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Gosta Green Through Duddeston

Hi pedlarman

The only reason I remember it so well is that I passed by it so many times on the way to the Raven for the purpose of getting my parents out of the pub for one reason or another.

I remember thinking at the time, why can't they drink here, but I was too young then to know of the nuance's between different pubs. Then they were just somewhere parents disappeared to weekend nights.

Phil
 
Dear GER22VAN,

I have just sent a congratulatory post to pmc1947, because it appears that his info is more reliable than mine...!

I was going to suggest to you that "The Dartmouth Arms" of 1890 and 1940 could have been renamed, as time went by, as "The Sun..."

But, both I and my "verifier" of the "Sun" name were wrong, apparently. My verifier has informed me that "The Sun", after another think, was on the corner of Heneage Street and Windsor street - opposite a youth club called "William White's"

So I stand corrected...

However, Further enquiries tell me that Fletchers had a house next to the pub, in which they lived for some time. Next to their house was a yard called "Sunnyside" in which lived my Aunt Agnes and Uncle Fred Powers, until they moved to Adams Street later.

Further along was at least one factory - but there were probably more...

But consulting my dubious (?) memory once again I am going to insist that I did see , at times, one or both of the Fletcher twins toddling along Dartmouth Street. This would be, of course, during the Fletchers' residential days next to the pub...

Now, because I do remember a yard next to the pub, I am going to suggest that these minor "lapses" of memory are the result of Fletcher's logistical business moves as the business flourished...

For instance, I suggest that - as a first move towards aquiring further property along Dartmouth Street, the Old Man sold the house and backyard next to the pub and turned them into a business premises. (which is why I remember the "war surplus" yard...

After which first move would come the gradual acquisition of that side of Dartmouth Street until, finally, they had the whole of the corner - from Adams Street and along Gt. Lister Street - for the building of the showroom, from which they sold their motor supplies.

I have to admit that after getting married and moving away, I paid only occasional visits back to Heneage Street where my Mom lived - and she, eventually, moved out of the area. So I cannot give a hands-on, continual report of the Fletcher's business progress...

But, apart from my error regarding the name of the pub on the corner, I lived at that spot for some years. It is possible that the actions of the Fletchers - first having a house next to the pub, then turning it into a business next to the pub - have sort of blended into "waves" of recall that have started to become a little vague, these days...

And for this failing I apologise to all who have a better memory of those days.

Anyway, GER22VAN, I hope I have managed to clear away some of the debris that eighty-year-old memories can create...!

With regards,

Jim Pedley (pedlarman)
 
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Hi, Phil,

It just occurs to me that, since your parents liked "The Raven" so much my Dad - as the barman - probably had a hand in serving them...!

Regards,

Jim Pedley (pedlarman)
 
Hi, Phil,

It just occurs to me that, since your parents liked "The Raven" so much my Dad - as the barman - probably had a hand in serving them...!

Regards,

Jim Pedley (pedlarman)
 
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pedlarman

More than likely, considering that they spent nearly every Friday,Saturday, and Sunday night in there laced with the occasional foray to the Green Man from 1953 until they demolished the pub. Then they moved to the Adelaide at the top of Erskine St.

Phil
 
Ernie,

The New Inns, that would be just up Great Lister St on the other side of the road to the Raven. My parents used to get in there occasionally. I cant understand why they passed so many pubs on the way from Francis St and decided to make the Raven their local.

Do you have any idea, was it classed as an Irish pub, my stepfather was Irish so maybe that was the reason.

Phil
 
Hi, Phil,

As far as I know "The Raven" was just an "ordinary" pub for the benefit of mostly Englishmen, but I don't doubt that Irishmen would have been welcome...

JIm Pedley (pedlarman)
 
Does anyone remember the Conservative Club on Revsby Walk. I didn't think much of it, even though I did go to a couple of dances there in the 60's. I found it a bit restrictive.

I went in there once more in the seventies and although it was no longer a Conservative club it was still very dead and lifeless. Anybody have any different memories of it. Is it still open?

Pedlarman

Thanks for your input, its just knowing my step father he liked to drink in Irish pubs. not the plastic theme type pubs but the real ones that were full of Dubliners.

Phil
 
Phil i used it on a regular basis,playing football and snooker for them,and also went to the dances upstairs,and you are right about it being a bit strict.......i had my ticket from there more than once

Mossy
 
Mossy

Do you know if it is still open, and do you know what that building on the site of the Hamlet turned out as?

Phil
 
pedlarman. Forgive me for not answering sooner, I thought I would have a few days rest. You say you are 80 years old so you have 10 years more of memory than I have. Those Fletcher kids must have been about my age although I did not know them. Its great to hear about things as they were before my memories, hope you have more to tell us.
 
Phil. Sorry I have not answered before Phil I was having a rest.
I honestly cannot say if the New Inns was used by the Irish community.
Mine used the Raven. Old Nelson and the Britannia at various times, I can only imagine that it was the atmosphere of the pub, friends or workmates used it, or a number of other reasons. Sorry I could not be more helpful Phil.
 
Ernie,

Fine, don't think you have to jump to the computer every time I ask a question. I have got plenty of time I intend being around for a few years yet. As I have said he drank in there from about 1953 until it closed.

He always drank with the same clique of people, when they demolished the Raven they all moved to the back room of the Adelaide on Erskine street and that definitely was an Irish room even if the pub wasn't. I think there was only about three people that used the room that weren't Irish.

