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Poole Farm Cottages, Rodwell Grove, Kingstanding

Dear Astoness,
I apologise for the amount of time that has lapsed since you first posted your item on Pool Farm Cottages.
My Great Uncle Augustine owned Pool Farm Cottages, Pool Farm and Warren Farm.
His full name was Augustine Lewis Wells and he was the youngest brother of my Great Grandfather, Thomas.
The family of the time, the early 1800's to the first quarter of the 20th century were farmers.
They farmed or owned and leased out a number of farms around what is now Kingstanding.
I say now because at the time that my Great Uncle lived at Warren Farm it came under Handsworth.
Augustine was farming at Warren Farm around the 1880's and up until just before his death in 1934.
I have a map from 1834 that shows Lodge Pool and Warren Farm.
Next to Lodge Pool is a small square symbol, although it isn't labelled it is in the approximate position of Pool Farm and the cottages.
In 1881, Augustine's nephew (or to put it another way, my cousin), Thomas lived at No. 2 Pool Cottage.
He lived there with his wife Louisa and their two sons, George and Philip (they later had a daughter).
Charles, Thomas's brother was also living there in 1881.
Both Thomas and Charles were bailiffs to Warren Farm.
My Great Grandfather, in 1881, farmed at Witton Lodge Farm which was on the other side of the College Road from Warren Farm.
He lived there with his first wife, Jane, and the first few of their 9 children (7 girls and 2 boys).
My Great Grandfather purchased and moved to Oscott Farm (it stood on School Lane, Old Oscott, now Oscott School Lane) where he lived until he died in 1922.
As far as I know, my Great Grandmother, Teresa Ursula (my Great Grandfather's second wife), lived there until she died in 1940.
Augustine spent his last days at St Anthony's in Four Oaks (I believe it was a form of Care Home) before dying in September, 1934.
Augustine and Thomas are buried at Erdington Abbey as are a great number of the Wells's family.
Augustine wasn't only a farmer, he was also a Justice of the Peace, a Councillor and both Vice-Chairman and Chairman of the West Bromwich Board of Guardians.
When Lady Bateman-Scott of Great Barr Hall died in 1909, Augustine was the Chairman of the West Bromwich Board of Guardians and he suggested to the Committee that they purchase Great Barr Hall and Great Barr Park and start " Great Barr Colony ".
They were successful and in 1912, Great Barr Colony (later to be called St Margaret's Hospital), was opened.
Four homes were originally built and one of them was named " Wells Home " in honour of my Great Uncle.
I realise that this is more information than your original post warranted but perhaps it will help to fill in more of the history of the Kingstanding area.
Augustine was the first person in Kingstanding to own a Rolls Royce, he was also the first person in Kingstanding to have a phone put in.
With best wishes from Rod.
P.S. it is only a coincidence that Pool Farm Cottages are now in Rodwell Grove and my name is Rod Wells.
 
I have just posted this onto the end of two posts from Astoness so I'll post it here as well then everyone can read it.......

Dear Astoness,
I apologise for the amount of time that has lapsed since you first posted your item on Pool Farm Cottages.
My Great Uncle Augustine owned Pool Farm Cottages, Pool Farm and Warren Farm.
His full name was Augustine Lewis Wells and he was the youngest brother of my Great Grandfather, Thomas.
The family of the time, the early 1800's to the first quarter of the 20th century were farmers.
They farmed or owned and leased out a number of farms around what is now Kingstanding.
I say now because at the time that my Great Uncle lived at Warren Farm it came under Handsworth.
Augustine was farming at Warren Farm around the 1880's and up until just before his death in 1934.
I have a map from 1834 that shows Lodge Pool and Warren Farm.
Next to Lodge Pool is a small square symbol, although it isn't labelled it is in the approximate position of Pool Farm and the cottages.
In 1881, Augustine's nephew (or to put it another way, my cousin), Thomas lived at No. 2 Pool Cottage.
He lived there with his wife Louisa and their two sons, George and Philip (they later had a daughter).
Charles, Thomas's brother was also living there in 1881.
Both Thomas and Charles were bailiffs to Warren Farm.
My Great Grandfather, in 1881, farmed at Witton Lodge Farm which was on the other side of the College Road from Warren Farm.
He lived there with his first wife, Jane, and the first few of their 9 children (7 girls and 2 boys).
My Great Grandfather purchased and moved to Oscott Farm (it stood on School Lane, Old Oscott, now Oscott School Lane) where he lived until he died in 1922.
As far as I know, my Great Grandmother, Teresa Ursula (my Great Grandfather's second wife), lived there until she died in 1940.
Augustine spent his last days at St Anthony's in Four Oaks (I believe it was a form of Care Home) before dying in September, 1934.
Augustine and Thomas are buried at Erdington Abbey as are a great number of the Wells's family.
Augustine wasn't only a farmer, he was also a Justice of the Peace, a Councillor and both Vice-Chairman and Chairman of the West Bromwich Board of Guardians.
When Lady Bateman-Scott of Great Barr Hall died in 1909, Augustine was the Chairman of the West Bromwich Board of Guardians and he suggested to the Committee that they purchase Great Barr Hall and Great Barr Park and start " Great Barr Colony ".
They were successful and in 1912, Great Barr Colony (later to be called St Margaret's Hospital), was opened.
Four homes were originally built and one of them was named " Wells Home " in honour of my Great Uncle.
I realise that this is more information than your original post warranted but perhaps it will help to fill in more of the history of the Kingstanding area.
Augustine was the first person in Kingstanding to own a Rolls Royce, he was also the first person in Kingstanding to have a phone put in.
With best wishes from Rod.
P.S. it is only a coincidence that Pool Farm Cottages are now in Rodwell Grove and my name is Rod Wells.
 
