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Canals of Birmingham

  • Thread starter Thread starter O.C.
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ii> I MEANT TO MENTION, FLEETINGLY, THE MOTHER OF ELIZABETH II, WAS VISITING A NAVY WARSHIP ON HER ANNUAL JAUNT TO THE CINQUE PORTS. THE COMPLEMENT WAS ON DECK PRESENTATION AND ONE BLOKE HAD A STRONG COUGH. SHE STOPPED, OPENED HER HAND BAG AND TOOK OUT A LOZENGE FOR HIM. WELL, ON THE PACKET WAS A PICTURE OF A HARDY SALTY SEA DOG BEING LASHED BY THE BRINEY IN GALE FORCE AT A WHEEL. IT'S NOT AN INLAND CANAL BOAT, THIS CHARACTER WITH HIS SILVER BEARD IS WAY OUT THERE. THEY WORE OIL SKINS. SURELY IT WOULD HAVE MADE MORE SENSE TO HAVE DRESSED THE HORSE WITH AN OLD BLANKET DRAPED WITH AN OIL SKIN? IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN A SOURCE OF WONDER TO MYSELF THAT THEY SPEND ALMOST THEIR WHOLE LIVES UPRIGHT. IT WOULD HAVE BEEN POSSIBLE TO HITCH TWO MULES IN SERIAL TO TOW A NARROW [eg] AND BUTTY.

WHERE ARE SOME STABLES TO BE VIEWED? (OR REMAINS)
THE OPPOSITE LOCK CLUB, GAS STREET BASIN, WAS A STABLES. IT WAS GOT FOR A STEAL BY MOTOR CAR RACING ENTHUSIASTS AND TURNED INTO A HUMDINGER ENTERPRISE.

WHAT IS THE CONDITION, CROMWELL, OF THE DUDLEY MINES? THAT TURN OFF FROM THE SECOND POUND, NOW COLLAPSED, WAS A LINE ALONG WHICH PASSENGERS WERE TAKEN ON SUNDAYS FOR GAS LIT ORCHESTRAL CONCERTS! IF THE CARNS ARE STILL ACCESSIBLE, BEING VERY UNSTABLE, THE GAS LINES ARE VISIBLE. (PRIOR TO THE RIVER REA BEING CULVERTED ON SUNDAYS AND SOME HOLIDAYS PLEASURE BOATS TOOK REVELERS TO GAITY AT VAUXHALL GARDENS. I WONDER WHERE THEY WERE COLLECTED. PRESUMABLY THE BOATS WERE ALSO HORSE DRAWN.) THE FIRST MINE STEAM ENGINE IS SUBMERGED IN DUDLEY MINES AT A FLOODED LEVEL, I THINK OFF TO THE LEFT OF THE SECOND POUND BEFORE YOU GET LONG LEGGING.
OTHER THAN THE POLICE, WHO USE THE SUMPS FOR TRAINING AS DIVERS, I FIND IT UNTELLIGIBLE WHO ENGINEERING AT B UNI & O o A DOESN'T SEND A SMALL REMOTE CONTROLLED SUB WITH THE WORKS.
THE WATER IS STAGNANT CLEAR. IF THE TITANIC CAN BE FOUND MID ATLANTIC AND INTERNALLY EXPLORED SURELY THEY CAN GIT THAT TOGETHER? I'D HAVE THOUGHT, ACTUALLY I DO, A FASCINATING RESEARCH PROJECT.
 
Cromwell, my cousin lived in a village called Northend nr Southam she sadly died last year aged just 63 a sudden heart attack. We were close as we shared an interest in family history. I have enjoyed the thread about the canals as like you they have always facinated me. Our trip was not very long we did go further than Banbury but of course had to return. Our friends said we may encounter a bit of grumpyness from some fishermen who had to lift their rods to let us pass. I just smiled and said thank you! I think it would be a big step to sell up and move onto a canal boat as they are quite small although I think the life would be lovely. I have noticed there is a canal museum in Welshpool we keep saying we must go. One thing that made us laugh on the canal was a chandler selling coal from his boat we stopped to buy some he said "I am just having my dinner can you hang on" we waited about half an hour while he ate his fish and chips and drunk his tea, then our friend had to hump the coal (this was for the fire as it was winter). It just made us all realise its a different pace of life.!
 
