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Passages, Alleyways Gulletts and Snickets of Old Brum

Hi Dennis,

What an amazing image! The Old Grey House is one of the wings/side buildings of the dispensary on Union Street, designed by William Hollins built from about 1806 I think (I'll check). You can see one of the pilasters (flat columns) of the main part of the dispensary on the left. Even though the dispensary has been demolished, a sculture that was over the door (I think of hydra) that was by Hollins is either in the museum or somewhere; surviving anyhow. The building looks really old, but not quite as old as it looks, but by the 1950s there wasn't a huge amount from this era I don't think. I can't remember when the Dispensary was demolished, but I'm guessing this went along with it at a similar time.

I did think originally it might be somewhere in this lovely shot of early Union Street, but I think it's a near miss! The text is interesting though...also mentions Hollins...and William Withering of Edgbaston Hall (my old Golf Clubhouse now), discoverer of Digitalis ets...


The Old Library, 24 Union Street
The Birmingham Library was founded in 1779 and its first meeting place was in Snow Hill, where it was open for one hour each morning. A move was made to larger premises in Upper Priory on 5 May 1790 and, by then, the opening hours were much longer. Land was obtained on a 120 year lease, commencing 24 June 1793, from Dr Withering, at a ground rent of £11 15s per annum. Building work started quickly, but the library, designed by William Hollins and built in stone, was not completed until 1797. The building was symmetrical about the portico and was extended later to the left. A new building was erected in Margaret Street in 1899 where the library remains as part of the Birmingham & Midland Institute. No 24 Union Street remained in use until it was demolished in the 1960s. Boooooo….

Union St Library.jpg
 
...and speaking of other Regency masterpieces cuppateagirl, we did feature a pleeasant old building, still extant, in Bennetts Hill awhile back. Admittedly a bit of stretch for an Alleyway, but 'near enough for jazz', as my old dad used to say....

Number 5 Bennetts Hill in 1932. The bust has gone, but the memory lingers on..

Bennetts Hill   Lysimachus.jpg

No 1-5 Bennnetts Hill, showing the bust of the ancient Greek General Lysimachus.

Quoting from Joseph McKenna and David Harvey: “With beautifully symmetrical round-headed doorways, these five houses were built in 1827, probably designed by Charles Edge, who was later to design the Market Hall in the Bull Ring, and be responsible for the completion of the Town Hall.

Bennetts Hill was cut in 1820, and the naming goes back to Queen Mary Tudor, although it upset Catherine Hutton, William’s sister, who wrote in a hissy fit of indignation ‘I say near, because an upstart (Ooooer Mrs) of a street has arisen in Birmingham, which has assumed the name of Bennetts Hill’. Of course she was writing from the house her father William built for his family in Saltley…now a distant memory...

Bennetts Hill House 1.jpgBennetts Hill House 3.jpg
 
hi guys
i have a picture of an alley way between holly lane and tyburn rd dateing back to the early 1900
and there was an order of a ninety years order before any body could build or alter it
it ran beteen 908 and 898 tyburn rd ; may be some of our older members may remember it from yester years
especialy if they worked at the fort dunlop when going through it or a short cut to get the sandwiches from the cafe ;
later on today i will get my son to down load it ;
best wishes astonian
 
Some time back we nominated COURT HOUSE YARD as a contender for this Thread. Then just as I was about to plonk a few of the missing pics back on, I picked up on Jenni Dixon's magnificent blog from these pages...

https://mappingbirmingham.blogspot.co.uk/

So by way of a tip of a hat for some seminal research by her, may I present this tale? I do have her permission to post, and I have added the pictures of the Court House to add a little something to the tale...


Court of Requests, High Street, Birmingham

Part of High Street in about the 1820s to 1830s.

