Then & Now

[ploody]

photo with the gates is to the old fox hollies hall which is facing hartfield cresent and is in acocks green b27, hall green starting further up fox hollies at York road.

 

[farmerdave]

photo with the gates is to the old fox hollies hall which is facing hartfield cresent and is in acocks green b27, hall green starting further up fox hollies at York road.

Thanks Ploody. Dave.

 

[Phil]

farmerdave

A little more information for you, for years there was only the one gatepost on Fox Hollies Rd and for some years before that half of the other one, until for some reason in recent years it was decided to have another one constructed and some new gates hung. It makes me wonder why when there was no hesitation in demolishing the hall why one gate post or even two were left standing, or why it was decided to salvage one?

 

[Phil]

Whilst back on this page here are a few views of some local scenes from the suburbs complete with changes or in some cases lack of change.

Here we have

Sailsbury Rd Moseley
Bloomsbury St Nechells
Stratford Rd Sparkbrook
Pershore Rd Stirchley
The Swan Yardley.

 

[farmerdave]

Thanks Phil for the further information on Fox Hollies Hall. Dave

 

[oldMohawk]

The Provident Dispensary in Farm Street then and now and in the earlier pic a window cleaner seems to have claimed the pavement with his ladders and bucket. In today's pic the building is being used to dispense Non Standard Socket Screws. Presumably the dispensary eventually functioned within the NHS. The only dispensary I remember being taken to as a child was one at the junction of Dyas Hill and Kingstanding Road but I don't think it was a Provident and I didn't like it.

 

[paul stacey]

Cor, those ladders and buckets, would have the "Elf & Safety", Gestapo in absolute agony, would that have been the same as "The Provident Cheque" people my Mom used for years,??.Paul

 

[Astoness]

Cor, those ladders and buckets, would have the "Elf & Safety", Gestapo in absolute agony, would that have been the same as "The Provident Cheque" people my Mom used for years,??.Paul[/QUOT

hi paul im not sure if provident dispensary went onto providing the old provvie cheque as it was originally set up to help the poor receive medical treatment but anyway here is an 1892 report about it courtesy of carl chinns birmingham lives..makes interesting reading..

[TABLE="width: 760, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD][TABLE="width: 760"]
[TR]
[TD="class: skyFullWidth"][TABLE="width: 95%"]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 3"]1892 report on the Hockley Provident Dispensary (Archive Reference: 136)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Extract from the 1892 Annual report on the Hockley Provident Dispensary in Farm Street. See also the 1893 report.[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD] [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 3"]

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="class: itemTable, width: 95%"]
[TR]
[TD]

Transcript​

Hockley Provident Dispensary

Your Committee have pleasure in presenting their Report and Statement of Accounts for the year ending December, 1892.

It is gratifying to your Committee to report that the step it considered advisable three years ago to take in the appointment of your present Medical Officer, to devote the whole of his time and skill exclusively to the service of the Members, has passed beyond the experimental stage and has been justified by its results. His interests being identical with the progress of the Institution, there is a constant incentive to retain the friendly co-operation of the members who appreciate the arrangement as having all the advantages incidental to a Medical Practitioner in private practice, while at the same time it gives him the opportunity of becoming more intimately acquainted with individual constitutions and habits than was possible under the old system. There are no conflicting interests to clash with his duties to the institution; he has the best medicines procurable and a perfectly free hand in dispensing them.

During the year 715 New Members have been admitted, an increase of 164 over the preceding year; 420, or a decrease of 51, have been struck off the books, left, removed from the neighbourhood, or by death, leaving a total number at the end of the year 1939.

The receipts for the year are £599 2s. 4d., an increase of £33 7s. 3d. over the receipts for 1892; the Expenditure being £561 18s. 5d., a decrease of £43 15s. 6d., as compared with the previous year.

At the close of 1892, the accounts owing by the Institution, show a decrease of £1 15s., and after making provision for the payment of these, there remains a balance in hand of £86 11s. 11½ d. to the credit of the Dispensary.

It is but five years since your Committee felt the anxiety of a burden of debts upwards of £100, and the altered state of the finances must be as gratifying to the Members as it is to the Committee, for analysed, it represents increased income, decreased expenditure, decreased liabilities and increased assets, a result at once hopeful and encouraging, especially as during the past year the depression in trade has been keenly felt.

Although the Midwifery Department continues to do useful work, to a large extent it is used by those who become Members merely for the services it renders, and who leave as soon as the need for its help ceases; and whilst your Committee consider that any apparent loss on this department may fairly be considered as partially covered by Members' subscriptions, they feel that some alteration will be necessary in order to ensure its benefits being for bona fide Members only.