The War Years
Just after the Great War the canals started to suffer a serious decline when many of the boatmen lost their lives in that terrible conflict
The canals were the poor relation of the railways and the roads…..a member of the transport family fallen on evil days, which somehow managed to scratch some sort of living together in a mysterious way. At any rate that was the position before 1939… And something desperately needed to be done for the canals to stop them becoming abandoned ….There were empty canals, disused canals, canals silted up and choked by weeds, canals whose banks and tunnels have fallen in and which have reverted back to nature and canals that were simply kids playgrounds
Their time of prosperity was between the middle of the 18th century and the building of the first railways and only a few of these waterways were able to stand the railways' competition. These few were not always the long canals, occasionally the short ones in the Black Country, or even a mile or two of some longer canal otherwise idle had been paying propositions.
When the situation was looked at in 1941, the Ministry of War Transport was advised that about 500 miles of canal would have to be written off as unworkable, and that all war efforts must be concentrated on the very substantial 2,000 miles of navigable water which remained.
If you looked at a map of the canals in the British Isles, you would see that, apart from the three canals in Scotland….the system fell into four parts. Those corresponded to the four great estuaries, the Thames, the Humber, the Mersey and the Severn. The canals work inland from these starting places, relieving and feeding the docks and, after long unbroken runs, broke into small branches in the Midlands and in Lancashire and Yorkshire. The first thing to remember about them is that they should be compared with the roads rather than the railways, for where a railway owned the track and sidings, and operated the vehicles that run there, the waterways were owned by the canal companies, and with three exceptions, these companies do not supply the craft which floated on them.
The companies existed, in theory, by the tolls they collected from the barge and boat owners, in practice; these tolls were but a small portion of their income. The income came from a number of other sources, e.g. from warehousing, property, investments, etc. A large number of factories were built beside the canals, and one form of canal revenue was the sale of water to the factories for condensing purposes. The companies who owned the craft were numerous and very different from each other.
Gas companies, firms of millers, quarry owners, brick makers, etc., may own fleets of boats. Or there may be companies which existed by carrying freight. In some areas, in the Warwickshire mining district, there were many "little men" with family-owned boats, who worked the short-distance runs from the mines to the Midland factories.
An important distinction must be made between a barge and a boat. A barge is a vessel of some fourteen-foot beam, which normally works in flowing water such as rivers or estuaries. Many miles of static, inland waters were too narrow for them. The barge which operates in living, tidal water, which goes out on to the estuaries, often picking up goods straight from the ships, is a vessel which requires a special skill in navigation; and this barge can carry large loads. But what most of us call barges are not barges at all, but narrow boats of some seven foot beam (the width) which often work in pairs and carry some 25 to 30 tons each.
I have always called the crafts on the canal. barges (which I always will) which was usually drawn by a horse on the towpath. When they get to the tunnel the barge may have to be poled or legged through. But horses are not used nowadays. The boat with its phutting engine is the commoner sight; and although there are no tides to reckon with, Back in the old days even in stretches that seem dead straight and without complication, the men would go to their tillers and pull the procession (if they were towing) over to one side as they approach the locks. There was an art in keeping the line of boats straight as it entered the narrow gates, an art which saved it from buckling, swinging broad-side on across the water and blocking the channel, or suddenly bending and colliding with a procession passing in the opposite direction.
Although the capacity of the canals were severely limited, they still carried twelve million tons of cargo every year. What was the cargo? Half of it is coal, coke and other fuel. In Birmingham they carried 100,000 tons of coal a month;
The railways who owned some of the canals carried nearly 30,000 tons of coal a month by water. Four hundred and fifty thousand tons of coal were carried every month by the boats and the barges. The other cargoes are, of course, the simple bulk cargoes, like tar and oil…tar was important…granite, gravel, grain and many other foodstuffs for home consumption, steel and cement for our industries, and every month over 400,000 tons of these were carried from the ports and the depots to the storage places and the factories. The important relief which the canals gave to the enormous wartime pressure on the railways was obvious.
In a generation, the population of boatmen has become very small. Think of the life on the boats. The hours were long…a 12-hour day was inevitable…the men frequently have to load and unload their own boats at wharves without cranes, for which they receive extra pay. To hump 50 tons of coal on to the wharf after a 12-hour day was not an attractive prospect. Living conditions were primitive. Wages were on the low side. It is also true that during these long hours a man may not be working hard; he may merely be standing at the tiller. But the life was lonely; the industry had been largely recruited from those born and bred on the boats; and the younger generation saw that if they wanted the amenities, the higher wages, the entertainments of modern life, and better opportunities for education for themselves and their children, the best thing they could do was to leave the water.
The earnings on a pair of boats average £7 a week. This looked well, if the whole of that £7 a week was going into one family; but not all boats by any means were one-family boats. Usually each pair of boats had a captain, a mate and a boy, which means when the money was divided up that the captain gets£3.10.0 perweek, the mate £2.10.0 and the boy £1
The labour problem was a very hard nut to crack. There has been an ingenious suggestion that women should take up the boatman's trade….a woman standing at the tiller with her baby in her arms was of course one of the picturesque sights of the canals..and two ladies did indeed made a success of carrying grain from the Severn to Worcester, doing regular trips. They didn’t do all the loading and unloading, of course, but they work the locks themselves, which was pretty hard work. So there was a plan to train women for this kind of canal work, which those two ladies began as amateurs and turned into their trade.
The war was hard on all transport workers in the matter of food. And the boatman had very similar difficulties to those of the railwaymen and lorry drivers; rather more serious difficulties, for the drivers on road and rail have had only themselves to feed; but the boatmen have frequently to provide for their families. It was one thing to lean over the canal bridge in some pretty and out-of-the-way country town, listening to the tap of the boat engines as the boats arrive in the evenings; quite another to come into that place hungry, with traveller's food cards, and to be told by the shopkeepers that they can supply their registered customers only.. The remedy, as on the roads and the railway hostels, was the canteen and many of these had to be established.
The canals did not suffer much in the “Blitz” as the railways did, they had suffered far less even than the roads. But there had been "incidents". A bomb could topple a building into the water in the city, or burst a bank and cause flooding; but this was nothing compared to the nightly struggle on the roads, streets and junctions. What the war had done for the canals was to arrest their decline, and to give the Government and the industry a stimulus to reorganise them from top to bottom. When one saw those people on the boats, the water gypsies who from generation to generation had built up a curious, tenacious life of their own, one realises they too were part of the transport's battle. As they chugged along on their eight-day journey from London to the Mersey, or their fortnight's round voyage to Birmingham and the collieries of the Black Country, the battle had indeed overtaken them. That trade, which looked so leisurely, took on its share of the back-breaking jobs of the war….and bought about the revival of the canal for a few more years……..but when the war was over the downward spiral began again and by 1945 the total tonnage carried on the canals was 10 million
Which was a big drop to the 30 million tons it carried at the turn of the century
Women on the canal
Photo 1 Loading Grain... Photo 2 Pushing off
Photo 3 Narrow Boats lined up for loading
Photo 4 Coal Barges in the River Severn
 
