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Windows 10

My desktop is German. It came with a W8.1 disc and another disk with programmers I might want. I did not load any of these programmes but did install the few that I really needed - browsers, Adobe, VLC and one or two others. There were no M/Soft 'office 'type programmes on the W8.1 CD so I downloaded Open Office which is similar but free. Office Libre is another version but you only need one or the other.

Whilst everything dowloaded from the CD was in German it was easy enough to change into English - in fact you can have a many languages as you speak or understand for that matter. Like most pc things it is just a click away. .
 
Alan,

My desktop was built in the UK, but I have a Greek keyboard on it. It's actually an American layout with Greek characters added, so no pound sign and the " and @ keys are reversed. And it still doesn't have a euro sign so I have to use the Alt key. Not sure what we will do if we get the new drachma! Open Office is very good, as is VLC.

Maurice
 
Maurice,
You can often find missing symbols in the Character Map. My keyboard is a small one, no bells and whistles, but it is quiet!. I get fractions and Euro signs there.
 
Alan,

Many ways of skinning the same cat! For the euro I generally type 0128 (on the numeric pad) whilst holding the Alt key down. A lot of the time I find it quicker to type "euro" unless I really need the euro character. Likewise I will generally use GBP instead of the pound sign, but it's a matter of convenience or necessary usually! I have to say that I don't like laptop keyboards and prefer to plug in one of my full size keyboards. It's what you get used to I suppose.

Because I am fairly deaf, I use the phone as little as possible and my main method of communication is email and it has the advantage of recording the communication. I have a webcam and never use it. For one thing, broadband in this village is only 1.6mps on a good day and on a wet winter Sunday afternoon when the local village kids are playing internet games, it is only a few hundred mps. If I want to do a substantial download, I do it overnight.

Maurice
 
I remember the 1980s when I had good old MS-DOS 6.22 and Windows 3.1 on screen like the image below. It was all so simple back then ....
image.jpg
 
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Dead right, Phil, and put it on one of today's machines and it would go at warp speed! Mind you, so does almost everything else except Windows! I'm sure all that extra hardware speed is only added to create profits for Microsoft - a high speed money printing press.

Maurice
 
Just to sum up the Windows 10 situation.

The Windows 10 FINISHED product is not available yet. Some of you may have got the little icon on your Windows task bar saying "Get Windows 10" but this is only to register your interest. Windows 10 is not likely to be available until July or August.

There are "beta" versions of Windows 10 available, but as this is the unfinished product I would not suggest anyone moving to it unless they have a spare computer, or have a decent computer technical knowledge.

Note that when Windows 10 (the final product) is available the upgrade will be free for Windows 7 and Windows 8 customers. However it is a large download (3Gb) which will take a long time on a slow broadband connection.

Note also that if you DO move to Windows 10 and don't like it, there will probably be no route to take you back to Windows 7 or Windows 8, so you will have to stay on Windows 10. Bear that in mind.

Note also that every version of Windows (or indeed any software) will have teething problems and bugs in it when first released so you may wish to wait for a few months until some of the problems have been fixed, and also drivers for hardware like printers and other devices is fully available. If you do upgrade to Windows 10 as soon as it comes out you may find some of your devices, like a printer, may stop working.

The upgrade to Windows 10 will be free for a year so there is no rush to install it as soon as it is out. Note it is more important for Microsoft that we all upgrade (to give them less software products to support) than it is for us to upgrade, so don't feel under any pressure to upgrade.

For those considering going to Windows 10 it may be a good idea to take an "image" of your hard disk before doing so. I use a product called Macrium Reflect Free Edition which will take an image of your complete hard drive (or selected partitions) and copy them to an external hard drive as one large "zipped" file.

At a later date you can "boot" your computer with the Macrium Reflect boot disk and restore your computer from this image. It can take only 10 or 15 minutes (depending on how much you backed up) to reinstall Windows using this sort of program. I have been using Macrium Reflect Free Edition for about 3 years to back up and restore all the computers in my house (about half a dozen of them) and it has been rock solid.

You can download it from here

https://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx

Note there are other programs available to make an image of your hard drive. Whichever one you choose it is a good idea to make an image in case Windows crashes or you get a nasty virus. You can reinstall Windows in minutes.

Note this is no substitute for making regular backups of your personal files which you should definitely do before upgrading to Windows 10.

If you have any more questions about Windows 10 just ask.
 