Hello again everyone,
Further to the Pool Farm and Warren Farm saga, I think someone mentioned a George Towers.
George and Augustine were cousins and they farmed, I believe, Oldford Farm (and not Holdford farm) together before Warren Farm came into the picture.
Whichever farm it was, either Oldford or Holford Farm, was near to the Zig-Zag bridge on the College Road.
Kettlehouse Farm, Kings Vale Farm, College Farm, Warren Farm, Witton Lodge Farm, Oscott Farm, Stone House Farm, Park Farm and Aldridge Road Farm were all farms that were either owned or leased by different members of my family.
Manor farm, near to Maryvale School was also owned by a member of one branch of the family.
The only things that remain of these farms and anything that connects members of my family to the farms that I know of are, Pool Farm Cottages and the cottages that stand next to the Hare and Hounds Public House.
I don't know if they still are, but they used to be called Beech Tree Cottages and two or three of them weren't leased by Augustine Lewis Wells for his farm workers.
With best wishes to all from Rod.
 
It's me again,
I must correct an error.
I said that two or three of Beech Tree Cottages weren't leased by Augustine, I'm sorry but I should have said " were ".
With best wishes from Rod
 
hi rod..what a wonderful account of your ancestors life in kingstanding thanks you for sharing it with us...what a coninsidence that poole farm cottages are now in rodwell grove and your name is rod wells...or is it lol...as you know they are still there and so are some of beech tree cottages next to the hare and hounds pub...i have posted pics of both under the kingstanding thread if you are interested..

lyn
 
Wow, that's fantastic information about the area Rod! Really adds to the picture, and such interesting history about your family. Do you happen know the date of Pool Farm cottages?

You may have already spotted these three threads, but just in case you haven't here are the links, the first and second about St. Margaret's Hospital/Great Hall and the third (long) thread about Kingstanding which Lyn has mentioned. Thanks for sharing your information. Viv.

https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=15515

https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=40289

https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=5028
 
Hello again,
I'm afraid that I have got more useless information for you.
The house at Warren Farm resembled, although on a smaller scale, the old Kingstanding Pub, the one that was set back from the road before being demolished in the 60's.
The house was also known, at one time, as Warren Lodge.
The water supply was pumped into the house by, I believe, the Hydraulic Ram that is mentioned on some of the maps that are on here.
When I find my photograph of Warren Farm and I find out how to post it on here, I'll do so.
There is a grassed area in front of the house, on the extreme right of the photograph, on the other side of the fence are, as far as I know, two tennis courts and to the left of the fence is a Croquet Lawn.
Three of the Croquet Hoops are visible as is the Finishing Post (it's at the far side of the lawn in front of the large double doors on the left hand side of the house).
Between the left hand side of the house and the farm buildings is a vintage car.
I have tried to find out what make of car it is but without success, but there is a possibility that it is Augustine Lewis's Rolls Royce.
With best wishes from Rod.
 
P.S. The earliest definite date reference for Pool Cottages that I have is 1881 I'm afraid.
There is a map of the area dated 1834 and there is a symbol that resembles a group of buildings in the position of Pool Farm but it isn't labelled.
With best wishes from Rod.
 
