothers James and Joseph that their
mechanical and engineering skill would have more scope in Birmingham than in Cornwall, and that they had better come there as well. They took
his advice, and James became foreman in the same works as Richard was engaged at, while Joseph started operations with a lathe which he and
James had made at home, and had brought with them to Birmingham. Six months or so later Richard left his employer, and, although having no
capital, started as a commission agent in the joint interests of the brotherhood. Then it occurred to him that, instead of simply buying tools, &c., on
behalf of Cornish friends, it would be better to start manufacturing them on a small scale, Joseph being an exceptionally expert maker of such
things. They accordingly engaged, at a rental of 4s a week, a portion of a manufacturer's packing room, into which a revolving shaft projected, and
here Joseph set up his lathe, while Richard partitioned off for himself an "office" 4ft square, by means of sheets of brown paper stretched upon a
wooden framing. The experiment answered so well that before long the brothers James and George also left Mr Worsdall, and the four resolved to
start together on their own account. They took a larger workshop at a rental of 10s a week, they bought an old engine and boiler so as to have
their own motive power, and they were even so bold as to take on a workman, though they were cautious enough to warn him at the outset that
they could not guarantee him employment for more than three months. Thus a formal start had been made with Tangye Brothers, and before long
they had an "order" which laid the foundation of their future fortunes. The brothers James and Joseph, after thoroughly learning in Cornwall the
business of wheelwright and shoeing-smith respectively, had taken engagements with Mr Brunton, who was then engineer to the West Cornwall
Railway, under Mr Brunel; and a hydraulic press they had made for covering safety fuse with guttapercha brought them under the notice of that
famous engineer himself. In 1856 Mr Brunel was in want of some powerful alliances to help in the launching of the Great Eastern, and, hearing
that Joseph Tangye had invented a new hydraulic lifting jack, he sent his agent to the modest workshop in Birmingham, with the result that Tangye
Brothers supplied the jacks that set the vessel afloat, and enabled Richard Tangye to say in after years, "We launced the Great Eastern and she
launched us." Another stroke of good fortune was their perfecting and taking over from the inventor, Mr J. A. Weston, the manufacture of his
differential pulley blocks; though when they subsequently bought the patent rights they found themselves involved in legal proceedings which
extended over a year and cost some thousands of pounds. In 1859 the business was removed to new premises, in Clement-street, Birmingham,
which were then regarded as large enough to meet all possible requirements for the future, while Richard felt, at last, so far settled that he
married, his bride being Miss Caroline Jesper. But within the course of the next few years the business had assumed such dimensions that there
had to be a further remove, and this time so much land was wanted that the brothers went to Soho, three miles from Birmingham, to find it. They
took over at first three acres of ground for workshops and offices, but more and more extensions became necessary as the business continued to
grow, so that at last the little workroom at 4s a week, and the single employee taken on with only three months "certain", expanded into a group of
buildings covering 20 acres of ground, and giving employment to about 2,500 persons. The primary causes of this remarkable success are to be
found, no doubt, in the indomitable energy and perseverance, the inventive power and mechanical skill, and the shrewdness and business
capacity of the brothers themselves. There were five of them altogether, the four already mentioned being afterwards joined by a fifth, Edward,
who had emigrated to America; and each had his own position according to his individual talents, until advancing years led to the retirement of one
after the other. Tangye Brothers was converted into a limited liability company in 1881. The firm were most generous in the "institutions" they
organized in the form of educational classes, benefit funds, &c., in the interests of their workpeople, to whom they gave the "nine hours" unasked,
and with whom they remained on the most friendly terms. Elected to the Birmingham Town Council in 1878 and again in 1881, Mr Tangye became
deeply interested in the educational work then being carried on by that body in connexion with the Free Library and other institutions; and in 1880
his firm offered the council a sum of £10,000 for the provision of a municipal art gallery - an offer which was duly accepted. In 1881 they followed
up this gift with another £10,000 (subsequently increased to £11,000) towards the erection of a school of art for the city. The Art Gallery, when
completed, was enriched for a number of years by a valuable collection of Wedgwood ware, lent by Mr Tangye. In 1894 the honour of knighthood
was conferred upon him. A Liberal in politics, Sir Richard Tangye was able to recall the fact that he had taken part in every election except one,
when he was on his way back from Australia, in which Mr John Bright was returned for Birmingham. He had himself been several times asked to
stand as a candidate for Parliament, one or two of these invitations coming to him from Cornish constituencies. But he always declined the honour; and from the time of the Home Rule split - when, as a pronounced Gladstonian, he found himself out of touch with the prevailing sentiment in
Birmingham - he took a less active interest in the politics of the day. In the fiscal controversy he remained a strong free-trader. Sir Richard had
paid seven visits to Australasia. To New Zealand he went twice - one in 1886 and again in 1904. In addition to the interest he took in Wedgwood
ware, he was an eager collector for a period of over 20 years of rare books, pictures and personal relics of Oliver Cromwell and his times. The
considerable collection thus brought together by him included 18 letters written by Cromwell, the Protector's Bible (with autograph) and watch, and
various miniatures and rare medals. Sir Richard published "The Two Protectors, Oliver and Richard Cromwell," a book which gave many original
facts the indefatigable author had succeeded in getting together. In 1905 he brought out a "new and revised edition" (representing the 20th
thousand) of a little work entitled "The Rise of a Great Industry" (previously "One and All"), in which he told the story of his life. Sir Richard Tangye
continued to reside in Birmingham until about 1894, when he removed to Kingston-on-Thames. He remained chairman of the company, though
allowing the control of working details to pass into younger hands. A man of strong sympathies and most kindly temperament, ever ready to do his
best to promote the welfare of those around him, he was regarded with deep and universal esteem by all who were in any way associated with
Cornwall Works; and he leaves behind him traditions which should exercise a lasting beneficent influence.
