Canals of Birmingham

[DavidGrain]

I understand thaty they are no longer used and some of the wooden doors have been bricked up rather than replaced.

 

[Radiorails]

I would imagine that the open water doorways in bridges over the rivers and canals maybe have been developed during WW2 when often mains water pipes were damaged by bombing. Equally it might be that some are now boarded up due to one or two factors i.e. low water supply or most likely the large factories that were once in the area have now gone and the fire risks are much less.

Of course all this is conjecture as I do not live in the City. :biggrin:

 

[Vivienne14]

This one on Old Snow Hill looks like it's set into a relatively modern railing - looks about 1960s to me, but could be wrong. So maybe some have been kept as a contingency? Viv.

 

[ellbrown]

Viv - it certainly looks like a 1960s railing!

 

[Vivienne14]

That's interesting Ell, it looks like there are fire doors on both of the railings as well as via the brick wall too. Viv.

 

[rosie]

The ones I saw today on Iknield Port Rd. are padlocked.
(I'm never sure how to spell that!)
rosie.

 

[DavidGrain]

The 1960s was when the canals in Birmingham were starting to be opened up. Prior to that the only access was in Gas Street. The need for fire access doors was no longer necessary as the fire brigade now had access direct to the towpaths. In fact the fire doors shown in the railings were no longer required as hoses could just as easily be dropped over the top of the railings and the pumps on the fire engines had undoubtedly become more powerful.

 

[Radiorails]

The photo of the padlocked access door suggests, to me, that it is still in use. Padlocks present little challenge to firefighters as bolt croppers are carried on most fire engines. Most likely the bricked in or sealed doors are in former highly industrialized and now redeveloped areas which have become principally residential with a low fire risk. I am interested to know - hopefully other readers are as well. I am sure, David, that there must have been many other places where wharves existed that allowed a fire engine to get close to a canal. Many large factories had their own fire brigade and would have ensured good access if they were situtated canalside. Part of a firefighters job is to know his patch, just like a policeman.

To put the large diameter 'suction' hoses over the railrings, rather than through the doors, would not be best practice. The 'U' turn of the rigid hose going over the railings or wall and the extra height thus acheived above the water would not yield the best flow of water needed at a large fire. Next time anyone is passing by their local fire department ask some of the guys there, most are usually happy to talk about their profession.

I have spent many hours in my working life in harbours, rivers and on boats lifting water to supply to fires, so I do write with a little knowledge. :biggrin:

 

[paul stacey]

Were they not introduced during one or other of the World Wars??.

 

[mikejee]

I thought they were introduced in WW2, or rather just before WW2 in preparation for it

 

[Morturn]

The photo of the padlocked access door suggests, to me, that it is still in use. Padlocks present little challenge to firefighters as bolt croppers are carried on most fire engines. Most likely the bricked in or sealed doors are in former highly industrialized and now redeveloped areas which have become principally residential with a low fire risk. I am interested to know - hopefully other readers are as well. I am sure, David, that there must have been many other places where wharves existed that allowed a fire engine to get close to a canal. Many large factories had their own fire brigade and would have ensured good access if they were situtated canalside. Part of a firefighters job is to know his patch, just like a policeman.

To put the large diameter 'suction' hoses over the railrings, rather than through the doors, would not be best practice. The 'U' turn of the rigid hose going over the railings or wall and the extra height thus acheived above the water would not yield the best flow of water needed at a large fire. Next time anyone is passing by their local fire department ask some of the guys there, most are usually happy to talk about their profession.

I have spent many hours in my working life in harbours, rivers and on boats lifting water to supply to fires, so I do write with a little knowledge. :biggrin:

I think you are right here, you can only suck water up about 25 feet. Most canal bridges are around 12 to 15 feet from the water surface, so the fire brigade pumps would be working quite hard already, adding the extra height of the parapet could make a significant difference.

I have a relative who is a fireman, Ill ask him if the door are still in use.

 

[Vivienne14]

Also would they have been along canals in areas where ammunition was being manufactured? And/or along canal routes where it was being transported along the waterways? Viv.