Far from 'useless' Rod! This is fascinating stuff. You'll see we did a lot of speculating earlier on the thread about different aspects of the farms etc. You've been able to confirm some things for us. Much appreciated. Personally I find it interesting from a historical viewpoint, but I also grew up in Kingstanding, so it has added meaning. It wasn't that long ago (historically) that the area was a rural outskirt of Birmingham, and almost overnight in the late 1920s it became a major Birmingham Corporation housing project. But when we get glimpses of its earlier past such as Pool Cottages, and those cottages still standing on Kingstanding(Holly) Road, well it's precious. Do keep posting Rod, we're all interested in the smallest snippets because when added to other little snippets they can improve our understanding of a place. Viv.
 
viv a few years back now i attended the first birmingham lives history meet up and they had quite a bit of info on pool cottages...they could for certain date them back to 1840 but did think they are maybe a few years older than that

lyn
 
Ah yes Lyn, I remember you posting that point. But wouldn't it be good if the symbol on Rod's 1834 map turned out to be either these or even earlier farm buildings? Viv.
 
Is everyone happy?
I will be if I can get this to work.
I'm going to try and post two photographs, one is of Augustine Lewis Wells taken in 1912 and the other is of Warren Farm (The Lodge).
With best wishes from Rod.

ALW 1912.jpgWarren Farm (LP) Extra.jpg
 
Excellent Rod! Your gt uncle certainly looks like a man of authority. I expect Warren (Lodge) Farm was demolished a few years before his death in 1934. Despite the major Kingstanding development in the late 1920s I'm surprised that Pool Cottages and Beech Tree Cottages survived. I believe they were auctioned along with the farm in the 1920s. I wonder why these were not demolished? Glad to see they weren't of course, and wonder if your family members continued to live there.

Love the Warren (Lodge) Farm photo. I doubt your gt uncle had much time for croquet given all his responsibilities, but I can visualise his family out there in the summer playing croquet!

You've answered another of our questions about the hydraulic ram. Wonder if any evidence of this survives today (although I have no idea what a hydraulic ram would look like!) This and the early telephone etc. suggest the farm was a well organised and thriving one, as does the very nice car.

Do you know if his farmland was mainly for grain or livestock? We've a photo of hay making on here somewhere. And there's another of a group of farm workers outside the Hare & Hounds (I think on the Kingstanding thread). The workers most probably were working for your gt uncle.

Viv.
 
Vivienne14 said:
Excellent Rod! Your gt uncle certainly looks like a man of authority. I expect Warren (Lodge) Farm was demolished a few years before his death in 1934. Despite the major Kingstanding development in the late 1920s I'm surprised that Pool Cottages and Beech Tree Cottages survived. I believe they were auctioned along with the farm in the 1920s. I wonder why these were not demolished? Glad to see they weren't of course, and wonder if your family members continued to live there.

Love the Warren (Lodge) Farm photo. I doubt your gt uncle had much time for croquet given all his responsibilities, but I can visualise his family out there in the summer playing croquet!

You've answered another of our questions about the hydraulic ram. Wonder if any evidence of this survives today (although I have no idea what a hydraulic ram would look like!) This and the early telephone etc. suggest the farm was a well organised and thriving one, as does the very nice car.

Do you know if his farmland was mainly for grain or livestock? We've a photo of hay making on here somewhere. And there's another of a group of farm workers outside the Hare & Hounds (I think on the Kingstanding thread). The workers most probably were working for your gt uncle.

Viv.
Click to expand...
Viv, This is a hydraulic ram pump, they pump water without any external energy input, so operate for free. There were quite a lot of these once, and often sat in little brick building by streams, to supply water to farms.https://youtu.be/u2nGlnMNXrw
 
smashing pic of your gt uncle rod....there will be no stopping you now...just in case you have not got round to viewing the kingstanding thread yet i can see pool cottages from my bedroom window and its only half a min from my house..i have posted upto date pics of pool and beech cottages on that thread...lyn
 
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rod you may find this pic of interest..taken outside the original hare and hounds..they built the one thats there now around 1929 i think..as viv has already pointed out holly lane later became kingstanding road..