Debretts Peerage-Knightage (1906) p892
TANGYE, Sir Richard, son of Joseph Tangye, Esq., of Illogan, Cornwall, b 1833; ed. at Friends' Sch, Sidcot; is an Engineer, a J.P. for Birmingham
and for Warwickshire and Cornwall, a Member of Imperial Institute, a F.R.G.S., and Chm. of Tangyes (Limited), engineers, of Birmingham; author
of "One and All, Reminiscences of Travel in America, Australia and Egypt" and "The Two Protectors, Oliver and Richard Cromwell": m 1859,
Caroline, da. of Thomas Jesper, Esq. of Birmingham; cr. Knt 1894. Coombe Bank, Kingston Hill, Surrey; Glendorgal, Newquay, Cornwall.
Warwickshire Leaders: Social and Political 1906
Sir Richard Tangye, J.P.
When the history of the industrial revolution of the 19th century comes to be written in detail few branches will
receive more attention than the art and science of the most important of all, engineering in its manifold forms.
In the development Birmingham will have its due share, and it will be as impossible to write of Birmingham
without mention of the great firm of Tangye as to play Hamlet and leave out the Prince of Denmark. Born in
the rocky mining parish of Illogan, where Cornwall breats the Bristol Channel, on 24th November 1833, the
subject of our sketch has shown much of the rugged endurance typified by his native soil. Its tin and copper
mines, with which he was familiar from boyhood, may have stimulated his engineering powers, but the abiding
influence of its romance, its church dedicated to the forgotten Cornish saint Illogan, and its Manor House
owned for seven centuries by the Norman family of Basset have left their mark in the devotion to art and to
history which Sir Richard and his brothers have consistently exhibited through many years. Educated at
Sidcot School, Somersetshire, Mr Tangye came to Birmingham late in 1852, and by his boundless energy,
foresight, and knowledge of men, by degrees built up a vast engineering concern with ramifications extending
to all parts of the globe, its best known branches being in London, Sydney and Johannesburg. Mr Tangye
married in 1859 Caroline, daughter of Thomas Jesper, Esq., a prominent townsman, and it is to the sympathy
and help of his wife that he attributes much of his success. Lady Tangye is the most charming of hostesses at
their beautiful Cornish home, Glendorgal, New Quay, as well as at their Surrey Mansion, Coombe Bank,
Kingston Hill. Both heredity and environment combined with his strenous personality to produce in Sir Richard
Tangye (to antedate the knighthood with which on the nomination of Lord Rosebery he was honoured in 1894) a robust Liberalism, which has led
him to give active support to the party in Birmingham, though the demands of business life have prevented him from seeking entrance to
Parliament. Sir Richard is a man of high culture with artistic and literary tastes, and is an author of repute, having published "Reminiscences of
Travel in Australia, America and Egypt" and also an able account of the great firm of which he is the founder. His magnum opus, however, has
been his book "The Two Protectors", published in 1899, which is the standard work on the careers of the great Protector and his son and
successor, Richard Cromwell. This work, which unites the fire of personal enthusiasm with the scientific precision of the historian, was the fruit of a
unique collection of MSS., books, coins, medals, and prints relating to the Commonwealth formed by Sir Richard and still accumulating, thus
illustrating Milton's lines -
"till old experience do attain
To something of prophetic strain"
Sir Richard Tangye, with his brother Mr George Tangye, founded the Birmingham Art Gallery and Municipal School of Art, which have been of
great assistance in developing a higher degree of taste in the minds of the citizens of Birmingham. The School of Art numbers its students by
thousands, large numbers of whom have there received a training which has fitted them to fill the important positions in life. Sir Richard and Lady
Tangye have five sons and daughters, the eldest, Mr Harold Lincoln Tangye, an engineer, journalist, and author of repute, being married to a
daughter of Sir Hugh Gilzean-Reid.
Birth: 24 Nov 1833
Baptised: 29 Dec 1833 https://pilot.familysearch.org/reco...=recordimage&c=fs:1473014&r=r_949226118&pn=p1
1841C: https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&...logan,+Redruth,+Cornwall,+United+Kingdom&z=12
1851C: Apprentice teacher at the Quaker "Boys and Girls School" Sidcot, as a young man. His siblings and other relatives also attended
Married: 24 Jan 1859 to Caroline Jesper in Birmingham
1861C: https://forum.birminghamhistory.co.uk/showthread.php?t=31888&p=326094#post326094
1871C: Gower House, St Mary, Ealing, Middlesex - Engineer employing 800 men
1881C: Gilbertstone, Coventry Rd, Solihull - Magistrate & Mechanical Engineer Employing 14 Hundred Persons
1891C: ?
Knighted: 1894
1901C: Sir Richard Tangye, Kingston Surrey
Telephone: P.O.Kingston 326 (of Coombe Bank)
Death: 14 Oct 1906 in Kingston
British and Irish Biographies 34.001 (1900) Men of Note (In Finance & Commerce)
TANGYE, Sir Richard, J.P. (Cornwall and Warwickshire); F.R.G.S. Born at Cornwall 24 Nov 1833. Educated at Sidcot school, Somersetshire.
Chairman of Tangyes Ltd., engineers of London and Birmingham. Member of the City Liberal and National Liberal Clubs. Business address:
Cornwall Works, Birmingham. Residences: Coombe Ridge, Kingstone-on-Thames; Glendorgal, New Quay, Cornwall.
The London Gazette 24 Jan 1862
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership lately subsisting between us the undersigned, William Brunton, Walter Pike, Susan Daniell, Peter
Alfred Renfree, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye, Richard Tangye and George Tangye in the trade or business of Patent Fuse
Makers, at Penhellick Fuse Works, near Truro, Cornwall, and trading under the style or firm of William Brunton and Co., was dissolved by mutual
consent, as and from the 7th day of July 1860, so far as regards the said James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye, Richard Tangye,
and George Tangye.