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Thank you for that Cromwell a facinating piece. I have been told by some old folk in Tamworth who lived along the canal years ago. In the very hard winters the bargee's would throw a lump of coal into the garden for them to put on the fire to keep warm. The women were certainly tuff, I felt such a wimp when I worked the locks! The photo's are lovely.
 
Thanks Rupert, Moma P and hmid, makes it all worthwhile
The B’ham & Fazeley canal which ran through town had a branch from it that ran straight to Curzon Street but did not go any further but the River Rea was only about 400 feet away from Vauxhall Gardens which the railways killed off as they could travel father a field but until the novelty wore off you could get a train from Curzon Street Station (Pics I will post in another thread) and get off at Vauxhall Station.
The Black Country tunnels have completely been redone for the tourist trade and you can even get married now in the singing caverns and I am sure that if an old engine or pump was in their it would be recovered as I know the work that goes on behind the scenes…..but I will raise the issue on my next visit
As soon as I get the chance I will show you a pic of some old canal side stables…… and just take a look at these two pics of what rope does to cast iron and stone bollards
The first pic I took at the Black country of the old wind up horizontal lift bridge which you have to wind up the let the boat pass underneath, note the old crane for unloading the barge (narrow boat)
2nd pic is a couple of old barges and till they can be renovated its best to sink them in the cut to stop the deterioration (I know its strange but it’s a fact)
Rules of the Road (on the canal) are Vessels meeting pass port to port (left side to left side) …..so each alters his course to starboard (which is “Right”)
Drawing I have done shows how two horse towing vessels would pass…. boat B would drop (lower) the tow-rope and let boat A pass over him and it was strictly adhered to……hope I have answered most of the questions
 
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Many thanks to the authors for their superb contributions recently. It is a fascinating subject. I remember from that over 50 years ago, the the Inland Waterways Association members used to blame the railways for taking over and stifling the canals.
I don't know whether that is the right argument, as I still have a hunch that we did things too much on the cheap. Our nearest European neighbours had superb canals, which were regularly improved as trade grew. In the Low Countries this was probably just for commerecial profit, but in France and Germany, canals were regarded as is strategic military objects, like castles and town defences, and were built with little expense spared. If we had invested wisely in our canals they could have been so much better, rather than the leaky old backwaters we remember we like to get nostalgic about now.
Britain did have some good ideas, and the Grand Union Canal was formed out of the manky old narrow canals to get big boats to Brum from London, but it was still mostly narrow boats that used it, as I remember.
I suspect this discussion can run and run. All right with me!
Peter
 
Peter, I think that the time line is important to consider for the canal debate. A great deal of the canal system was constructed before internal combustion power came on the scene. Or steam for that matter. In the midalnd city areas and others, it seems many branches were cut to serve factories up to the back door. This may not have been possible with a larger configuration. Pulling larger boats required more livestock and manpower. And another thing, more water. Winding a larger boat is another consideration. I guess what I am trying to say is it would have been less versatile. I have already raised the question of the amount of material that had to be removed to construct a canal. Imagine twice as much. We also have to consider that the system became for a large part obsolete before it was finished. It's possible though that the larger configuration for bulk cargoes would be valuable today for long distance and I suppose that towards the end of canal construction, heavy mechanical equipment may have been available for excavating. It seems to me that I read somewhere that the Birmingham/Worcester canal started to be built using a wider format but was abandoned after the first lock and the narrower gauge was then proceded with. Maybe someone could comment on that.
Perhaps by the time that construction became easier they were to far into
the narrow format to change. Larger boats would not be able to be manipulated through the existing narrow branches.
Whatever, there is still 2000 miles of navigable system which is a great tourist attraction. I wonder if it is financially viable as such at this stage. Incidentally what is the length of continental systems?
Cromwell I seem to think that there were two wharfs just north of Gt Lister Street. They must have been filled in some years ago.
 