lyn

Farm_Hands_at_Hare___Hounds_Holly_LaneKingstanding1919.jpg
 
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Hello everyone,
Thanks for posting the photograph of the workers Lyn, you never know, a number of them could have worked for my Great Uncle, especially if any of the men in the photograph lived in Beech Tree Cottages.
I don't know when Warren Farm was demolished exactly but I try not to think about things like that because it just gets me thinking of all the heritage that people have lost to so-called development.
I don't know when my cousin left Pool Farm cottage either.
Come to think of it, I don't know much do I?
Charles, as far as I know, moved out of No. 2 Pool Cottage before Thomas and Louisa because he married a girl called Florence.
Both Charles and Florence are buried at Erdington Abbey.
Around 1929, 1930 approximately 1,000 houses were built around the Hawthorn Road - College Road area.
These were no doubt built on Warren Farm and Witton Lodge Farm land.
On May 24th, 1965 my family moved from Geach Street in Hockley to Rivington Crescent in Kingstanding, what we didn't know at the time was that we had moved into a house that was built on land that was once owned by Augustine Lewis (my Dad's Uncle).
College Farm was derelict in the 1960's but it was still there until it was destroyed in the late 60's.
I actually went in there when I was a kid not knowing that members of my family once owned the farm.
As you might guess, a new housing estate was built on the land, the main road through the estate is called College Farm Drive.
I apologise, I've headed away from Pool Cottages and Warren Farm, please forgive me but any talk of the farms of Kingstanding makes my day.
With best wishes from Rod.
 
hi rod you must have a look at the kingstanding thead as there are many pics of the old farms and cottages on it..did you live in geach st then ??? i was born in the next st to it in my nans back to back in paddington st...if of interest to you you also need to see the geach st thread for pics...
totally agree with you about our lost heritage...i am always banging on about the fine buildings we have lost..makes me mad and so very sad..


lyn
 
Well Rod, I think it's great to have found someone who has a link with Warren Farm etc. When I lived there in the 1950s through to the 1970s Warren Farm was pretty much a household name. All us kids took it for granted we knew where Warren Farm was. But very few of us even thought about it as originally being a farm. I'm fascinated by the area's agricultural history and anything you can add brings it all a bit more to life for us. Pool Cottages and Beech Tree Cottages are perfect examples of Kingstanding's agricultural past, and it's great they're still there. I'm also fascinated (going even further back to the Icknield Way etc), with what was going on in the area along the old Roman route. I vaguely hope that one day we might discover the positions of these farms and farm buildings will relate back to some much, much earlier settlements.

Back to more recent times and Lyn's Hare & Hounds 1919 photo, I think it's great that there're a couple of ladies in the photo and I guess they might be something to do with the pub, serving the farm workers perhaps. But the younger woman looks incredibly trendy for the time, the haircut, the clothes, all very 1920s. She seems somehow out of place to me.

Thanks Morturn for the clip on the hydraulic ram. Expected something much larger and powerful. But it reinforces how very fertile the farmland around here must have been. Viv.
 
Hello Viv,
Warren Farm was situated at the end of a narrow lane called Holly Lane (not to be confused with the original name of Kingstanding Road also called Holly Lane).
It followed the approximate route from Hawthorn Road along what is now Charlton Road.
Warren Farm foundations are under the back gardens of the houses on the far corner, from Hawthorn Road, of Charlton Road and Norbiton Road.
Kettlehouse Farm foundations are near Kingstanding Circle, under the Kingstanding Library.
The Methodist Church on the corner of Carshalton Road and Kings Road is where Kings Vale Farm once stood.
College Farm was on the left as you came down the hill on the College Road from Chester Road, it was just below the Roman Catholic College and a new housing estate occupies the land.
The name of the road that goes through the estate is called College Farm Drive.
Park Farm (of Park Farm Estate, Pheasey) was situated on the far side of Crail Grove at the top of Waverley Avenue (next to the pub "Cat and Fiddle").
I've mentioned Park Farm because Augustine Lewis Wells also owned it as well as Warren Farm.
He purchased it, against much opposition, for around £3,000.
Witton Lodge Farm was on the right hand side of the Circle, not Kingstanding Circle, but the Circle at the bottom of Witton Lodge Road.
There is a now a cul-de-sac behind the shops at the Circle called Lapwing Croft, the farm stood between the end of Lapwing Croft and the Circle.
Oscott Farm stood between the end of Wisteria Grove (off Amblecote Avenue) and Fairbourne Avenue.
There used to be a track that led to Oscott Farm just before the first bend on Oscott School Lane as you go down it from Shady Lane.
Here's some more information that corrects a published mistake.
There were three cottages on the Shady Lane that belonged to Oscott Farm, they stood between Winster Grove and the church.
I've mentioned these because according to some publications the building was originally called the Old School House, it may well have been the Old School House and later converted into three cottages, I don't know for definite, but according to the books the cottages were demolished in 1938.
I have been in touch with the History Section of Birmingham Library because this is untrue, but they don't seem to want to know.
My Grandmother lived in the cottage that was on the left of the three, a man called Tom and his son Trevor, lived in the cottage in the middle and a man called Ted, lived with his wife Moira and their children, Geoffrey and Marilyn in the cottage on the right.
I used to visit my Grandmother every Saturday morning until she left the cottage in 1962 and they weren't destroyed until some time later.
You can't believe everything you read in books unfortunately.
Perhaps now that you know where a few of these farms once stood, you can take it back even further than a century.
With best wishes from Rod.
 