The London Gazette 31 Aug 1869
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership heretofore subsisting between us, the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye,
Richard Tangye, George Tangye, and Stephen Holman, in the trade or business of Machinery Agents and Manufacturers, at No.10, Laurence
Pountney-lane, in the city of London, trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers, and Holman, was dissolved by mutual consent, as and
from the 1st day of June instant, so far only as regards the said Edward Tangye. All debts due to and owing by the said firm, will be respectively
received and paid by the said James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye, George Tangye, and Stephen Holman, by whom the said
business will in future be carried on...
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership subsisting between us the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Edward Tangye, Richard Tangye and George Tangye, in the trade or business of Engineers, at Birmingham, in the county of Warwick, and at Smethwick, in the county of
Stafford, trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers, was dissolved by mutual consent, as and from the 1st day of June instant, so far only
as regards the said Edward Tangye. All debts due to and owing by the said firm will be respectively received and paid by the said James Tangye,
Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye, and George Tangye, by whom the said business will in future be carried on...
The London Gazette 31 Jan 1873
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership heretofore subsisting between us, the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye,
George Tangye and Stephen Holman, in the trade or business of Engineers, and Machinery Agents, at 10, Lawrence Pountney-lane, in the city of
London, trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers and Holman, was dissolved by mutual consent, as on and from the 31st day of
December last, so far only as regards the said James Tangye and Joseph Tangye. All debts due to and owing by the said firm, will be respectively
received and paid by the said Richard Tangye, George Tangye, and Stephen Holman, by whom the said business will in future be carried on...
Notice is hereby given, that the Partnership heretofore subsisting between us, the undersigned, James Tangye, Joseph Tangye, Richard Tangye,
and George Tangye, in the trade or business of Engineers, at Birmingham, in the county of Warwick, and at Smethwick, in the county of Stafford,
trading under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers, and in the trade or business of Engineers and Machinery Agents, at Newcastle-upon-Tyne, in
the county of Northumberland, under the style or firm of Tangye Brothers and Rake, was dissolved by mutual consent, as on, and from the 31st
day of December last, so far only as regards the said James Tangye and Joseph Tangye. All debts due and owing by the said respective firms will
be respectively received and paid by the said Richard Tangye and George Tangye, by whom the said business in future will be carried on...
The Times 7 Sep 1879 Partnerships dissolved
Tangye Brothers and Steel, Newport, Monmouthshire and Swansea, engineers; as far as regards R. and G. Tangye
The Times 7 Jul 1880 Proposed Art Gallery at Birmingham
The Mayor of Birmingham (Alderman Richard Chamberlain) read to the Town Council on Monday a communication from Messrs Richard and
George Tangye, the well-known engineers, offering, if the Council will make provision for a permanent art gallery, to contribute a sum of £5,000 for the purchase of specimens of art for exhibition. Should an equal sum be subscribed by other persons, Messrs Tangye offer to give a further sum
of £5,000 for the same purpose. On the motion of the Mayor, seconded by Alderman Collings, M.P., a resolution was adopted thanking Messrs
Tangye for their generous offer, and expressing the desire of the Council to comply with the conditionsl and the General Purposes Committee
were instructed to confer with the Free Libraries Committee and report on the subject.
The Times 15 Oct 1906 Obituary
We regret to announce the death of Sir Richard Tangye, which occurred yesterday afternoon at his residence, Coombe-bank, Kingston-hill. He
had been ill for some time. Latterly there had been signs of improvement, but he had a relapse on Friday. The career of Sir Richard Tangye forms
an interesting chapter in the romance of industry. His father had started life as a Cornish miner, and afterwards became a small shopkeeper and
farmer. The grandfather on the mother's side was an agricultural labourer, possessed a few acres of common land, and belonged to a family of
which for generations one branch had earned their living as smiths. Richard Tangye himself was born on November 24, 1833, at Broad-lane, in
the parish of Illogan, Cornwall, and received his early training at the British school there, with no other immediate prospect before him than that of
earning a living through some form of manual labour. But when he was nine years old he broke his right arm in such a way that the doctor
predicted he would never be able to use it for hard work; and so the boy had two or three years at a better school in Redruth, and, after that, the
father being a Quaker, a year's good training at the Friends' School at Sidcot. His aspirations were for a commercial life, and though, much against
his will, he consented to become a schoolmaster, he abandoned that career at the age of 18. At the end of 1852 Richard Tangye took a situation
as clerk at £50 a year in a small engineering establishment in Birmingham owned by Mr Thomas Worsdall, whose father had made the first railway
"coaches" for the London and North-Western Railway Company. Soon afterwards he induced his younger brother, George, to join him in the same
office as junior clerk, and then, after about three years' experience of Birmingham life, he wrote to his brothers James and Joseph that their
mechanical and engineering skill would have more scope in Birmingham than in Cornwall, and that they had better come there as well. They took
his advice, and James became foreman in the same works as Richard was engaged at, while Joseph started operations with a lathe which he and
James had made at home, and had brought with them to Birmingham. Six months or so later Richard left his employer, and, although having no
capital, started as a commission agent in the joint interests of the brotherhood. Then it occurred to him that, instead of simply buying tools, &c., on
behalf of Cornish friends, it would be better to start manufacturing them on a small scale, Joseph being an exceptionally expert maker of such
things. They accordingly engaged, at a rental of 4s a week, a portion of a manufacturer's packing room, into which a revolving shaft projected, and