Rupert, there were loads of Canal Wharf’s in Birmingham, but I was just illustrating the point of the nearest canal to Vauxhall Gardens, the one by Curzon St went down to Bordesely Wharf.
By bringing cheap goods transport to the new industrial areas, these canals built by Brindley and his successors made possible the first phase of the industrial revolution in Britain. The waterways carried an immense amount of traffic, and therefore proved highly profitable to the companies that had promoted them. And yet, in a sense, their success was ultimately their downfall. Industrial expansion was so rapid that by 1830 its traffic had outgrown the carrying capacity of the canals. Consequently there was a second call for a better transport system - and this time it was the railway engineers who answered it.
Naturally the canal companies who had enjoyed such a profitable monopoly fought against the new railways, but with little or no success. It is true that it requires less power to move a ton of goods by water than by any other means, but this is not the whole story. If the carrying capacity of the boat is small and its speed very low the labour cost becomes so high that it cancels out the power economy. The greater part of the canal system of the midlands was built for 'narrow boats' loading only thirty tons and travelling at not more than three miles an hour. Moreover, the amount of traffic a canal can handle, even in such small boats, is limited, particularly in summer, by the amount of water available in the supply reservoirs at the summit of the canal system. Each boat that passes through a canal draws two locks full of water away from the canal's summit-level, and this loss of water must be made good from high-level catchment areas - which are most susceptible to drought.
And with Birmingham being 400 feet above sea level you can quickly see how you have to go down the locks when you go away from Birmingham and up the locks when coming to Birmingham (see photo I took of sign at Stratford)
Apart from these inherent disadvantages, the canal companies were handicapped in their battle against the railways by the fact that the waterways did not comprise a single unified national system but consisted of a network of canals and river navigations of differing dimensions which had grown piecemeal to meet local rather than national needs. Attempts to remedy this state of affairs were half-hearted and too belated, and if you have travelled on the network of canals round the Midlands you could be going along on one as wide as 30 –50 feet then all of a sudden you have to go through a lock which is just 8 feet wide (see photo)….Crazy ...while the railway companies overcame such difficulties at the outset by setting up a national Railway Clearing House to facilitate through-traffic working between one company's line and another's.
The outcome of this transport battle was that many canal companies sold out their undertakings to rival railway companies, who had usually no incentive to maintain them as going concerns. In these circumstances it says much for the inherent advantages of water transport that it has survived in this country so long and so stubbornly.
Towards the end of the nineteenth century steam power was introduced on some canals, while the present century has seen the old horse-drawn boats almost completely superseded by diesel-engined craft. This change to diesel power has meant only a very small increase in speed, and canal banks have had to be protected by piling to withstand the wash from propellers. Moreover, the disadvantage of the canal 'narrow boat's' small cargo-capacity has become more crippling as a result of intense competition from road transport and rapidly rising labour costs. The effect at the present time is that commercial water transport is only flourishing on wide waterways such as the Severn and Trent, where craft of much larger carrying capacity can operate.
Through the use of our canal system for commercial transport has diminished, it has other uses which are increasing very rapidly in value at the present time. Every new factory, every new housing estate, that is built on this over-crowded island of ours means an increasing demand for two things: for water, and for elbow room where people can relax away from the jungle of bricks and mortar and the hectic pace of modern living. These are vital needs. We cannot import them, but our canals can supply them both. Today a canal side home is very desirable and more people every year are learning to appreciate the amenity-value of quiet waterways situated just where such peace and quiet is most needed - near dense urban areas. They fish, they walk the towpaths, and they explore the canals by boat. The reaction against overcrowded roads has been a phenomenal increase in pleasure boating on canals, which is offsetting the decline of commercial traffic.
At the moment, owing to antiquated laws dating from the days of canal construction, the canal-owning authority often receives little financial return at all for supplying a factory or a farmer with water or for providing a fisherman with a day's sport.
We are becoming increasingly aware of the fact that our canals are an historic and invaluable part of our national heritage. We cannot afford to lose them, and they must not be allowed to become stagnant, weed-choked ditches. Their use for commercial transport may have diminished, but they can play a different but no less valuable part in our hectic 21st century life if we are prepared to pay a fair price for what they can give us.
 