 

[paul stacey]

Very true Viv, and Brum was an arms manufacturing centre then.paul

 

[David Weaver]

Thinking back prior to the war and afterwards I don't remember too many railings or fences around the cut. We just went down the towpath and started to get into whatever trouble was available. New fangled padlocks wouldn't have stopped us anyway, we'd have just climbed over whatever was in the way. Kind regards, David.

 

[Speedy23]

IIRC, these doors used to have a small yellow placard stating the lift (the height from the water surface to the eye of the pump inlet) so that the fire service pump operator could estimate how much water he could provide from the canal. I don't think that the doors were in any way connected with ammunition production per se but remember that the inner city canals usually passed through built-up industrialised areas vulnerable to rapid fire spread. Couple this with the fact that the water supply to street fire hydrants was often disrupted due to bomb damage to water mains and it can be seen that the canals would be a valuable additional source of water for fire fighting during air raids. There were also static tanks, etc. provided for this purpose, prominently marked with a saltire outline showing the letters EWS - emergency water supply.

There was also at least one narrowboat converted to pump water directly from the canal, and of course these could supply lines of hose laid along the towpath and up to street level via the aforementioned doors.

 

[Vivienne14]

Thanks Speedy. I expect canals would inevitably fall within enemy targets with all the industry located along them and their use in transporting war products. Here are two Nov 1940 confidential reports of hits along the Grand Union; one near Adderley Street gasworks and the other on Tyseley Wharf damaging a trench-like shelter. Viv.

 

[DavidGrain]

If we are talking of possible wartime damage to the canals of Birmingham there was an obvious target which the Germans never managed to hit just east from Deep Cutting Junction towards Farmers Bridge Junction. At this point the New Street tunnel runs just below the canal and a direct hit here with high explosives would have caused the canal to drain into the railway putting both the canal and railway networks in Birmingham out of action.

 

[Radiorails]

Given the narrow width of the canals in Britain I think that canals would not be a prime target; it just happened that a canal was hit when the city was bombed. However, the other side of the coin is that the German river and canal systems were targets by Allied aircraft crews - they were so much larger and more easily identified. However, it is quite possible that narrow boats and their crews were strafed by marauding aircraft just as the SW coastal towns of England were.

One target the Germans luckily avoided attacking was Denver Sluice in NW Norfolk. Had that been badly damaged much of the Fens and surrounding areas would have been in trouble.
https://www.ousewashes.info/sluices/denver-sluice.htm

Speedy: If you look at the pics in this tread you will see the yellow marking plates giving details for firefighters. They are similar in many ways to the hydrant marking plates found on walls, posts and other street furniture.

 

[Vivienne14]

David, something to be very thankful for that it didn't happen.

Canals in themselves would have been useful indicators of possible targets too, as this archive extract from the BBC WW2 Peoples War mentions in relation to the BSA factory located alongside the canal. Just shows you the hazards of moonlight .....

"On another occasion and another long spell in the shelter, the bombers attacked Birmingham again. This time it was the moonlight which brought about the destruction. The BSA motorcycle factory in Small Heath was built right alongside the canal. From the air, the canal systems glistened like silver threads in the moonlight and the bombers had only to follow them to their targets. By now of course, the BSA was making munitions and it was flattened".

Viv.

 

[DavidGrain]

Given the narrow width of the canals in Britain I think that canals would not be a prime target;

The canal system was still in WWII an extensive transport network Thomas Clayton boats were bringing oil from the Stanlow refineries to Birmingham ans the Black Country until the 1960s and much coal was still being trransported by canal until that time.

Books have been written about the women who worked the boats during WWII moviong important goods fopr the war effort

See https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens-life/10231833/The-girls-working-the-canals-during-WW2.html for a recent article

 

[Vivienne14]

Like the article very much David. Although she says it was quite an experience and felt guilty for enjoying the job when others were getting killed, her job can't have been without its own risks and dangers too. The photograph ('phoney' as she calls it) must have been a great PR image for home front workers. Some of the girls don't seem too pleased, probably because they'd have liked to have first changed into a frock, done lipstick, makeup, hair etc ................ Viv.

 

[Radiorails]

I agree David, waterways were good landmarks from the air but main line railways were even better as many towns were not served by canals and rivers which often meander.

The women who worked on the waterways during WW2 are mostly unsung heroes. They did a very hard job and have received, as most civilian services also have, little praise and publicity for their wartime efforts.

