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Water : Birmingham's water supply

Can I suggest these threads are merged.
There is is a lot of information and superb photos in the original thread quoted below:
 
Can I suggest these threads are merged.
There is is a lot of information and superb photos in the original thread quoted below:

One problem of the combination with other threads is that the Thread was started by a member of the Elan Links project, and she may want to keep it as it is.
 
This is a subject that has perplexed me too and would like to find out more. I understand that the land owners were paid compensation, but they chose then not to pay any of it to the resident farmers.

Looking at the place now, I do wonder about the sustainability of the farms, and if these were subsistence farming? Most certainly other farm locations high in the hills were being abandoned as other opportunities arose, for example Blaenhafren farm on the Severn was abandoned in the late 1940’s.

This was a massive construction project, at the time the largest in Europe, I do wonder if work or employment was made available to the farmers. I understand that working conditions and wages on the dams was quite good for the time.

It is certainly a research project worth doing.

I have quite a bit of info on the subject, but a very informative article on the construction project can be found on Simon Briercliffe’s Blog "Up the Os Road" under the heading Birmingham’s furthest outpost.

Off the top of my head, the bulk of the land flooded was on the Estate of Robert Lewis Lloyd, and therefore I believe the farmers would be his tenants. I think about 300 people were affected, of which some 30 were farmers, and maybe some miners.

The Schoolroom, The Chapel of Ease, the Baptist Chapel and some cottages were lost, and these may have been originally provided by the Lewis Lloyd family who were associated with the estate for donkey’s years. Birmingham Corporation provided replacements in the new model village.

Robert Lewis Lloyd upped sticks and moved to Otterhead, near Taunton. In 1908 it is said that the Birmingham Corporation sleepwalks in the Elan Valley carried upwards of 25,000 sheep of true Welsh breed.
 
Welcome Stephanie. Thanks for telling us about the project. Hopefully members will offer feedback of their visits.

I’d like to add that the importance of the Elan Valley in bringing a clean water supply to Birmingham was certainly reinforced at my Birmingham junior school in the 1960s as we built an enormous papier-mâché model of it. It dominated the classroom for months. Unfortunately we didn’t visit the site but had many lessons about it. Maybe it was recommended as part of the junior curriculum at one time as you also mention a lady sending you her Elan Valley homework.

Good to hear of the 5 year project and good luck to all involved. Viv.
Wow, that sounds like a project and a half. I've seen the model in Page Park - which is looking a bit sad I must say - but has some lovely details. Thanks for getting in touch
 
Thanks, it's probably due to my ignorance I'm afraid. I thought the profile name would link automatically to my email address but maybe it doesn't.
 
The tests at Nant y Gro were to find out how much explosive was needed to breach the dam. The dimensions of Nant y Gro were one-fifth the size of the Mohne Dam, and it was in a remote area which helped keep the trials secret.
 
A gentleman called David Brown has written a book about what happened to the families of the tenant farmers after they were displaced which is due to be published later this year. More information on this subject is held by the Radnorshire Society based in Rhayader. Thanks
 
I am happy to be advised on where the best place for this post would be but as a techincompetant I wouldn't trust my skills on being able to do anything about it :oops:
 
Three articles noted above, from the BBC News website of 2006, concern the request for a contribution from Birmingham Council to the Museum in the Elan Valley. Initially Birmingham Counil had refused but later changed its mind.

The article says that the Elan valley's residents, whose homes were flooded to make way for the water, were not paid compensation. Carad (Community Arts Rhayader and District) accused the city council of failing to grasp the significance of the Elan Valley. Carad chairman Peter Cox said: "We thought they (the city council) underestimated the significance of our approach and in a way underestimated people's feelings and the feelings of those who lost their homes in the valley.”

There are many references in the Archives of the opposition to the Bill from Birmingham, London, Hereford, Wales and others. There are also many reports of the Bill’s passage through the Commons and the Lords. There is a book written in 1898 giving much detail of the progress of the project in its planning stages..."The Future Water Supply of Birmingham” by Thomas Barclay, and available from the Internet Archive. Further there is a paper from the Universities of Newcastle and Lancaster published in 2009, ELAN AND CLAERWEN VALLEYS, POWYS: HISTORICAL BRIEFING PAPER that gives much detail...