THX
WHERE IS THE WOMAN POLING ATOP BOAT-BARGE TO TOW PATH ON THE CUT? THAT'S PX 02. AND WHY IS SHE SO DOING AND WHEN?
THE PHOTOS ARE ASTONISHING AS ASTOUNDING.
ILFORD NO LONGER MAKES SOME OF THE FINEST, MAYBE THE FINEST, MONOCHROME STOCK. A LOT OF THOSE WHO NEVER WORKED MIGHT WONDER WHAT THEY MISS BY SCRUTINIZING STOCK.
THE COMPOSITION IS NIFTY IN THE SNAPS.
THE PORTRAYAL OF ECONOMIC LIFE FROM OWNERSHIP OPERATION TO SINGLE, GROUP, COMPANY ACTIVITY OF VESSELS AND THE ATTENDANT FACILITIES (TAVERNS, STABLES) IS A MARVELLOUS REVEAL AS ROOTS AND SHOOTS.
THE TWO ENTERPRISING WOMEN WHO COTTONED ONTO TILLARAGE [allo!] AND LOCK WORKING TO FREE UP THE FELLAS IS A FASCINATING REVEAL AND SURPRISING THAT DID NOT OBTAIN WAY BACK. WOMEN ARE FINE TO OPERATE LOCKS. HIPS INTO WINDLASS OPERATION AND HIPS ONTO BEAM SUBSEQUENTLY. THE CAPTAINS OF INDUSTRY GOT AN ALMIGHTY BONANZA OFF THE TOIL AS LABOR INTENSIVE.
RUPERT AND CROMWELL CITE THE IMMISERATION OF WAR AS WW II.
BRITAIN WAS CAUGHT ON THE HOP BECAUSE OF INCOMPETENCE. IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN OBVIOUS THAT CANALS WERE INVALUABLE FOR TRANSPORTING CERTAIN ITEMS, FREEING RAILWAYS TO EXPRESS.
THERE ARE MANY AND VARIED ISSUES RAISED IN THIS REVUE.
THE CASE MADE BY THE INLAND WATERWAYS ASSOCIATION WAS THAT PROPELLER DRIVEN CRAFT CHUGGING ALONG AT 3-4mph COMBATTED WEEDS AND MUCK. THE PUDDLED CLAY [WET CLAY AND SAND] WAS SUFFICIENT TO HOLD FOR A COUPLE HUNDRED YEARS BUT THEN APPARENTLY THE SWISH SWASH OF THE PROPELLERS MADE FOR EROSION. SURPRISING, I FIND THAT. NONTHELESS INTELLIGIBLE.
TO WHAT EXTEND WAS THERE SHORING, SUCH AS PILING, AND WHERE AND WHAT INDUCEMENT? WAS IT THE ADVENT OF THE DIESEL ENGINE FOR INDUSTRIAL-COMMERCIAL ACTION?
(THERE WAS A LONG LENGTH OF CANAL MADE IN IRELAND OUT FROM DUBLIN. ENORMOUS LABOUR INTENSIVE CONSTRUCTION. IRELAND IS MOSTLY LIMESTONE. MOST EXTENSIVE SYSTEM OF CAVES OF ANY NATION STATE EUROPE. WHEN IT WAS FILLED WITH WATER IT WAS SOON EMPTY. IT HAD NOT BEEN LINED WITH PUDDLED CLAY.
MONUMENTAL STUPIDITY.
VENICE [THOSE BRUSH WORKS ARE A DELIGHT]: IN THE 1920s UMPTEEN MILES OF CANALS WERE FILLED TO MAKE WAY FOR THE AUTOMOBILE AGE. AS THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH SPACE. TALK ABOUT IMPRISONED MINDS.)
IT IS FASCINATING THAT CANAL INCOME WAS OBTAINED FROM CIRCULATING WATER TO FACTORIES. NEVER OCCURED TO ME! SO OBVIOUS.