It may be asked how far the Institution has realised the hopes of its founders, and what justification there is for its existence? In reply, it may be pointed out that its object has been defined as an 'Institution affording facilities for those whose circumstances render small periodical payments advisable, to secure the advantages of Medical attendance, advice and medicine during illness.' In all large towns, especially in such as town as this, with a working population interested in a great variety of trades, there must always be a considerable number who may fairly be classed as above the very poor, and who could, if opportunities were afforded them, make provision from their weekly earnings towards securing for themselves and their families, Medical aid in time of need.

To make this possible, to encourage and foster thrifty habits in this direction, the late Mr. W. Sands Cox by his will, made provision for those desirous of helping themselves, by providing and endowing this building.

The experience of your Committee has convinced them that tests as to fitness for Membership are so full of difficulties as to be practically unworkable. Every man himself is the best judge of his own circumstances and how far they make it incumbent upon him to join such a Society as this, and for this reason, no inquisitorial barrier has been raised against his doing so, the mere fact that he recognises the principle at which this Institution aims, and desires to give expression to it by his contributions is sufficient; and one especial feature of the Institution is, that its Members receive equal care and attention, for there is no selection of what is known as 'interesting or novel cases'. It supplies a want felt to exist in Clubs and Benefit Societies, for while they secure treatment only for husbands or brother, this provides Medical aid for all the family, who qualify for it by Membership, and the Medical Officer possesses for them all the advantage of 'The Family Doctor'.

The response from those whom this Institution sprang into existence to help, is seen in the fact that since its inception no less a sum than £5,562 has been received direct from Members, and the significance of this sum is emphasised by the knowledge that it represents payments of from three pence to five pence per month. This is not only practical, but gratifying proof that its Members are free from the taint of being amongst those who contribute to the alleged abuse of the Medical Charities, and that it has been successful in inculcating habits alike conducive to the self-respect and independence of its Members.

Indiscriminate dispensation of Medical relief is a powerful factor for the destruction of habits of thrift among the poorer classes of the community, and the success of the Institution is a standing protest against those Institutions which foster the very abuses against which they protest, and wherever an honest attempt is made by Hospital authorities to check the increasing growth of their out-patient departments, they not only lessen their own burdens, but they indirectly co-operate with Provident Dispensaries, with a result that must be for the public welfare. A distinct step in advance is made every time a working man places himself outside the ranks of pauperism, and in the exercise of his manhood refuses to accept treatment in sickness at the public Charities.

It is for the further development of this feeling that your Committee invite the earnest co-operation of each member, in the hope that by its means a purer tone may be infused into the lives of many who form part of the population of this great City. For this development there is ample room, and task of assisting in it will be easy if those who are conscious of the advantages, association with an Institution such as this gives, will diffuse the knowledge of them into homes where they are unknown.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: topBarColour"][TABLE="width: 760"]
[TR]
[TD="class: copyright, width: 300, align: left"][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD="width: 210"][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[oldMohawk]

Thanks Lyn for that information, I was wondering what happened when the NHS came into being and see that the Dispensary's duties were absorbed into the NHS scheme. Interesting later photo on Carl Chinns site showing Ross Ceramics using the building.
Phil

 

[Astoness]

hi phil in the late 1960s the end part of the building was a dentists which i used to use as we lived in villa st..god i can still smell the gas mask now...in fact it still could be a denists...will have a look next time im down the old end...also in the then photo you will see that next door was a pawnbrokers and also sold footwear..the shop at some point was run by a miss bunch and our mom swore her shoes were the best for miles around...mom used to put money aside each week with miss bunch to buy our shoes...

lyn

 

[oldMohawk]

Hi Lyn - Interesting about Miss Bunch and her footwear. The dentist is still there as shown on the streetview link below
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&...=RlUPozo2mvwpjD72oxJu4w&cbp=12,3.75,,0,-11.24

 

[berniew]

Very interesting , life before the NHS

 

[Astoness]

yes phil miss bunch was well known in the area...thought the dentists was still there...it was mr mahmood when i used to go there...

lyn

 

[paul stacey]

Thanks for the information Lyn, found the topic and report most interesting. Regards Paul

 

[Phil]

A few pubs once bustling hives of laughter, fun and activity that are gone today, but not forgotten.