It's me again,
Just in case anyone comes across more information on Warren Farm that mentions the last owner as anything else other than Augustine Wells, he was also known as Augustus and Austin.
With best wishes from Rod.
 
Will certainly keep a look out for any other info Rod. I'm interested in what happened to these farms up to the point of when the new housing development took over, around late1920s. Will post anything I turn up. Viv.
 
I have just come across this thread which is really interesting - Poole Farm cottages are part of my family history of the Fodens of Erdington and Astoness kindly gave me a photo of the cottages as they are today (thread: Maria Foden). In #76, Rod talks about Thomas Wells who married Louisa Foden. She was the daughter of my gt gt Granda Henry who was born on College Farm and bailiff.
I would love to talk to Rod off thread about all this ...
 
hi glennys jean...could i suggest that you send rod a private message...good to hear from you

lyn
 
Ex Staff Member {Maggies} said:
Hello Viv,
Warren Farm was situated at the end of a narrow lane called Holly Lane (not to be confused with the original name of Kingstanding Road also called Holly Lane).
It followed the approximate route from Hawthorn Road along what is now Charlton Road.
Warren Farm foundations are under the back gardens of the houses on the far corner, from Hawthorn Road, of Charlton Road and Norbiton Road.
Kettlehouse Farm foundations are near Kingstanding Circle, under the Kingstanding Library.
The Methodist Church on the corner of Carshalton Road and Kings Road is where Kings Vale Farm once stood.
College Farm was on the left as you came down the hill on the College Road from Chester Road, it was just below the Roman Catholic College and a new housing estate occupies the land.
The name of the road that goes through the estate is called College Farm Drive.
Park Farm (of Park Farm Estate, Pheasey) was situated on the far side of Crail Grove at the top of Waverley Avenue (next to the pub "Cat and Fiddle").
I've mentioned Park Farm because Augustine Lewis Wells also owned it as well as Warren Farm.
He purchased it, against much opposition, for around £3,000.
Witton Lodge Farm was on the right hand side of the Circle, not Kingstanding Circle, but the Circle at the bottom of Witton Lodge Road.
There is a now a cul-de-sac behind the shops at the Circle called Lapwing Croft, the farm stood between the end of Lapwing Croft and the Circle.
Oscott Farm stood between the end of Wisteria Grove (off Amblecote Avenue) and Fairbourne Avenue.
There used to be a track that led to Oscott Farm just before the first bend on Oscott School Lane as you go down it from Shady Lane.
Here's some more information that corrects a published mistake.
There were three cottages on the Shady Lane that belonged to Oscott Farm, they stood between Winster Grove and the church.
I've mentioned these because according to some publications the building was originally called the Old School House, it may well have been the Old School House and later converted into three cottages, I don't know for definite, but according to the books the cottages were demolished in 1938.
I have been in touch with the History Section of Birmingham Library because this is untrue, but they don't seem to want to know.
My Grandmother lived in the cottage that was on the left of the three, a man called Tom and his son Trevor, lived in the cottage in the middle and a man called Ted, lived with his wife Moira and their children, Geoffrey and Marilyn in the cottage on the right.
I used to visit my Grandmother every Saturday morning until she left the cottage in 1962 and they weren't destroyed until some time later.
You can't believe everything you read in books unfortunately.
Perhaps now that you know where a few of these farms once stood, you can take it back even further than a century.
With best wishes from Rod.
Click to expand...
Very interesting posts Rod, I too am related to Augustine, he was my 3rd great uncle. I have been researching my family history for many years but don't seem to be able to get back much further than Augustine's grandfather
 
mike would you be able to repost your posts on this thread please as they are PB ones...just reposted my pic on post 75..nice to see this thread up and running again as i can see pool farm cottages from from bedroom window:)

lyn
 
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