Phil
 
phil.my grandad was irish,and the pubs down digbeth was great.they did not mind anyone being there.cant be doing with this commity bumf
pete
 
john knight said:
hi there,
i remember "blackbat" he used to come down cromwell st. Shouting argus, but the way he pronounced it was more like arse cut.
He sat on our front step one evening (must have been summer) and proceeded to unwrap a newspaper package which contained (wait for it) a sheeps head, half a loaf, and a lump of margarine, he then took a bite from the head, a bite from the bread and a bite from the loaf til he'd more or less demolished the lot.
He always looked like a chimney sweep, hence the name blackbat.
Fond memories, regards john.
Click to expand...
well that,s sunday lunch out the window then
so that,s how the other half live then.
Regards dereklcg.
 
derek

You have obviously never sat and watched anybody make brawn or ate Chitterlings and Hodge. I have to be honest it makes me sick to the stomach to even think about it.

Phil
 
Everyone on this site and this thread has so much knowledge.....Can anyone remember many years ago something which was either a de railment or explosion on the railway on duddeston mill road????


The incident did make the news and the papers and if I recall people had to be evacuated from their homes, This was towards the bottom end of the road not the top end by Melvina Rd.
 
Hi Everyone
All the contributors to this thread have a great deal of interesting collective knowledge about the area and it has bought back so many memories for me.

I lived in Rocky lane opposite the bombed church /Cromwell Street for most of my younger years and went to Cromwell Street and Charlie Arthur Schools. The photographs and maps you have all posted are excellent and bought back so many memories.

I wondered if anyone could help me with my query about the area. My canal boatmen ancestors c1845 settled around Love Lane in Gosta Green and I have been unable to find any photographs of Love Lane nor the houses or industries in Love Lane. Not even Birmingham Library have any photographs and I wondered if anyone on this thread had any ideas where to go next.
 
Shady

I have no knowledge of a train derailment at Duddeston Mill, other than a hazy recollection of such an event. I'm sure if you made enquiries in the Birmingham Transport thread, sub thread The Railways. Those rail enthusiasts will have reams of information. They can even tell you the time of the next train to Euston.

Louisa

My advice for you would be much the same, try the Birmingham Transport Thread, sub thread The Canals. Although I can tell you a little about Love Lane. It was a small street that ran from Dartmouth St to Holt St, there was a church on the corner called St Lawrence's and the road crossed over the canal and was adjacent to what looks like a basin on the map.
If you go to post #602 on this thread there is an old photo of the church.
The poster GER22VAN (Ernie) might be able to give you further information when he comes on.

Phil

LoveLane.jpg
 
Shady. Sorry I cannot help.
Louisa. Sorry I cannot help. I traveled along Love Lane for 2 and a half years from 1954 and I cannot remember any houses.Below is Kelly's 1904.
Love lane, 22 Aston road to.
Dartmouth st. MAP H 3, H 4.
SOUTH SIDE.
5 Roden John, shopkeeper
........here is Oxygen St... „
NORTH SIDE.
Brooke Henry, metal merchnii.
Gold & Co. iron hinge:
manufrs. (Swan works)
Only part of Love Lane by Photograph is the one Phil mentions Post 602.
We always hope that people may add more which may help you
Otherwise sorry, Oh just one other thing is that they record Boat people on the Census's.
 
This is the best i can come up with shady!
taken on the canal in the dudderston area a- b row a few months ago,
don,t give up. regards dereklcg.
 
Here's a cracker of a photo I have just found. Its of the junction of Ashted Row and Lawley St / Dartmouth St. It can't have been taken too long after the war because its still showing the bombed out shell of Holbrooks.

Phil

NechellsAshtedRow-DartmouthSt-1.jpg
 
That,s a great pic Phil,
must be the inner circle 8 ?
i can,t remember the exact route it took,
so i may have got it wrong.
regards dereklcg.
 
Derek

The No 8 tram was the tram from the city to Alum Rock the Pelham I think. There are others on this site that know far much more about the trams than I do and can advise you better than I, but I don't think the inner circle 8 started running while the trams were in use. At least not with the route No 8.

Phil
 
That's right the inner circle 8 was a bus route and the 8 tram ran up Alum Rock to the Pelham terminous. (capital cinema). The Washwood Heath tram would have been on the same track there and would split off at the Gate Saltley. I think it's number was 10. They both had the same terminous in town... Martineau Street.
How much after the war for this great photo is not clear. The bombed out ruins of Holbrooks was around for quite a while. This brings back memories of riding the tram past that very spot many..many times. Looking back at this after so long I always find that the roads seem narrower than remembered. I think that even after the trams were replaced by buses, the Holbrook ruins were still there for the longest time. Thanks for the picture.
 
Strangely the trams and buses used duplicate numbers for their routes, so the 8 tram went somewhere quite different to the 8 bus.
Early tram to bus replacements used the same number, (i.e. 22 to Bolton Road, 7 to Nechells, 34 to Hagley Road [Kings Head]) but later they used new numbers for the replacements. The Alum Rock Road tram (8) became the 55 bus. The city, inner and outer circle routes were always bus, never tram.

Notice also the salvage department battery-electric dustcart, far left.
 
No 14 bus seems to ring a bell. It was a long time ago. Did the 55 not go the Washwood Heath route? Can't be sure now.
 
56 was the Washwood Heath bus, Rupert, replaced tram 10. the actual 8 replacement was 55B. 14 bus went the same way, but on further to Lea Hall.
 
hi Rupert the 14 bus went down grt Lister st,from old square, saltley,alum rock,pelam, burney lane then up through the glebe, lea village, mackadown, and terminated at tile cross,wow i,m out of breath.
what a run through, can you picture it now all these years on?
happy days regards dereklcg.
 
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