The Pelham, Alum Rock Rd
The Belgrave, Belgrave Rd - Moseley Rd
The Reservoir. Lichfield Rd
The Meadway, The Lea
The Mulberry Bush, Smallbrook Ringway

 

[sospiri]

Phil:

Some nice comparisons, though I am not familiar with all of them. So much destruction over not that many years, and I fear for genealogists in another 50 years time when our generation are gone with road layouts changed as well. At least you tried to record it for posterity!

Maurice

 

[Phil]

A few more photos of the city and suburbs as they once were and as they appear today,

Bordesley Green, Belchers Lane.
Erdington Chester Rd - Sutton Rd junction
City Lancaster Circus
Selly Oak Bristol Rd
Sparkbrook Stratford Rd

 

[paul stacey]

#4, I remember very well, it includes the fish and chippy, on the far right I worked in on Saturdays as a lad. Paul

 

[oldMohawk]

I saw a nice old pic and thought I would try a 'Then and Now' with Central Avenue Longbridge but it became a bit of a puzzle !
The old pic dated 1936 is here on the forum but I've enhanced it slightly.
The Old Pic.

I looked from two positions, one from Laburnum Way and the second from Maple Way, marked with red circles in this aerial view.
The Aerial View Pic.

Looking at the right side on streetview from Laburnum Way, I can see 9 bungalows which do seem to match 9 bungalows in the old pic. Two houses (Inset 1) in the old pic beyond the bungalows and slightly staggered in position do not show in today's pic and also do not show in the aerial view. Two houses on the left (Inset 2) do not show in today's pic. Also the near house on the left does not have a white surface. The start of a dual carriageway can be seen and there may be a hint of that in the old pic.
The Laburnum Way Pic.

Inset 1.

The two houses in this inset don't seem to show in the today's pics

Inset 2.

These two houses in this inset don't seem to show in the today's pics.

Moving to Maple Way, the house on the left has a white surface (like the old pic) and the house on the right looks ok although a bay window has been added. But there does not seem to be enough bungalows to match the old pic. Also six bungalows along, a house shows in the aerial view which does not show in the old pic.
The Maple Way Pic.

I've been up and down the avenue on streetview so many times I might be confused ... any thoughts about it ?

 

[Hughes]

I walked up Central Avenue many times,living in Rowan Way from 1930 to 1954
Regards
John Hughes

 

[oldMohawk]

Hi John - I'm inclined to think that the the old pic was taken from Rowan/Maple Way corner but am still puzzled by the houses highlighted in the inset pics. Certainly an interesting history about those bungalows. I've read that the houses on the corners were built to act as fire-breaks because the bungalows were built from cedar wood.
oldmohawk

 

[Phil]

Phil

It's hard sometimes to decide just where these old photos were taken from. In this case I would be pretty sure that it was taken from the Rowan Way end. I base this solely on the fact that the rainwater gutter downpipe comes off the roof at a bit of an angle on the old photo and on Google. At the other end it doesn't match up. I know it's only a small thing but often that's all you get.

 

[Hughes]

It could well be taken looking north from the Rowan Way corner.It was all Houses in Rowan Way.
I can rememeber as a child watching from our upstairs as a bungelow went up in flames

 

[oldMohawk]

Hi Phil - I've been looking at brickwork around doorways !

__

I'm still puzzled by the houses in the inset views but maybe it is some photographic effect.

 

[Phil]

Time for a few more comparisons with the past, in this batch we have


Lichfield Rd, Aston from about Sutherland St. Looking almost desolate to what it used to look.
Curzon Street, beginning to look very pretty but still a lot less industry & commerce than there used to be.
Hurst Street - Bromsgrove St. Why have they dressed the Australian Bar (sorry Missing) like a birthday present ?
Hurst St by Smallbrook St, still a couple of recognisable landmarks.
Paradise Street, I have only one thing to say WHY?

 

[sospiri]

Thanks for those, Phil.
Lichfield Road - soulless!
Curzon Street - slight improvement
Hurst Street Bar - hideous/ghastly/grotesque!!
Hurst Street 2 - both taken at quiet times obviously.
Paradise Street - ruined! Anything but paradise!

Planners, developers & politicians - too many backhanders or councillors that just don't care.

Maurice

 

[Richie]

Totally agree with you Maurice. We have lent our soul to these developers and come back with-nothing!

 

[norfolk brummie]

Well said, Maurice,

Eddie

 

[paul stacey]

Have to disagree with you Richie, we hav't lent our souls , but sold them to the people we elect to represent us, who then fail us, totally. Paul

 

[csmith604]

Well said Maurice I agree with you