THE NUMBER OF BUILDINGS WRECKED BY AERIAL BOMBARD WHICH IN WHOLE OR PART COLLAPSED INTO CANALS WAS, I SUSPECT, EFFECTIVELY NEGLIGIBLE. FOR ALL THE HIGHLY INTELLIGENT ENGINEERING AND LOGISTICAL SKILL OF THE NAZIS, WHILE THEY HAD MAPS OF RAILWAYS THEN LITTLE DAMAGE WAS DONE. NEWS STREET STATION - THAT ALTARPIECE DESTROYED BY INDIGINATE SOCIOPATHS - WAS NOT BASHED, DITTO SNOW HILL, MOOR STREET, CURZON FREIGHTAGE YARDS. NEITHER WAS PADDINGTON, EUSTON, WATERLOO, KINGS CROSS, etc.. SALTLEY RAIL YARDS AND GAS WORKS ANOTHER MASSIVE TARGET. (IT IS SURPRISING THEY DIDN'T SET AN EXPLOSIVE NETWORK WAY AHEAD KNOWING FULL WELL THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT WOULD DECLARE WAR. BETWEEN A FEW GAS WORKS, RAILWAY BRIDGES, CANAL BRIDGES - ALSO THE FEW ROAD BRIDGES - THE IMPACT WOULD BE CRIPPLING. THE TECHNOLOGY EXISTED.
[SPEAKING OF COAL: ALL ELECTRICITY IN GERMANY WAS GENERATED BY COAL BURNING. AN OBIOUS FIRST TARGET, BUT NOT TOUCHED.])
THERE ARE CANALS WHICH TAKE 14' BEAM BARGES. I MEAN OTHER THAN RIVERS. WHATEVER THAT STRETCH IS FROM 'SPAGHETTI JUNCTION' SOUTH, ISN'T THAT FOR BARGE GUAGE? (WHAT KIND OF A DOLT WOULD PUT A CONCRETE SUPPORT COLUMN IN THE CANAL? I COULD HARDLY BELIEVE MY EYES.)
IN SO MANY WAYS THE CANAL SYSTEM WAS HISTORICALLY OUTMODED WHEN RAILWAYS GOT FULL BELT AFTER STEVENSON'S ROCKET (THE ENGINE WITH THE BLOKE MARCHING QUICK AHEAD WAVING A FLAG).
WITH RAIL IT IS A SIMPLE MATTER OF BEING ON A FLAT OR AT MOST WITH A RAMP. AT 50 mph L-B IS MAYHAP AVERAGE 2> HRS. THERE IS NO WAY A CANAL BOAT, EVEN HAULING 30 tonnes (x2 with butty) CAN COMPETE. THE WAR ABNORMALITY WAS A DIFFERENT SITUATION AND AS CROMWELL POINTS OUT, IRONICALLY IT SAVED MANY CANALS.
THE FACT THERE IS EXTANT 2k MILES OF CANALS IS SORT OF FANTASTIC. THERE IS NO REASON FOR DILAPIDATION. AS CROMWELL OBSERVED THEY ARE AN INVALUABLE ASSET FOR THE QUALITY OF HOMELIFE. (SINCE THOSE WORK DO SO IN ORDER TO LIVE [NOT VICE VERSA].)
INCIDENTALLY, I SEEM TO RECALL, UNLESS I DREAMED IT, THE REFURBISHED PIPES FOR THE MIGHTY TOWN HALL ORGAN WERE RECENTLY TRANSPORTED BY CANAL TO GAS ST?
REGARDING THE DUDLEY AREA SYSTEM: THAT IS A REMARKABLE ACCOMPLISHMENT SINCE SO MANY CAVERNS WERE VERY UNSTABLE.
ONE ROUTINELY HEARD ROOF FALLS NEAR AND FAR.
THE FIRST MINE STEAM ENGINE BY WATT IS LIKELY ON THE THIRD AND BOTTOM LEVEL (DOWN). I DON'T KNOW HOW EXTENSIVE THE POLICE DIVING TRAINING IS IN TERMS OF FLIPPING ABOUT. IT SEEMS TO ME A SIMPLE SOLUTION IS A SMALL SUBMERSIBLE WHICH CAN MOVE IN THREE DIRECTIONS (OR SIX:F-B-U-D-L-R).
NIFTY PROJECT.
IS THERE A SITE FOR PX OF THE REJUVENATED SYSTEM?