It's usually said that alternate versions of Windows aren't worth the bother of the upgrade although you have to decide which you think are the good and bad. The example usually given is Win 98 good, Win Me bad, Win XP good, Win Vista bad, Win 7 good, Win 8 bad. Windows 9 was supposed to be the version that got over all of the troubles of Windows 8 but that took so long in development that it disappeared and we get Windows 10. The question is, is Win 10 going to be everything that Win 9 should have been or just the next lame duck? I doubt anyone will find out til it's out of beta testing and most companies aren't going to touch it for a year after it's released.
 
Should be getting my download July 29th, so the notification states. Still have another couple of laptops on XP and Vista so won't be stuck if I don't like W10. To be honest for the last three years I've rarely used W8.1 as I use my iPad for most everything I need.
 
I like windows 7 and intend to stay with it as long as possible. I (and I suspect many other non-high tech users) am fed up with windows constantly changing their operating systems. What was wrong with XP ! what is wrong with win 7, nothing, so why not leave things as they are ? Eric
 
Eric,

I'm an ex-tech and I totally agree with you, as will anyone in the recording business. As for Win 10, I suspect it will be a bodge - they will try to bring back some of the desktop features of Win 7 into Win 8 to accomodate all the moans and groans that Win 8 produced and initially fail miserably. I will wait a few months and see what sort of responses it gets from those in the techie world.

Maurice
 
cookie273uk said:
I like windows 7 and intend to stay with it as long as possible. I (and I suspect many other non-high tech users) am fed up with windows constantly changing their operating systems. What was wrong with XP ! what is wrong with win 7, nothing, so why not leave things as they are ? Eric
Click to expand...

There are lots of reasons for regular upgrades that don't involve what you see. There were supposed to be serious changes in the security system in some of the OS changes. I get the feeling the new version will push toward online rather than internal storage as everything seems to be going that way. There would have to be serious changes if people start using large programs that only work online because some of the program itself is kept there. There are also things like subscription licensing, cloud storage, and pressures from various governments for access to all sorts of things.
 
wam, thanks for explanation, pity they cannot do it in the form of an update rather than change the whole op system, I will be 85 this month and constantly having to adapt to new OS does not come easy and takes some of the pleasure of using my PC. but I repeat I will hang on to windows 7 for as long as I can, I like it and more important I understand it. Eric
 
cookie273uk said:
I like windows 7 and intend to stay with it as long as possible. I (and I suspect many other non-high tech users) am fed up with windows constantly changing their operating systems. What was wrong with XP ! what is wrong with win 7, nothing, so why not leave things as they are ? Eric
Click to expand...

One may say what was wrong with the engine in the Ford Anglia but it does not stop Ford (and others) producing new engines every few years. New engines have new features and utilize new technology, as does new versions of Windows.

Windows XP came out in 2001 (a long time ago in computer terms), and was based on older software and hardware technology that had been in Windows NT (a business operating system) before that. So the technology in Windows XP is now probably 15 or more years old.

But think back to what we did with computers then and what we do with them now.

Amongst the technology that has come along (or matured) in the last 11 years is Broadband, USB 3, DVD / Blu Ray, streaming technology, mp3 music, mp4 video, new internet technology (HTML5 for example), online gaming, larger RAM memory, larger hard disks, SSD drives, online shopping, and more and more and more.

You say "what was wrong with XP". But Windows XP was mainly a 32 bit operating system (though a 64 bit version was available for some users). But a 32 bit operating system can only support less than 4Gb of RAM memory, but many people now want 8Gb of memory, or 16Gb of memory, or even 32Gb of memory (or more).

Many people who don't work in computers see Windows as one "product", but in fact it is made up of hundreds and hundreds of small programs all working together, and each of these programs need updating to cope with new software and hardware and technology as it comes along. You cant keep "patching" an old product like Windows XP.

Sometimes you need to redesign the underlying "centre" or "core" of Windows (that most of us don't see) to cope with new modern hardware and software, and also to add more security. You can only do this by bringing out a new version of Windows.

Windows XP was basically a very insecure product (even more so now that Microsoft no longer support it) as it was developed in the days when security (particularly from the internet) was not such an issue. Anyone who cares about the security of their computer should have stopped using Windows XP years ago. Later versions of Windows now have security "built in" to the product (and I don't just mean anti virus) but security deep inside Windows to stop hackers being able to take advantage of "holes" in Windows. These extra security features are NOT built in to Windows XP and never will be.