Court House Print.jpg

Jennens House
Jennens House .jpg

Tucked behind the main shops of High Street, down an alley, (as seen in the 1820s illustration above) stood a shabby old building, but one holding onto the remnants of grandeur. It had been built in about 1650, reputedly for the wealthy ironmonger John Jennens, as a smart house and home, and exhibited some good examples of the new classical influences that were permeating into architectural designs at that time; the segmental pediment over the door is particular of the period (see image below). By the 1770s, the building was being used by Benjamin Mansell as a tea-warehouse, though, by the time of the drawing above, the building was used as the Court of Requests, and its basement would have most likely been filled with imprisoned debtors unable to pay what they owed. This close proximity of the incarcerated to daily life is alien to us today. At about the same time as the above image Nathaniel Drinkwater ran a fruiterer's in the Court of Requests yard, and the image itself suggests that there may also have been a brewery, the passage leading to the court was often 'packed along with baskets of goods and boxes', so business and life went on around the building with the prisoners being audible and perhaps visible through the heavily barred windows.

The house had been acquired by the newly homeless Court of Requests in 1784 as the court had originally been held in the room above the Old Cross, a building demolished that year; and had been, since an act of Parliament in 1752, the court dealing with small debts of no more than 40 shillings for the Birmingham and Aston area. Larger debts were still dealt with at the county court. Both at the Old Cross, and at the court’s new home, 72 ‘commissioners’ were chosen from the local area to pass judgement, only three sitting for each hearing, and always on Friday’s. The Court of Requests also shared the building with the town’s magistrates, but in 1807 they moved to the new public offices in Moor Street, and the building became synonymous with the ‘poor debtors’ that it incarcerated. The same year the magistrates moved out the building was also extended and another act was passed so that the court could deal with those with debts up to £5.

There is a definite sympathy in the writing of contemporaries; Walter Showell notes in 1882 that there were 'many [who] are still living who can recollect the miserable cry of "Remember the poor debtors," which resounded morning, noon and night from the heavily-barred windows of these underground dungeons'. How true this was is uncertain, but for any person in business, except the very wealthy, bankruptcy and the prospect of debtor’s prison could be a very real threat, especially as fashions waxed and waned and economies (as today) were uncertain. On the 1841 census, just three years before the prison shut down, there were 24 men and one woman incarcerated in the court of requests. Some were serial bankrupts, such as James Stainton, an ivory and bone turner, and Henry Flavell, a publican. William Luckcock, a jeweller, was most likely related to the wealthier Luckcock brothers whose jeweller’s establishment was on St. Paul’s Square, so there were business owners from all parts of the social spectrum.

The poor conditions of the prison were well known, it had been nicknamed the ‘Louse Hole’, and considering that the poorest inside slept on the cellar floor with only straw, lice were likely not to be the only problem. Some could purchase better conditions, but those were often businessmen who had chosen a spell in prison over paying their debts. In 1827 a report recorded that the paying inmates (paying two shillings a week) still slept three to a bed and that 19 of these men slept in a space only four paces square. Those sentenced to time in the prison and these conditions (at the time when the maximum debt was £5) received 'one day in durance for each shilling due', but no more than 100 days in total. There could be 30 to 40 trials an hour, with about one in ten being sentenced to imprisonment, and there could be no appeal to the verdict.

The Jennens link is fascinating. In Joseph Hill's map of 1553 you can see at least the land belonging to Jennens is marked, and the 1888 map shows the location of the Court House Yard also marked in New Street right on the money....


Court House  Moor St  Map 2 1553 Joseph Hill.jpg Court House Yard Map 1888.jpg


What was also fascinating is the old photos of Court House Yard taken in the late nineteenth Century...showing the old house still just about extant then, and the Court House in different commmercial guises...before it was swept away and later became the Pallasades shopping Mall.

Court House Yard High Street 1892.jpg
 
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Dennis

Of course we are interested, this being among the most interesting threads to the forum in recent years, I'm sure that everyone who peruses the thread will be glad that it is beginning to get back to what it was and thank you for your efforts.

Phil
 
Dennis I fully agree with Phil. All is needed is a little thank you and it gives the person doing the work a sense of appreciation. Carry on the good work. Carol
 
It is really nice to see some of the original photo's being re-added, it makes it all make much more sense as this forum is very much image orientated. Cheers.
 
I certainly appreciate the effort members are making in re-instating some of the lost images. It requires quite a bit of time and a lot of patience. Much appreciated Dennis, especially on this thread where many of these places have disappeared. Great stuff. Viv.
 