here Joseph set up his lathe, while Richard partitioned off for himself an "office" 4ft square, by means of sheets of brown paper stretched upon a
wooden framing. The experiment answered so well that before long the brothers James and George also left Mr Worsdall, and the four resolved to
start together on their own account. They took a larger workshop at a rental of 10s a week, they bought an old engine and boiler so as to have
their own motive power, and they were even so bold as to take on a workman, though they were cautious enough to warn him at the outset that
they could not guarantee him employment for more than three months. Thus a formal start had been made with Tangye Brothers, and before long
they had an "order" which laid the foundation of their future fortunes. The brothers James and Joseph, after thoroughly learning in Cornwall the
business of wheelwright and shoeing-smith respectively, had taken engagements with Mr Brunton, who was then engineer to the West Cornwall
Railway, under Mr Brunel; and a hydraulic press they had made for covering safety fuse with guttapercha brought them under the notice of that
famous engineer himself. In 1856 Mr Brunel was in want of some powerful alliances to help in the launching of the Great Eastern, and, hearing
that Joseph Tangye had invented a new hydraulic lifting jack, he sent his agent to the modest workshop in Birmingham, with the result that Tangye
Brothers supplied the jacks that set the vessel afloat, and enabled Richard Tangye to say in after years, "We launced the Great Eastern and she
launched us." Another stroke of good fortune was their perfecting and taking over from the inventor, Mr J. A. Weston, the manufacture of his
differential pulley blocks; though when they subsequently bought the patent rights they found themselves involved in legal proceedings which
extended over a year and cost some thousands of pounds. In 1859 the business was removed to new premises, in Clement-street, Birmingham,
which were then regarded as large enough to meet all possible requirements for the future, while Richard felt, at last, so far settled that he
married, his bride being Miss Caroline Jesper. But within the course of the next few years the business had assumed such dimensions that there
had to be a further remove, and this time so much land was wanted that the brothers went to Soho, three miles from Birmingham, to find it. They
took over at first three acres of ground for workshops and offices, but more and more extensions became necessary as the business continued to
grow, so that at last the little workroom at 4s a week, and the single employee taken on with only three months "certain", expanded into a group of
buildings covering 20 acres of ground, and giving employment to about 2,500 persons. The primary causes of this remarkable success are to be
found, no doubt, in the indomitable energy and perseverance, the inventive power and mechanical skill, and the shrewdness and business
capacity of the brothers themselves. There were five of them altogether, the four already mentioned being afterwards joined by a fifth, Edward,
who had emigrated to America; and each had his own position according to his individual talents, until advancing years led to the retirement of one
after the other. Tangye Brothers was converted into a limited liability company in 1881. The firm were most generous in the "institutions" they
organized in the form of educational classes, benefit funds, &c., in the interests of their workpeople, to whom they gave the "nine hours" unasked,
and with whom they remained on the most friendly terms. Elected to the Birmingham Town Council in 1878 and again in 1881, Mr Tangye became
deeply interested in the educational work then being carried on by that body in connexion with the Free Library and other institutions; and in 1880
his firm offered the council a sum of £10,000 for the provision of a municipal art gallery - an offer which was duly accepted. In 1881 they followed
up this gift with another £10,000 (subsequently increased to £11,000) towards the erection of a school of art for the city. The Art Gallery, when
completed, was enriched for a number of years by a valuable collection of Wedgwood ware, lent by Mr Tangye. In 1894 the honour of knighthood
was conferred upon him. A Liberal in politics, Sir Richard Tangye was able to recall the fact that he had taken part in every election except one,
when he was on his way back from Australia, in which Mr John Bright was returned for Birmingham. He had himself been several times asked to
stand as a candidate for Parliament, one or two of these invitations coming to him from Cornish constituencies. But he always declined the honour; and from the time of the Home Rule split - when, as a pronounced Gladstonian, he found himself out of touch with the prevailing sentiment in
Birmingham - he took a less active interest in the politics of the day. In the fiscal controversy he remained a strong free-trader. Sir Richard had
paid seven visits to Australasia. To New Zealand he went twice - one in 1886 and again in 1904. In addition to the interest he took in Wedgwood
ware, he was an eager collector for a period of over 20 years of rare books, pictures and personal relics of Oliver Cromwell and his times. The
considerable collection thus brought together by him included 18 letters written by Cromwell, the Protector's Bible (with autograph) and watch, and
various miniatures and rare medals. Sir Richard published "The Two Protectors, Oliver and Richard Cromwell," a book which gave many original
facts the indefatigable author had succeeded in getting together. In 1905 he brought out a "new and revised edition" (representing the 20th
thousand) of a little work entitled "The Rise of a Great Industry" (previously "One and All"), in which he told the story of his life. Sir Richard Tangye
continued to reside in Birmingham until about 1894, when he removed to Kingston-on-Thames. He remained chairman of the company, though
allowing the control of working details to pass into younger hands. A man of strong sympathies and most kindly temperament, ever ready to do his
best to promote the welfare of those around him, he was regarded with deep and universal esteem by all who were in any way associated with
Cornwall Works; and he leaves behind him traditions which should exercise a lasting beneficent influence.
Debretts Peerage-Knightage (1906) p892
TANGYE, Sir Richard, son of Joseph Tangye, Esq., of Illogan, Cornwall, b 1833; ed. at Friends' Sch, Sidcot; is an Engineer, a J.P. for Birmingham
and for Warwickshire and Cornwall, a Member of Imperial Institute, a F.R.G.S., and Chm. of Tangyes (Limited), engineers, of Birmingham; author
of "One and All, Reminiscences of Travel in America, Australia and Egypt" and "The Two Protectors, Oliver and Richard Cromwell": m 1859,
Caroline, da. of Thomas Jesper, Esq. of Birmingham; cr. Knt 1894. Coombe Bank, Kingston Hill, Surrey; Glendorgal, Newquay, Cornwall.