THAT is what is wrong with Windows XP and why everyone should get off it.

Like you I am on Windows 7 and plan to stay there for a while as to me it is the best home operating system Microsoft product (better than Windows XP)
 
I still use a laptop using W7 for all my office type work, MS Office, Internet banking etc. as I find the use of the mouse pointer more accurate. However, I use a tablet more and more for browsing Internet and emails and I think the days of the Laptop are limited. I am certain the tablet will be developed more and more. My laptop seems to take longer to start up in the mornings even though I regularly run maintenance programs. Tablets start instantly so why cant windows.
 
guilbert53, thanks for explanation on why OS are forever changing. I suppose we all have varying reasons for purchasing a PC and when you are 'low' tech like me you have to rely (and trust) the dealer selling you what's best for your particular needs, and NOT theirs. In my case off line I use it for storing pics and files (all backed up) and have a number of simulator games, my favourite being 'Flight Similar X' which needs a lot of speed and memory and therefore a rather expensive PC. On line I use it for online banking, e mails and the Forum, occasionally the odd purchase and general info, even tax my car. I recently changed to BT Infinity and someone has since told me I wasted my money as I do no not download films or music, just the occasional pic !! Eric
 
sheldontony said:
I still use a laptop using W7 for all my office type work, MS Office, Internet banking etc. as I find the use of the mouse pointer more accurate. However, I use a tablet more and more for browsing Internet and emails and I think the days of the Laptop are limited. I am certain the tablet will be developed more and more. My laptop seems to take longer to start up in the mornings even though I regularly run maintenance programs. Tablets start instantly so why cant windows.
Click to expand...

Most tablet operating systems are smaller than Windows. Android is cut down from a mix of two old versions of Linux. This means two things. 1. The operating system actually does less things. 2. It takes less time to load. This doesn't always mean that tablets load up instantly. My old tablet takes as long to load Android 4.0 as my newest PC (a few years old) takes to load Windows 7.
I don't know what the future for the tablet is. I'm not convinced that the manufacturers know either. Some seem to be aiming at replacing laptops (Windows Surface) others want to be portable internet TVs (Amazon ex-Kindle Fire) and more seem to have stuck with the basic portable internet access device. The last of these might be losing ground to the smartphone but since the only real difference there is in size and payment plan I doubt anyone much is worried about that. The problem with the high-end pseudo laptop is that the only real difference is in the keyboard or touch-screen. Size and price vary but not enough to make a difference.
 
sheldontony said:
My laptop seems to take longer to start up in the mornings even though I regularly run maintenance programs. Tablets start instantly so why cant windows.
Click to expand...
Done the following test ...

I pick up my laptop (two hands it's heavy), open the lid, it starts from hibenation, enter Windows password, click on Chrome icon, and I'm looking at the BHF within 37 secsonds.

I pick up my iPad (one hand it's very light), press the home button, enter pin number, touch Safari icon, and I'm looking at the BHF within 9 seconds.

I suppose 37 sec is not a long time and with iPads the internet is probably too easily available, you hear the email ding and you pick it up. With the laptop things are a bit more leisurely ....
friendly_wink.png
 
sheldontony said:
I use a tablet more and more for browsing Internet and emails and I think the days of the Laptop are limited. I am certain the tablet will be developed more and more. My laptop seems to take longer to start up in the mornings even though I regularly run maintenance programs. Tablets start instantly so why cant windows.
Click to expand...

In the days before tablets and smartphones Windows could handle the "simple" stuff (browsing and emails) but could also handle the very complex stuff (writing software programs, video editing etc.)

What the tablet and smartphone has done is enable people to do the "simple stuff" on a small device that they have with them all the time.

However that does not mean that the laptop (or desktop) has no future. People will still need to do some complex stuff that is hard to do on a smartphone or tablet, and a desktop PC can have a much larger screen than any smartphone or tablet. For example I have a couple of desktop PCs in my house with 24" screens (and a proper keyboard) and they are a pleasure to use, far nicer to use than my 7 inch Google Nexus.

Of course the lines between a laptop/desktop and a smartphone/tablet will blur and we already have devices that are part laptop, part tablet, like the Microsoft Surface mentioned above.

In fact Microsoft tried to make a version of Windows that was suitable for the laptop AND tablet with Windows 8 and failed miserably. They were just too early with it, maybe in a few years time the world would have been ready but not then. With Windows 10 they may have got the balance right with it being suitable for tablets or laptops.