Dennis - this is one of the most interesting threads on the forum to my mind. And I love the amount of information everyone is putting on - I am learning so much from it. It is just fascinating.

Judy
 
I agree with all that has been said if only all threads could be repaired like this. I agree with Judy one of the most interesting and informative threads keep up the excellent work Dennis.
 
Cheers girls. But all of your thanks should go to Phil and mikejee. The architects, and my inspiration to follow on their ideas. They know that....bless em...

And here's aone that hasn't featured yet...BELCHERS LANE...much changed to-day...there was a nice Working Men's Club down there that I used to frequent as lads when we were skint...cheaper than pub prices...

Belchers Lane 1925.jpg
 
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I wonder if anyone can help with this one, (I'm going back 50-60years !).
Walking on the right hand side of the road, from Lewis's towards Greys, I remember a large, plain fronted buiding, more or less opposite those bus stops that were outside Greys. I don't think I ever knew what the building was for but halfway along was an entrance to a small cemetery. I remember being taken to peep in at it once but that's as far as I got.
I wonder why there should be a cemetery in such a location, could it have been an old churchyard that the city had grown around ?
 
This building is the Friends Meeting House. The Quakers have had this site for a very long time and there were burials there many years ago. There are Meeting Rooms that can be rented. I went to a Beauty Without Cruelty meeting a few years back.
 
I wonder if anyone can help with this one, (I'm going back 50-60years !).
Walking on the right hand side of the road, from Lewis's towards Greys, I remember a large, plain fronted buiding, more or less opposite those bus stops that were outside Greys. I don't think I ever knew what the building was for but halfway along was an entrance to a small cemetery. I remember being taken to peep in at it once but that's as far as I got.
I wonder why there should be a cemetery in such a location, could it have been an old churchyard that the city had grown around ?

Just a couple to be going on with...lots more to come if I'm not horribly wrong...did it look like the second one by any chance Baz?


Bull street  Meeting House 1703.jpg Bull st Meeting House  1857.jpg
 
Dennis, this is one of my favourite threads on the Forum. Thank you so much for your efforts, I LOVE looking at all the photos.
 
The Friends Meeting house and cemetery was at the top of Dr Johnson Passage off Bull Street. Quite a few of the Cadbury family were buried there over the years, but I believe all the bodies were removed in recent years and re-interred elsewhere. Though as you can see from the photo the marker stones remain.
 

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Good stuff Phil. The burial grounds were from the ancient Priory of St Thomas. Here is a nice piece from Walter Showell, and an old map, that explain the history of the area far more simply than I could....the old name changes and re-named streets are fascinating...


Old Square Maps.jpg St Thomas Priory.jpg
 
This is facinating my 4x gt grandfather Martin Zipfel had a clock makers shop in Chapel Street around the 1830's. Would this be the same street.
 
Probably not Wendy, the Chappell Street on the map was renamed Bull Street at the time of the Reformation in the 16th Cenrury. More likely your Chapel Street link is the one that bounded the old 18th Century St Bartholomew's Church on the 1888 Map below...

Interestingly, Bull Street took its name from the Old Bull Tavern with its bowling green at the back. Richard Cadbury was at No 92 as a 'linen draper and silk merchant. Richard's son, John, eventually had a tea and coffeee shop next door, but moved to an old favourite of this thread, Crooked Lane to establich a cocoa and chocolate business...the rest is history so to speak...

St Barts Map 1888.jpg
 
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I'm afraid neither of the pictures resembles the building I remember, Dennis. My memory is of a drab, art deco style frontage.
I'm sure that anyone who stood waiting for a bus outside Greys in the fifties will recall looking across the road at it.
Thanks to you and everyone else who have replied.
 
I'm afraid neither of the pictures resembles the building I remember, Dennis. My memory is of a drab, art deco style frontage.
I'm sure that anyone who stood waiting for a bus outside Greys in the fifties will recall looking across the road at it.
Thanks to you and everyone else who have replied.

Oh you were THAT side of the road Baz....then you would be thinking of the narrow entrance to the Fire Station Yard perhaps?


Fire station Upper Priory Map 1901.jpg Upper Priory Fire station.jpg
 
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