Warwickshire Leaders: Social and Political 1906
Sir Richard Tangye, J.P.
When the history of the industrial revolution of the 19th century comes to be written in detail few branches will
receive more attention than the art and science of the most important of all, engineering in its manifold forms.
In the development Birmingham will have its due share, and it will be as impossible to write of Birmingham
without mention of the great firm of Tangye as to play Hamlet and leave out the Prince of Denmark. Born in
the rocky mining parish of Illogan, where Cornwall breats the Bristol Channel, on 24th November 1833, the
subject of our sketch has shown much of the rugged endurance typified by his native soil. Its tin and copper
mines, with which he was familiar from boyhood, may have stimulated his engineering powers, but the abiding
influence of its romance, its church dedicated to the forgotten Cornish saint Illogan, and its Manor House
owned for seven centuries by the Norman family of Basset have left their mark in the devotion to art and to
history which Sir Richard and his brothers have consistently exhibited through many years. Educated at
Sidcot School, Somersetshire, Mr Tangye came to Birmingham late in 1852, and by his boundless energy,
foresight, and knowledge of men, by degrees built up a vast engineering concern with ramifications extending
to all parts of the globe, its best known branches being in London, Sydney and Johannesburg. Mr Tangye
married in 1859 Caroline, daughter of Thomas Jesper, Esq., a prominent townsman, and it is to the sympathy
and help of his wife that he attributes much of his success. Lady Tangye is the most charming of hostesses at
their beautiful Cornish home, Glendorgal, New Quay, as well as at their Surrey Mansion, Coombe Bank,
Kingston Hill. Both heredity and environment combined with his strenous personality to produce in Sir Richard
Tangye (to antedate the knighthood with which on the nomination of Lord Rosebery he was honoured in 1894) a robust Liberalism, which has led
him to give active support to the party in Birmingham, though the demands of business life have prevented him from seeking entrance to
Parliament. Sir Richard is a man of high culture with artistic and literary tastes, and is an author of repute, having published "Reminiscences of
Travel in Australia, America and Egypt" and also an able account of the great firm of which he is the founder. His magnum opus, however, has
been his book "The Two Protectors", published in 1899, which is the standard work on the careers of the great Protector and his son and
successor, Richard Cromwell. This work, which unites the fire of personal enthusiasm with the scientific precision of the historian, was the fruit of a
unique collection of MSS., books, coins, medals, and prints relating to the Commonwealth formed by Sir Richard and still accumulating, thus
illustrating Milton's lines -
"till old experience do attain
To something of prophetic strain"
Sir Richard Tangye, with his brother Mr George Tangye, founded the Birmingham Art Gallery and Municipal School of Art, which have been of
great assistance in developing a higher degree of taste in the minds of the citizens of Birmingham. The School of Art numbers its students by
thousands, large numbers of whom have there received a training which has fitted them to fill the important positions in life. Sir Richard and Lady
Tangye have five sons and daughters, the eldest, Mr Harold Lincoln Tangye, an engineer, journalist, and author of repute, being married to a
daughter of Sir Hugh Gilzean-Reid.
Thylacine
master brummie
What wonderful Tangye developments! Thanks, gents, you've all done very well (as Old Mr Grace would say in a quavering voice) :grinsmile:.
If Richard Tangye moved to Brum in late 1852, he must have been developing his steam carriage in Cornwall, n'est-ce-pas? Are we any closer to answering the question "Why Kings Norton"?
Well it's past my bedtime, so good-night all. Eight hours to go in the colouring comp and still only three entries! :crying:
If Richard Tangye moved to Brum in late 1852, he must have been developing his steam carriage in Cornwall, n'est-ce-pas? Are we any closer to answering the question "Why Kings Norton"?
Well it's past my bedtime, so good-night all. Eight hours to go in the colouring comp and still only three entries! :crying:
Aidan
master brummie
I'm not sure about that 1852 date at all, especially as the original quote says "about"
From the info in The Times Obit, Richard moves from the school to B/ham at the end of 1852 and George followed later. Did he drive there via Kings Norton? It seem more likely that they developed their skills with Mr Thomas Worsdall perhaps still involved with the London and North-Western Railway Company over the three years and either developed it during that time or when James and Joseph join them at that point. So poss 1853-1856 or 1856-1861 (Other brothers join - the intro of the draconian laws). The move to Clement St/Parade in 1859 would I think be the favourite.
From the info in The Times Obit, Richard moves from the school to B/ham at the end of 1852 and George followed later. Did he drive there via Kings Norton? It seem more likely that they developed their skills with Mr Thomas Worsdall perhaps still involved with the London and North-Western Railway Company over the three years and either developed it during that time or when James and Joseph join them at that point. So poss 1853-1856 or 1856-1861 (Other brothers join - the intro of the draconian laws). The move to Clement St/Parade in 1859 would I think be the favourite.
Going back before 1852 the following entries are for Tangye:
1858
Tangye Jas, engineer and machinist; home ,9 Terrace, Summer Hill
Tangye James and Brothers, engineers and machinists, manufacturers of hydraulic
and other lifting jacks, 40, Mount street,Newhall st
Tangye Joseph, engineer and machinist; home. 59 Terrace, Summer hill
Tangye Richard, engineer ancl machinist home 59 Terrace, Summer hill
(Mount St is now part of Newhall St up the north end.)
Going back to 1855, however, there is no sign of any Tangye in Birmingham, at least in the directories
Mike
1858
Tangye Jas, engineer and machinist; home ,9 Terrace, Summer Hill
Tangye James and Brothers, engineers and machinists, manufacturers of hydraulic
and other lifting jacks, 40, Mount street,Newhall st
Tangye Joseph, engineer and machinist; home. 59 Terrace, Summer hill
Tangye Richard, engineer ancl machinist home 59 Terrace, Summer hill
(Mount St is now part of Newhall St up the north end.)