Apple understood the difference between using a laptop/desktop and a smartphone/tablet by having one operating system for the laptop/desktop products, called OS X, and a different operating system for the smartphone/tablet products called iOS. Having these two different product works well, Microsoft tried to smash them together with Windows 8 and failed.

The fact that Microsoft are giving away Windows 10 to all users of Windows 7 and Windows 8 shows how worried they are about losing market share to things like Android, and the Apple products. In the past Microsoft made a lot of money from selling Windows, but now of course people get things like Android for free so it is hard to charge for an operating system nowadays.

Smartphones and tablets will continue to be popular, as people like walking round with their gadgets in their pocket or handbag, the only real limiting factor with these type of devices is the screen size, but having access to the world "in your hand" with a smartphone or tablet is something that is not going to go away and they will continue to be developed.

Also more and more of our personal files will be stored "in the cloud" and not on physical hard disks in our home. When a photo or video or other personal file is stored "in the cloud" you can access it anywhere in the world.
 
sheldontony said:
Tablets start instantly so why cant windows.
Click to expand...

I guess 3 main reasons:

1) Most laptops and desktop PCs have a hard disk in them and when you start your computer the disk has to start spinning and then all the programs are read off this disk and loaded into memory. A spinning hard disk is a fairly slow thing (in computer terms) so Windows will take a while to load.

Smartphones and tablets don't have a hard disk but Solid State Drives (SSDs). These have no moving parts so as soon as you turn on your smartphone or tablet the software can be loaded.

Note you can buy an SSD for a laptop or desktop, and in fact I have an SSD in the Windows PC on which I am typing this. It loads about twice as fast as my other Windows PC that has a hard disk in it. You can fit an SSD to most modern laptops or desktop PCs but you will need to install Windows on it. (Note: Windows XP does not support SSDs).

2) Hibernation. When we stop using our smartphone or tablet we don't fully turn them off but they go into a sort of sleep or hibernation mode. So when we pick them up to start using them again they wake from this hibernation mode very quickly (partly due to the SSD drives).

But when we stop using a Windows computer we often turn it fully off, so when we want to use it again it has to go through a full start up mode. In fact I bet if you turned your smartphone or tablet fully off it may take just as long to start up as Windows takes to start up.

Note you can set Windows to go into a hibernation mode instead of going fully off so when you want to use it again is starts up quicker. In fact the reason Windows 8 starts up so quickly is that when you switch it off it actually goes into a hibernation mode by default and so starts up quicker.

3) Start up programs and Windows "junk". The more you use Windows the more programs you install and the more what I will call "junk" (temporary files etc.) gets downloaded on your hard disk.

Many programs set themselves to autostart when Windows starts, which is fine for say your anti virus program but may not be for other programs that you don't want to autostart. The more programs that autostart (and the more "junk" you have on your PC) the longer it will take to start.

The only real solution is to do a complete reinstall of Windows to get rid of all the "junk". This is not that difficult nowadays as many laptops come with an image of Windows on your hard disk and a press of a button or two will reinstall Windows. However it is quite a lot of work because you will need to backup all your personal files before doing it, and make a note of all your userids and passwords and browser favorites and so on.

Also after the Windows reinstall you will need to install all the windows updates and install all the extra programs you want on your computer. You will also need to copy all the personal files back on to your PC.

All this can take between half a day and a day to get the computer back the way it was before you started. However it will mean the laptop will be back near the way it was when you bought it, and it should get its old speed back.
 
Hi Guilbert53,

your posts, particularly 52 and 53 were very interesting. Thanks for posting.

I have W8.1 desktop, which has no bloatware, and it use most of the time. I also have a Sony VAIO laptop with W7. I get on well with both as they are similar. I missed XP as I used it for ten years but you have to move along with things that are progressive.
Tablets and similar are too small for me and my mobile 'phone, a few years old now, is only used a simple 'phone when needed. I like to observe the world and not live in a 'cloud'.
 