THX CROMWELL FOR ANTICIPATED POSTINGS.
NICE THOUGHT OF THE LUMP OF COAL BEING CHUCKED OVER THE WALL DURING THOSE DAYS OF SURVIVAL STRUGGLE.
 
The Dudley tunnel after being closed for a number of years reopened in 1973 after 10 years of disuse in my opinion it’s the best and most exiting canal tunnel I have ever been in approaching it from the Tipton end through as short tunnel it soon opens out into a deep tree lined chamber ….The Castle Mill Basin and from here there were smaller tunnels which connected to various limestone workings one of these tunnels which is 1,227 yards goes to the Wrens Nest Basin from if you wished you could climb to the surface up a spiral staircase ……but carrying on from Castle Mill Basin you go through another large tunnel some 2,942yards long after passing through two large natural caverns which at one time you could land on and if you were brave enough go exploring …..if not carry on again which leads you to the top of Park Head locks….. Go their today and they run trips into the old limestone workings and have dramatised it quite a bit with Madam Tussard like figures of the old miners hacking the limestone from the caverns ….with all the sound effects.
Lappal Tunnel which once was on the route of Dudley canal was the 4th longest tunnel in Britain at 3,795 Yards but it collapsed and was never rebuilt in the 1960’s two teenagers canoed their way in and got up the where the roof had caved in took some photographs and got out again……..I have got the pics somewhere in an old newspaper
I read somewhere that in 1972 while the M23 was under construction they found miles of tunnels and nine huge caverns and a 44 acre underground lake directly in line with the new road……..When it was explored they found 28 canal boats which were all going rotten and a vast collection of stone mining machinery all belonging to the Stone quarrying exploits of Baron Hyton …at the end of the 18th century what they did with all of it.. I do not know ……
On the subject of bridge wear on the iron and stonework caused by the towropes
I do recall on one left hand turn many years ago a steel rod was inserted in to the ground with a 3-4 foot wooden roller put on in …….so it would be like a vertical rolling pin and the towrope rolled around it ..why the idea was never put in the edges of the bridges makes you wonder why or was it a case of money
I am pretty sure the stables for the canal horses at Gas Street Basin were 3 stories high
And the horses reached them by going up ramps.
Just imagine the vast amount of labour that was involved in building the canals it was estimated that in 1790 over 50,000 navies were at work in various parts of the country and as they moved into rural communities the country folk lived in fear of rape, theft and murder……. crops raided …chickens and livestock plundered even reports of drunken navvies driving herds of cows into the canal to help with the puddling (churning the clay) ……but it was not all bad as money came into the village communities and Public houses sprang up all the way down the canal system
And the good old canal side pub was born…..
Hmid.. the pic of the women pushing off was taken in WW2 on the Grand Union and did ya know in Venice there is no sewage system so the toilets are flushed and emptied with the incoming and outgoing of the tides (and they go on about pollution)
Bolinder’s were still going strong in the 1960’s as this Ad shows (Photo 1) new generation of engine
Photo 2 …..Remember the horse treads on the bridges round Brum?
 
The Old Wharf, BIRMINGHAM

This Photograph is of the old wharf in Birmingham about 1800 & looking towards New Street from Bridge Street.
The old wharf was situated in the square formed by (Broad St). (Easy Row & Suffolk St). (Holliday St). (Bridge St).
You can see on the sky line "BIG BRUM" THE CLOCK TOWER & THE DOME OF THE COUNCIL HOUSE.
The wharf was originally constructed about the 1700s & used mainly as A COAL depot. The offices of the Birmingham Canal Company were sited alongside the wharf in 1773.
The canal basin was laid out in the shape of a tuning fork (you can see one of the arms on the right of this picture.
The building in the foreground once used by the Cadbury Bros before they moved to Bournville. they were there in 1847 mainly due to the canal and easy connection to the major ports. 32years later they moved to the now famous factory in the suburbs "BOURNEVILLE MODEL WORKERS VILLAGE".
The wharf like the canals fell in to decline , eventually filled in around 1920s, when Birmingham Corporation purchased the site with plans for a new shopping street which included the new municipal building to be as we know it now BROAD STREET.
 
That is a great photo Aston. If you look at the attatched link 1890 map you can see pretty much everything in the photo. Eagle Iron Works, houses rounding the bend at top of Suffolk St., stores on Suffolk St.
The basin in the photo is the upper basin, the lower one can be seen on the other side of the wharf on the map. Sheds can also be picked out on the photo. I wondered what that area looked like. I think the photo must have been taken from a building window just below where it says school on the map. Seems too high to be from the bridge on Bridge Street. The photo seems contemporary with the 1890 Ordenance Survey.
If you click on the map and move around you will see that many other parts of the canal system have been filled in.

MAP :https://www.british-history.ac.uk/mapsheet.asp?sheetid=10098&ox=374&oy=1787&zm=1&czm=1&x=359&y=185
 
Nice Photo Aston, enclosed is 1860 map I have marked the Bridge St Cadbury Factory in yellow, I have a detailed map of the inside of the factory in my book 1831- 1931 Cadbury a Century of Progress all about the factory in Bull St and Bridge St before they moved to Bournville packed full of rare pics (but I will post that some other time)
 
Aston's picture is a real cracker, but we're getting confused over dates. The map Rupert has given a link to probably is about 1890, but Cromwell's map is proably moreorless the same, rather than 1860s. You can tell from the railway line which runs from New Street Station via Five Ways towards Selly Oak and Worcester - you can see the cutting next to Allport St. Now the railway was not authorised until 1881, and was not opened until 1885, so it wouldn't have been built before 1884 at the earliest.
Peter
 
I thought that the photo and the 1890 Ordenance Survey may be about the same date because you can pick out most features. I think that 1800 would be a little early for a picture of that quality or any quality for that matter. Did not photography start around the 1830s. However it most probably is an early time exposure as there does not seem to be anything alive in it. Probably could not capture anything moving. Since the Ordenance Survey is dated 1890 and the work to achieve it would have been over previous years, would 1870/80 be about right. The photo could be later of course.
Interesting to see where Cadbury's moved to from their orginal factory in Crooked Lane just by Dale End. I suppose the construction of Martineau Street had some thing to do with it. Is there any more info on the picture?
Could it have been taken from the old Cadbury's building?
 