Going back to 1855, however, there is no sign of any Tangye in Birmingham, at least in the directories
Mike
Thylacine
master brummie
Tangye Steamer "Cornubia" 1862 not 1852!
Burning the midnight oil here, but was mystified by the Tangye 1852 date in the light of recent findings. Aidan, I think you're right - it should be 1862. See Richard Tangye's autobiography One and All (1869) at Grace's Guide. Quotation from Chapter 6:
Burning the midnight oil here, but was mystified by the Tangye 1852 date in the light of recent findings. Aidan, I think you're right - it should be 1862. See Richard Tangye's autobiography One and All (1869) at Grace's Guide. Quotation from Chapter 6:
About 1862 the subject of providing "feeders" in country places for the main lines of railway came again into prominence. Branch lines had been proved to be unremunerative from their great cost in construction; and amongst other systems proposed, was that of light, quick-speed locomotives for carrying passengers, and traction engines for the conveyance of heavy produce and other goods. We determined to construct a locomotive of the former class, and succeeded in making a very successful example, with which we travelled many hundreds of miles. The fire-box was made of copper, and there were nearly 100 metal tubes in the boiler, enabling us to get up steam from cold water in a very few minutes. The total weight of the locomotive was 27 cwt., the machinery being simple and very compact, and the whole occupying no more space than an ordinary phaeton, and capable of carrying ten persons. The greatest speed we attained was over twenty miles an hour, the engine being easily managed and under perfect control.
Great interest was manifested in our experiment, and it soon became evident that there was an opening for a considerable business in these engines, and we made our preparation accordingly, but the "wisdom" of Parliament made it impossible. The squires became alarmed lest their horses should take fright; and although a judge ruled that a horse that would not stand the sight or sound of a locomotive, in these days of steam, constituted a public danger, and that its owner should be punished and not the owner of the locomotive, an Act was passed providing that no locomotive should travel more than four miles an hour on the public roads, and that they should all be preceded by a man carrying a red flag. Thus was the trade of quick speed road locomotives strangled in its cradle, and the inhabitants of country districts left unprovided with improved facilities for travelling, while without doubt more horses have been frightened by the red flag than would have been by the locomotives.
[Now I'm off to Bedfordshire! See you (later) in the morning. :sleepy:]Great interest was manifested in our experiment, and it soon became evident that there was an opening for a considerable business in these engines, and we made our preparation accordingly, but the "wisdom" of Parliament made it impossible. The squires became alarmed lest their horses should take fright; and although a judge ruled that a horse that would not stand the sight or sound of a locomotive, in these days of steam, constituted a public danger, and that its owner should be punished and not the owner of the locomotive, an Act was passed providing that no locomotive should travel more than four miles an hour on the public roads, and that they should all be preceded by a man carrying a red flag. Thus was the trade of quick speed road locomotives strangled in its cradle, and the inhabitants of country districts left unprovided with improved facilities for travelling, while without doubt more horses have been frightened by the red flag than would have been by the locomotives.
S
Seabird
Guest
Can a gurl join the klass?
Thycaline - did you trace the book you were after?
https://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/...&sts=t&tn=Birmingham+Inventors+and+Inventions I find this a good site for out of print books.
I've been following this thread with interest, because there was a print of Dr Church's steam bus in my little domain in the library at the Science Museum in Newhall St. in the 60s. It was the version with the upper deck passengers, and was coloured. That's all I can remember. I wonder where the contents of the library went - Dolman St.?
Didn't William Murdoch 'dabble' with steam powered road vehicles in Cornwall in the late 1700s?
Thycaline - did you trace the book you were after?
https://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/...&sts=t&tn=Birmingham+Inventors+and+Inventions I find this a good site for out of print books.
I've been following this thread with interest, because there was a print of Dr Church's steam bus in my little domain in the library at the Science Museum in Newhall St. in the 60s. It was the version with the upper deck passengers, and was coloured. That's all I can remember. I wonder where the contents of the library went - Dolman St.?
Didn't William Murdoch 'dabble' with steam powered road vehicles in Cornwall in the late 1700s?
motorman-mike
Brum visitor who stayed.
In the other thread that brought us this spin off, we established a Midlands link for Gurneys steam coaches by virtue of Mr Dance and his Gloucester - Cheltenham route. At the risk of staying with Gurney and Dance at this stage in this thread I have managed to find another strong Midlands link that brings us to a name more familiar on buses and coaches in the 1940's and 50's, that of Maudsley. It transpires that in 1833 Goldsworthy Gurney sold his steam carriage interests to a South London company, Maudlsley & Field who at the request of Sir Charles Dance carried out development and considerable improvements to Gurney's final design to produce a prototype M&F steam tractor which Sir Charles used to haul a 16 seat trailer on a regular service from London to Greenwich. In 1840 M&F considered the steam carriage boom to be over and moved to Parkside, Coventry to manufacture tools and factory machinery. In 1903 Maudsley & Field set up the Maudsley Motor Company Limited to manufacture commercial vehicles abeit not steam powered, and eventually ended up in the hands of another road steam pioneering company, Leyland Motors.
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Aidan
master brummie
Seabird - Coo Ur Gosh! gurls are jolly d. They are pritty, super and smashing. Wot would we young chaps do without them at xmas parties, eh? Just hope the postings don't get lost in a welter of SOP and SLUSH, like you get in the films they dare not show us at Skool. 'How beautiful,' sa your mum to your pater. 'If only you could be noble like that ocasionaly.' 'It is only a world of makebelieve,' he repli. 'You must face up to reality.' 'Reality,' sa i, 'is so unspeakably sordid it make me shudder.' i take a bullseye and pater lite his pipe. The matter is closed.