I am in complete agreement with you Alan. One of the reasons I do not like the cloud is that it theoretically enables others to access &/alter your information. If it is on an external drive at your home then no-one else can easily access it. I have no great secrets to hide but was horrified some years ago to hear of a case where someone had written a book which referred to some dubious character. The dubious bloke went to court against the book and obtained an order against the book. As a result Kindle (or one of its predecessors) digitally altered the version of the book available to people who had already paid money to them for it. I know that "legally" the digital copy was not "sold" but rented (or whatever), thus "legally" enabling them to do this, but this proves that information in the cloud is not sacrosanct. . Apart from this, if there is some interruption of the servers then the information is for a while unavailable
 
guilbert53 said:
Note you can buy an SSD for a laptop or desktop, and in fact I have an SSD in the Windows PC on which I am typing this. It loads about twice as fast as my other Windows PC that has a hard disk in it. You can fit an SSD to most modern laptops or desktop PCs but you will need to install Windows on it. (Note: Windows XP does not support SSDs).

guilbert53

Is it easy or difficult to fit an SSD? Also, would I have to buy a version of Windows to put on it, or could I use my restore dvd`s to install Windows on it? Please bear in mind that I`m no techie! I did a re-install a few months ago & for a while it was fine, but now it`s so slow to boot up.
Click to expand...
 
Smudger said:
Is it easy or difficult to fit an SSD? Also, would I have to buy a version of Windows to put on it, or could I use my restore dvd`s to install Windows on it? Please bear in mind that I`m no techie! I did a re-install a few months ago & for a while it was fine, but now it`s so slow to boot up.
Click to expand...

Fitting an SSD is not difficult.

SSDs are the same physical size as hard disks that go in to laptops so on a laptop they can just go in the same slot in place of your existing laptop hard disk. This assumes you have easy access to your laptop hard disk (most can be accessed by removing a panel on the base of a laptop).

However because SSDs are the same size as laptop hard disks they are too small to go into a desktop hard disk slot so you need to buy a small adapter kit so the SSD can fit in the larger hard disk slot (some SSDs come supplied with this adapter kit, mine did, a Samsung).

While you can do a restore from a backup copy of Windows you are better (if possible) to do a clean install as Windows (later versions) need to set various options on (like Trim) to make sure it works ok on the SSD.

I did a clean Windows install on my SSD, but I have heard of people doing a restore and it seems to work. My Samsung also came with some restore software so it would copy the "old" Windows to the new SSD (this software would work for a laptop or a desktop).

My Samsung kit was like this one (not exactly the same model) but as you can see it comes with the extra "tray" to fit it in a desktop, and the conversion software. I assume other companies do similar products.

https://www.samsung.com/uk/consumer/memory-cards-hdd-odd/ssd/840-evo/MZ-7TE120KW

Note SSDs do cost more than hard disks so you could probably buy a 1Tb or 2Tb hard drive for the same price as a 250Gb SSD (rough guide I have not checked the prices).

You MAY need to look in your BIOS to make sure that certain settings are on for the SSD to work, but getting into the BIOS is easy and most modern computers do have these options on by default, but it is best to check. Loads of websites give advice about putting an SSD into a computer. There may even be some YouTube videos showing how to do it as well (I have not checked).

As I said above, Windows XP does not support SSDs (not sure about Vista) but Windows 7 and 8 do. Older computers MAY not support SSDs I don't know, but any modern PC should.
 
Not W10 - it applies to any operating system I guess - but in response to Mike concerns I also had concerns with a Google Picasa pictures programme. I used it fir my garden railway and personal pics. Then I discovered it was doing face recognition! Admittedly the very important people were often in newspapers and tv but I did not want my personal pics going elsewhere without mu knowledge. I removed all but the railway ;pics from the programme. All there is, it seems, is two railway sets of pics presently and although nearly 4000 people have looked me up there is nothing much to read.
 
I use the iCloud and the Google Drive and prefer the latter because it looks just like a 15Gb drive accessible from my Windows and iPad devices. I suppose anything you put on the internet can be seen somewhere. The pic below (which I pinched from somewhere) is a link to my bit of Gdrive. With ref to W10 I'll try it ... why not ?
 
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I have a 1tb SSd hybrid drive on my desktop, partitioned into 2 drives. I watched my son fit it and he turned my old drive into a spare drive partitioned. It did'nt seem that difficult to do either. All in all I have 9 drives on the go. One drive has the system installed on it, so that one is never used, also i have 2 external drives, 1 of which I use as a back up drive which is done automatically every Friday at 10am, I also use Google drive to put some unimportant files on, so if I do lose them for some reason, it would'nt bother me. Important stuff goes on my other external drive. plus, like most of us, I have the capability of burning stuff to CD/DVDs, so no shortage of space for me, my problem is finding stuff to store on them.

My drives.
 

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