I would date photo about 1900's but without actual date... anyones guess
and their is no point in guessing. Aston most of the Wharfs were designed like a "tuning fork" as you say........the one in Bordesley was
 
The only clues I can find which help to narrow down the dateing are the features on the sky line. BIG BRUM the clock tower of the Museum and Art Gallery and the dome on thr top of the Council House were completed in the late 1880s, ChristChurch's spire is still visible on the right of the picture which would sugest that the pic pre-dates 1898 when the Church was demolished.
So the date would be between 1880 & 1898
 
Most of the Boulton & Watt canal side engines ended up in the USA.
The old Boulton & Watt Beam pumping engine at Bowyer Street Bordesley (at the bottom of the Coventry Road) which was installed in Sep 1843 was replaced in 1898 It should have ended up in the grounds of Birmingham University but over a wrangle of who should pay to move it their it was eventually sold to the Ford Motor Company in 1928 who bought it for £500 and put it in the Henry Ford Museum, Dearborn USA
The same applied to The Ashted Pumping station built in 1812 eventually sold to Henry Ford and ended up in Michigan.
Walking along these towpaths the other day I came across the First Toll point in Birmingham and the old Headquarters of Fellows, Morton & Clayton in the 1930’s which mainly handled the cargoes to and fro from Birmingham to London
And so the camera returns
Pic 1 The Old Fellows Morton & Clayton Depot at Fazeley 1930’s
Pic 2 and 3 Photo’s I took the other day 2007 of where F.M & C's were
 
Photo I shows the last iron bridge to be completed on the Grand Union canal (it was once called Warwick and Birmingham canal) at Bordesley heading towards Bowyer St were the pumping station is just out of site on the right
Photo’s 2,3 and 4 are of the old toll station; Bordesley Wharf was straight on and turn right …..if you take a look at pic 3 that is were they keep the old steel barge for getting the litter from the canals
 
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On this 1887 map I have marked were the Boulton & Watt Beam Engine was......it feed the canal from a brick line culvert pumping from a well which was 80 feet deep .....the cost of the engine with all the work involved to install it was about £5,196
 
Great Piccies in #125, Crommie. I particularly like the first one - very aesthetic.

Here's another of those steel "litter" barges being used as a skip during building work at Cumbrian Wharf...
 
Nice Photo Oisin, the pic you like I cropped it quite a lot, took at 6 million pixels so I shrunk it down a lot and it was dark and raining.
If anyone wandered why I put the River Rea photo on,(the Grand Union goes over the top) on page 2 post 13
I have put another pic by the side of it taken recently photo was taken at a point on the Grand Union in between Fazeley Depot and Warwick Bar the Rea Aqueduct from their you can walk the Rea path along the top of the embankment (from Bordesley Junction its less than a five hundred yards)
Pic 1 is the River Rea going under the Grand Union
Pic 2 is what you would think is just decay and neglect but this building got a direct hit in WW2 as confirmed by my ARP map
 
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The painted pictures that appear on a lot of the old Narrow boats if you notice are not scenes from England but appear to be European, their origins appeared to be in the late 1700’s. It is not known where the traditional paintings which the canal people painted and decorated their crafts came from, the castles and the roses. I have asked in the canal side museums but no one seems to know the answer. Similar paintings can be found in the Balkans.
The term “Water Gipsy” was hated by the boatmen and their families but I wonder if it was because of their background, some coming from the fairgrounds or gypsy families who might have been attracted to the traveling life and were use to keeping horses. Not a lot is written about the early life of the canal people but former Navies who built the canal’s if you think about it would have made the ideal people to employ, to work the canals as they knew how they were built, whoever these people had their own code of conduct and standard of dress which they all strictly adhered to and the women mostly wore white bonnets but when Queen Victoria died most of them changed to black and stayed that way for the next 30 years.
The first Pic show a young women in traditional canal style dress in the 1800's
Other Pic’s show the traditional paintings
 
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Another great piccy from the past. I can't image those being her everyday clothes though, judging from how clean and frilly they are they're more likely to be "Sunday Best".
 
If you look at reply #47 you will see a picture of the Old Wharf from the other direction showing the entrance gates and offices taken from Paradise Street. The tram lines are not in the photo so it is earlier than the 1890 Ordnance Survey link. The map even shows the light cluster in the road. I wonder what the air shaft on the map was for. The Burgum add shows a horse pulling one of the big old single axle carts that used to lumber past me on Washwood Heath Road in the 40s.

https://www.british-history.ac.uk/mapsheet.asp?sheetid=10098&ox=383&oy=1738&zm=1&czm=1&x=666&y=76

The picture of the gates must be pre 1876 which was when the horse tram line opened to Bournebrook.
 
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Rupert the Air Duct is for the tunnel from New St Station
 
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The more I look at the photos the more I believe that this occupation was peopled by ordinary folk. Families decent and roughneck probably in the same proportion as other trades. Difficulty in the schooling of children may have set the ratio a little to one side. The fact that women were along would have gentled the condition don't you think.
 
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