The fact that the Science Museum were displaying a pic of the famous Bus, albeit - ahem - in your office, is surely conclusive? Welcome to the pew of Church believers.
Excellent find Thylacine - 1862 is much more comfortable and in the words of the good man himself - actually a reasonable read that I have only dipped into so far. I attach the version of the pic on Grace's. I believe that the 4 passengers are the four brothers and the central personage sitting back with the beard must be Richard the main man.
The fact that the Science Museum were displaying a pic of the famous Bus, albeit - ahem - in your office, is surely conclusive? Welcome to the pew of Church believers.
Excellent find Thylacine - 1862 is much more comfortable and in the words of the good man himself - actually a reasonable read that I have only dipped into so far. I attach the version of the pic on Grace's. I believe that the 4 passengers are the four brothers and the central personage sitting back with the beard must be Richard the main man.
W
Wendy
Guest
Here's a potted history of the Tangye family some of whom are buried in Key Hill. Last years Birmingham Mayor Mike Wilkes paid to have the memorial re instated. Just thought you may be interested.
The Tangye Brothers
Richard Tangye was the first brother to come to Birmingham from Cornwall in 1852. His first position was a clerk with Thomas Wordsell a small screw and screw jack manufacturer in Brasshouse passage. Within the next three years Richard was joined at Thomas Wordsell by his brothers George, James and Joseph. Richard and Joseph made a lathe at home which enabled Thomas Wordsell to move into hydraulic work which they had not been able to do previously. After this the brothers decided to go it alone, they went into manufacturing the machinery to produce ropes and cords. Unfortunately the company did not do well, and they were almost broke when they had a visit from an agent working for Isambard Kingdom Brunel who was aware the older brothers had invented a hydraulic lifting jack. At this time Brunel was having great problems trying to launch his steam ship The Great Eastern; he thought the jack would be the answer to launching his ship. The Great Eastern was at this time the largest vessel ever built and because of its great length had to be launched broadside. The first attempt was a failure. Brunel tried for three months to launch his ship but to no avail. With the help of the Tangye’s he decided to increase the jacks on each cradle to ten or twelve. The ship was launched at high tide on Sunday January 31 1858. Richard Tangye had no doubt that Brunel’s order for the extra hydraulic jacks started the success of the business run by the Cornish brothers. By the mid 1860’s the brothers had become very prosperous they decided they needed a larger factory. This was built on the borders of Birmingham in Smethwick near to the Soho foundry of Boulton and Watt. The aptly named Cornwall Works in Cornwall Road covered three acres and immediately employed 400 men. As a manufacturer Richard Tangye argued that “it would be disastrous for employers and employed if trade unions ceased to exist,” like his brothers he was keen to provide his workers with a dining hall, care during sickness and accidents and adult education classes. The brothers donated large sums of money for exhibits of art. This was done on the understanding that the city provide an art gallery as this is what the people of Birmingham wanted. They also donated a large sum of money towards the provision of buildings for the school of Art and Design. Joseph Tangye retired in 1873 to Bewdley, he died on May 27 1902. Joseph is buried in K section of the cemetery with his wife Jane. Joseph’s son John worked for many years at Tangye’s and died at the age of 53 in March 1918. He is commemorated on the memorial. It was said John’s early death was a result of the pressure of the war effort. The Tangye’s said “They launched Brunel’s ship and Brunel launched the company”. The brothers with their generosity helped to put Birmingham as a city on the world stage.
The Tangye Brothers
Richard Tangye was the first brother to come to Birmingham from Cornwall in 1852. His first position was a clerk with Thomas Wordsell a small screw and screw jack manufacturer in Brasshouse passage. Within the next three years Richard was joined at Thomas Wordsell by his brothers George, James and Joseph. Richard and Joseph made a lathe at home which enabled Thomas Wordsell to move into hydraulic work which they had not been able to do previously. After this the brothers decided to go it alone, they went into manufacturing the machinery to produce ropes and cords. Unfortunately the company did not do well, and they were almost broke when they had a visit from an agent working for Isambard Kingdom Brunel who was aware the older brothers had invented a hydraulic lifting jack. At this time Brunel was having great problems trying to launch his steam ship The Great Eastern; he thought the jack would be the answer to launching his ship. The Great Eastern was at this time the largest vessel ever built and because of its great length had to be launched broadside. The first attempt was a failure. Brunel tried for three months to launch his ship but to no avail. With the help of the Tangye’s he decided to increase the jacks on each cradle to ten or twelve. The ship was launched at high tide on Sunday January 31 1858. Richard Tangye had no doubt that Brunel’s order for the extra hydraulic jacks started the success of the business run by the Cornish brothers. By the mid 1860’s the brothers had become very prosperous they decided they needed a larger factory. This was built on the borders of Birmingham in Smethwick near to the Soho foundry of Boulton and Watt. The aptly named Cornwall Works in Cornwall Road covered three acres and immediately employed 400 men. As a manufacturer Richard Tangye argued that “it would be disastrous for employers and employed if trade unions ceased to exist,” like his brothers he was keen to provide his workers with a dining hall, care during sickness and accidents and adult education classes. The brothers donated large sums of money for exhibits of art. This was done on the understanding that the city provide an art gallery as this is what the people of Birmingham wanted. They also donated a large sum of money towards the provision of buildings for the school of Art and Design. Joseph Tangye retired in 1873 to Bewdley, he died on May 27 1902. Joseph is buried in K section of the cemetery with his wife Jane. Joseph’s son John worked for many years at Tangye’s and died at the age of 53 in March 1918. He is commemorated on the memorial. It was said John’s early death was a result of the pressure of the war effort. The Tangye’s said “They launched Brunel’s ship and Brunel launched the company”. The brothers with their generosity helped to put Birmingham as a city on the world stage.