The canal system is in part of my forbears history although having lived by the sea since I was sixteen I rarely get chance to visit any. The BCN was not an easy haunt for me: it is a large system was busy, industrialized and one was not always welcomed when 'trespassing' just being curious. My last foray for photos and research into canals and their industries was done in the Potteries in 1954 - the area is now unrecognizable from old pics, generally speaking. I did take a good look at the Staffs & Worcs canal in the Stourton, Stewponey and as far as Stone back in 1994. I stayed at Stourton Castle with my bedroom looking across meadows to the canal at Stewponey. I also took the opportunity to visit the canal and its buildings at the Black Country Museum. A memorable time on a lovely canal. Almost as good as The N&S Stratford where I spent many childhood days.:friendly_wink:

 

[Vivienne14]

This extract from the BBC WW2 People's War tells us about an enemy hit near Cadbury's factory in Bournville. Where would this nation (and our soldiers) have been without their chocolate ration?

"The oddest incident occurred at Cadbury’s factory which had its own railway line and canal for transporting its products. Both the railway and the canal passed on a bridge over a road and a bomb had fallen right through the canal, which had the effect of pulling the plug and all the water flooded into the factory".

 

[norfolk brummie]

November 1940 was about the same time that our home in Tyseley (Blytheswood Road) was destroyed by a land mine. Could it have been the same night?

 

[Morturn]

This extract from the BBC WW2 People's War tells us about an enemy hit near Cadbury's factory in Bournville. Where would this nation (and our soldiers) have been without their chocolate ration?

"The oddest incident occurred at Cadbury’s factory which had its own railway line and canal for transporting its products. Both the railway and the canal passed on a bridge over a road and a bomb had fallen right through the canal, which had the effect of pulling the plug and all the water flooded into the factory".

View attachment 91923

This incident has made me wonder for some time now, you can still see where the bridge was repaired with concrete. It was certainly a shot and half to get a bomb to land exactly in the middle of the canal, and in the middle of a canal aqueduct. I have often wonder is this was an act espionage, I understand hat bombing in WWII was not that exact, some being off target by twenty miles or so, yet this was spot on to within a few feet.

I think this section of canal is over forty miles long between locks, so it must have been some flood.

 

[cookie273uk]

Morturn, it was probably just pure chance, which was what bomb aiming was about in them days, do not suppose the bomb aimer knew the exact spot where his bombs actually landed. Eric

 

[Radiorails]

li can be seen from the link that the Worcs & B/Ham canal is 30 miles in length. The first set of locks from Worcester Bar (Gas Street) is at Tardebigge. However I would think that there were stanking facilities (stop planks) at Westhill tunnel and maybe Kings Norton where the Stratford Canal joined. This would limit the flooding a little one hoped. I believe it took almost six weeks to get the cut open again.
Not sure about how any homes and the factory fared however. Someone might know. :friendly_wink:

https://www.jim-shead.com/waterways/canal.php?wpage=W-B

 

[Radiorails]

This extract from the BBC WW2 People's War tells us about an enemy hit near Cadbury's factory in Bournville. Where would this nation (and our soldiers) have been without their chocolate ration?

It is worth remembering that Cadbury were not the only large chocolate manufacturer we had. There was Joseph Fry of Bristol, Joseph Rowntree of York and many smaller companies so the lads were well looked after. Actually there was a period when my father was stationed in the UK that he sent his chocolate ration to me. Of course Nanny rationed it out so I was not allowed to gorge myself. :biggrin: Oh! golly! I still have a very strong fondness for chocolate today - naughty, but nice! :friendly_wink:

 

[mikejee]

As I remember it the government divided up the county into areas to save transport costs, and in areas near (or assigned to) the Fry factory, as my family was, you only got Frys chocolate and presumably in Brum you only got Cadburys. etc

 

[Vivienne14]

So us Brummies were left with the soggy chocolate then Mike!
This photo shows a bit more of the Bournville canal/railway bomb damage.


Prof Carl Chinn wrote an article for the B'ham Mail on the bomb which hit the BSA factory and it includes an interesting photo of pumping water from the canal to put out fires. It doesn't say if the photo is of the BSA incident (looks more like a practice to me) but it gives a good idea of using the canal for this purpose. Viv.