But I cannot find any mention of compulsory purchase without compensation.

To find out what the valleys were like before flooding there is a lovely book from 1894, “The Vale of Nantgwilt-A submerged Valley” written by R Eustace Tickell, an Engineer and artist, who was the Civil Engineer under George Yourdi... “to commemorate scenes in one of the most charming valleys in Great Britain. Scenes which are soon to be lost for ever, submerged beneath the waters...Beautiful lakes they will doubtless be....but their construction dooms many a picturesque and interesting spot to destruction, and it would indeed be a pity if they should be allowed to pass away without some record, however inadequate."

There are also the recollections of Hetty Price, a farmer's daughter who lived in the lower Claerwen valley in the 1880's, and recorded some of her memories of the lost valleys when she was in her seventies. Her father's farm was on the other side of the River Claerwen opposite "the Grand Mansion of Nantgwyllt where the Squire lived."

It will be interesting to see the account by David Brown (post 30 from Stephanie Kruse) in his book “about what happened to the families of the tenant farmers after they were displaced,” which is due to be published later this year. It could contain sources from Welsh speaking sources.

You could of course argue about the level of compensation, but I would call on CARAD to explain the basis of the remarks made by their chairman Peter Cox in 2006.
 
Hi, I’m Stephanie and new to this group. I am also lucky enough to be the Elan Links Cultural Heritage Officer in the Elan Valley near Rhayader.

Elan Links is a 5 year project which has funding from the Heritage Lottery Fund Landscape Partnership Scheme to “safeguard the unique and varied heritage of Elan while significantly enhancing outcomes for people, communities and heritage for the long term.” The project covers natural heritage, interpretation and access as well as social and cultural heritage.

My role is to protect, record and celebrate Elan Valley’s cultural heritage through collecting people’s memories and stories and recording distinct cultural customs, contemporary life and activity. Obviously there is a strong cultural connection with Birmingham and one of our projects is to rekindle and reaffirm our relationship with Birmingham through Sharing History days and other events and exhibitions.

We came up to Page Park last year with a small stand to talk to people about the Elan Valley area and I was lucky enough to meet a lady who had been on a school visit to the Elan Valley and lo and behold a couple of weeks later she sent me a copy of the homework she had done relating to that visit - in 1964!!

Mrs Margaret Price also contacted me with photographs of and information about her grandfather Alderman Milner who came on an official visit to the dams with other members of Birmingham City Council in October 1952 (see attached).

I have obviously seen the thread on this site Elan Valley and its pipeline into Birmingham, and other references which I hope to follow up but, in the meantime, I would love to hear from you if you have visited here or if you have any information on the Birmingham side of Elan Valley's story so please do get in touch -

Please note that we do not share peoples email address on this site, if you wish to contact another member please use the instant message facility, top right near the search box...
Thank you
A wonderful place to visit, and the water is great!
 
Hello there, I am an artist working on a project all about the Elan Valley Aqueduct - you can read more about it at http://kate-green.co.uk/ and I have also attached a flier. I would love to hear from you if you have a particular interest in the EVA, know any interesting stories about the Pipe or would like be involved in 'Walking the Pipe'. Everyone is welcome. Many thanks, I look forward to hearing from you, Kate.
 

Attachments

There has been quite a few folk interested in Birmingham's water supplies and these two threads might help you. You will see that there are one or two projects mentioned about Elan Valley.


 
Thank you. I have been chosen to be an artist in residence for the Elan Links programme next year so hopefully will meet Stephanie soon! I had seen Colin's posts - I will see if the discussion can be revived and if he has any further thoughts.
 
You may be interested in the article and comments concerning the social side of the construction of the pipeline on Simon Briercliffe’s Blog "Up the Os Road.”

 
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Aston Well, looks like the beam engine as working when the photo was taken. I do remember this building in the 60's before the motorway was built. I did going inside it once, but the beam engine was gone.

Aston Well.JPG
 
It looks like one of the reasons for road watering was to lay the dust during dry periods.

In 1850 One London borough reported Quantity used equal to 1,000 gallons for every 3,360 yds and 43,200,100 gals per year (Report on Water Supply to the Metropolis)
 
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