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Thylacine
master brummie
Welcome Seabird!
Ahem! May I have your attention? (Settle down Molesworth, and will you please save that "flannel" for the changing rooms. :shh
[Assumes best John Cleese voice.] Right, today I would like to welcome our first female pupil, Seabird, to the class. She comes to us from the Small Heathen Primary School, where she has already established a reputation as a researcher in steam.
Thanks for the contribution, Seabird! I have very fond memories of the Brum Science Museum in the late 1950s and early 1960s. Those huge working stationary steam engines made quite an impression on a small boy, and must have contributed to my passion for mechanical things. Thanks for the tip about out-of-print technical books; I'll check out Prosser's Birmingham Inventors and Inventions to see how much a copy might cost. It should be a worthwhile investment, though I would prefer to find an e-text version, then we can all consult it! The Science Museum endorsement of our dear Dr William H Church (how the heart warms to an embattled loner!) is significant indeed. I wonder where that picture went? It would look lovely hanging in this classroom. And thanks for dropping William Murdoch's name. I believe he made a working model of a steam carriage, but James Watt was very hostile to the idea, and as Murdoch's boss at Boulton and Watt, forbade him from working on it at the factory. Perhaps you can tease out this story and present it here (including pictures of Murdoch and his model). I'm sure your classmates will be only too happy to help you with your homework!
Ahem! May I have your attention? (Settle down Molesworth, and will you please save that "flannel" for the changing rooms. :shh
[Assumes best John Cleese voice.] Right, today I would like to welcome our first female pupil, Seabird, to the class. She comes to us from the Small Heathen Primary School, where she has already established a reputation as a researcher in steam.Thanks for the contribution, Seabird! I have very fond memories of the Brum Science Museum in the late 1950s and early 1960s. Those huge working stationary steam engines made quite an impression on a small boy, and must have contributed to my passion for mechanical things. Thanks for the tip about out-of-print technical books; I'll check out Prosser's Birmingham Inventors and Inventions to see how much a copy might cost. It should be a worthwhile investment, though I would prefer to find an e-text version, then we can all consult it! The Science Museum endorsement of our dear Dr William H Church (how the heart warms to an embattled loner!) is significant indeed. I wonder where that picture went? It would look lovely hanging in this classroom. And thanks for dropping William Murdoch's name. I believe he made a working model of a steam carriage, but James Watt was very hostile to the idea, and as Murdoch's boss at Boulton and Watt, forbade him from working on it at the factory. Perhaps you can tease out this story and present it here (including pictures of Murdoch and his model). I'm sure your classmates will be only too happy to help you with your homework!
Thylacine
master brummie
Welcome Wendy!
And welcome, Wendy, to the BSB classroom. I'm so pleased that our class is becoming co-educational at last. Perhaps it will improve the behaviour of some of our incorrigible larrikins (not mentioning any names, Molesworth).
Thanks for the fascinating Tangye contribution. The Tangyes were certainly eminent Brummies, though "sons of Cornwall" (hence the fleetname "Cornubia" for their steam carriage). Is there a picture of the Tangye memorial at Key Hill?
And welcome, Wendy, to the BSB classroom. I'm so pleased that our class is becoming co-educational at last
. Perhaps it will improve the behaviour of some of our incorrigible larrikins (not mentioning any names, Molesworth).Thanks for the fascinating Tangye contribution. The Tangyes were certainly eminent Brummies, though "sons of Cornwall" (hence the fleetname "Cornubia" for their steam carriage). Is there a picture of the Tangye memorial at Key Hill?
Thylacine
master brummie
"Church" Colouring Competition Winner.
Ahem! Ladies and gentlemen, it falls to me to announce the winner of the "Church" Colouring Competition. May I say that I was underwhelmed by the number of entries (three, and all in the "outrageous" division). The prize goes to Lloyd Penfold for his colouring of the "Josiah Allen Mark 1" engraving as a primaeval Midland Red double-decker (post #4). Penfold ... er, Penfold ... (Give him a nudge will you Motorman?). Ah there you are! Glad you could join us. ([Aside.] Penfold is sleepy because he's moonlighting as a bus driver in Worcester.) Well done with the colouring! And I hear that you have once again won the Mrs Joyful prize for raffia work! ... [Uproar ...]
Honourable mention goes to Mike Motorman for his Birmingham Corporation "Outer Circle" version of the "Church" engraving (post #30). Well done, Motorman!
Since there were no entries in the "historically accurate" division, I have instated a coloured version of "Josiah Allen Mark 2" as the frontispiece of the BSB thread. (As a thumb-nail perforce).
Lloyd's remarkable Midland Red "Church" will be promoted to frontispiece of the MRED thread.
OK class, back to work!
Ahem! Ladies and gentlemen, it falls to me to announce the winner of the "Church" Colouring Competition. May I say that I was underwhelmed by the number of entries (three, and all in the "outrageous" division
). The prize goes to Lloyd Penfold for his colouring of the "Josiah Allen Mark 1" engraving as a primaeval Midland Red double-decker (post #4). Penfold ... er, Penfold ... (Give him a nudge will you Motorman?). Ah there you are! Glad you could join us. ([Aside.] Penfold is sleepy because he's moonlighting as a bus driver in Worcester.) Well done with the colouring! And I hear that you have once again won the Mrs Joyful prize for raffia work! ... [Uproar ...]Honourable mention goes to Mike Motorman for his Birmingham Corporation "Outer Circle" version of the "Church" engraving (post #30). Well done, Motorman!
Since there were no entries in the "historically accurate" division, I have instated a coloured version of "Josiah Allen Mark 2" as the frontispiece of the BSB thread. (As a thumb-nail perforce).
Lloyd's remarkable Midland Red "Church" will be promoted to frontispiece of the MRED thread.
OK class, back to work!