National Service

[norfolk brummie]

I never smoked until I was sent to Germany. In those days Players & Senior Service cigarettes were one shilling for twenty. Never having much money, and cigarettes in abundance, we would play cards for cigarettes. This meant, that after a successful game I would occasionally have a large amount of cigarettes. One day I decided that I might as well make use of my winnings. Worst thing I ever did. I then smoked from 18 until I was 37, in 1970. Eddie.

 

[Smudger]

"Silly Billies" indeed ! Bored squaddies did the daftest things.
For a while, when our Regt was in Nienburg there was a time when people would wait for someone to get in the bath, then half a dozen fire buckets would be emptied over the top of the cubicle.
This would result in reprisal water fights with water being thrown into the barrack rooms.
It got so bad some blokes didn't dare go for a bath.

Whilst one lad out of our blillet went for a bath, some naughty person balanced a bucket of water on the partly open door, so that when he came back in, he would get a drenching. He got a drenching all right, plus a nasty cut on his head which required stitches. Good job he had a forgiving nature!

 

[Smudger]

I never smoked until I was sent to Germany. In those days Players & Senior Service cigarettes were one shilling for twenty. Never having much money, and cigarettes in abundance, we would play cards for cigarettes. This meant, that after a successful game I would occasionally have a large amount of cigarettes. One day I decided that I might as well make use of my winnings. Worst thing I ever did. I then smoked from 18 until I was 37, in 1970. Eddie.

A few weeks before i was due to go on leave form germany, i used to post home a 200 carton of ciggies, & state on the customs form that the contents was a doll (for my neice) & on the approx 6 times i did that, only one parcel failed to turn up. Like you said, ciggies were a shilling for twenty, whisky i think was about 7 bob a bottle. Such temptations for a squaddie with no willpower.

 

[norfolk brummie]

Germany in 1952. We could get anything, literally, for a bar of soap, chocolate, cigarettes, etc.

One day a driver from the motor pool "acquired" a five gallon can of petrol. Five of us went into town, found a pub that would do a deal for the petrol.

We had a free evening of all we could drink, a slap up meal for all five of us, and the attention of the local "girls". Then our pool driver arranged a lift back to the barracks. Not even a Mark was spent. Eddie.

 

[Smudger]

When i was a Brigadiers driver in N/Ireland in 1966, i hated the job. I disliked Belfast, i disliked the Brigadier ( i used to buy his newspapers but he never paid me) and one day he told me to be at his house & wear my number one uniform as he was throwing a party. I told him i didn`t have a number one uniform & he gave me a look i interpreted as scorn. That did it for me, & shortly after i put in a transfer request, hoping for somewhere exotic or even back to Germany. I got my transfer request, but sadly only a few miles down the road to Lisburn! The best laid plans of mice & men! Sadly i don`t think there are mant exotic postings now & i hardly think Iraq & Afghanistan qualify.

 

[paul stacey]

Can't imagine why you didn't like Lisburn Smudge, you want to try Craigavon, on a rainy day, if my memory serves me right its claim to fame was as the cross roads of the NI. A1 and A3 , it got better when they built the M1. Paul

 

[Smudger]

Paul, Lisburn was a boring place with no charm. The only good thing i can say about lisburn is that my son was born there. Belfast was ok, but the traffic even back in `66 was horrendous. I reckon i`ve visited every town in N/I & in most places you could sense an "atmosphere" & not always friendly. How can people hate each other just because he/she might be a catholic or protestant. I reckon they`re brainwashed from an early age. It`s the only place i`ve been to where you get issued with live ammo for guard duty. Mind you, if we did come under attack, orders were to pick up the phone in the tower & ask for permission to return fire. If we were attacked the tower would be the first thing to come under fire & i can just imagine picking up the phone & saying "Please sir, some bad people are trying to kill me, can i please return fire" :-}

 

[paul stacey]

Even in my day Smudge you could only fire 3 targeted rounds, after being contacted, after that your section commander or fire team officer had to order it. Paul

 

[maypolebaz]

When i was a Brigadiers driver in N/Ireland in 1966, i hated the job. I disliked Belfast, i disliked the Brigadier ( i used to buy his newspapers but he never paid me) and one day he told me to be at his house & wear my number one uniform as he was throwing a party. I told him i didn`t have a number one uniform & he gave me a look i interpreted as scorn. That did it for me, & shortly after i put in a transfer request, hoping for somewhere exotic or even back to Germany. I got my transfer request, but sadly only a few miles down the road to Lisburn! The best laid plans of mice & men! Sadly i don`t think there are mant exotic postings now & i hardly think Iraq & Afghanistan qualify.

When I was in the QOH we were in Cyprus on a UN tour.
Appointed as Squadron Leader's driver, I had to whiz the bloke all over the island, (1969), in a UN staff car.
One day he demanded that I cleaned his kit for him, which I refused to do, so I was demoted to driving his LWB Rover instead and a bloke called "Titch" Boulton drove the car.
Having the only long wheelbase in the squadron on flick, I ended up doing more cabbying than ever, which suited me as it helped the time to pass quicker.

 

[Smudger]

I think officers expecting to be waited upon was a continuation from the upstairs downstairs era. I`m wondering if todays officers still have a batman to do his kit? I once drove a titled lady & i was told to address her as M`lady but i just couldn`t bring myself to say it, so i simply addressed her as Mam. Didn`t get any complaints

 

[Old Boy]

Hi All,

I have enjoyed this thread but every night, when I go to bed, i thank the Lord that I joined the Royal Navy.

Old Boy

 

[Smudger]

Hi All,

I have enjoyed this thread but every night, when I go to bed, i thank the Lord that I joined the Royal Navy.

Old Boy

Why is that old boy, couldn`t cut the mustard in the army eh. Just kidding, there`s no way you would get me on a ship in war time, always wondering if there`s an enemy sub out there ready to send me to davy jones locker, and all those 50ft waves going up, coming down, throwing up & wondering what you`re doing on this bloody ship :-}

 

[paul stacey]

I think he knew when he was better off mate, all that travel to exotic places, you ever seen "Boogie Street, Singapore of a Saturday night, the shore patrol kept a presence there all night. Paul

 

[Smudger]

I think he knew when he was better off mate, all that travel to exotic places, you ever seen "Boogie Street, Singapore of a Saturday night, the shore patrol kept a presence there all night. Paul

I guess you`re right Paul. Join the navy & see the world (but only in peace time) Never did get to any exotic places in the east but would have loved to. Did spend a short spell in Jamaica & Brit. Honduras (now Belize). But Germany was my favourite place. I`ve been tempted to go back & visit some of the places i knew, but as the old saying goes "never go back, it won`t be the same".

 

[maypolebaz]

But Germany was my favourite place. I`ve been tempted to go back & visit some of the places i knew, but as the old saying goes "never go back, it won`t be the same".

That's very true Smudge. From what I read on an ex-BAOR website I visit, there are hardly any of the barracks that we were familiar with left standing now.
I was watching a video, (youtube I suspect), of my last posting, Hemer, recently and it showed a drive, from the town to the village of Deilinghofen, where my regt was based in the 70s. I have to say, I didn't recognise any of it !

 

[norfolk brummie]

I agree with Smudger. Never go back. In 1952 I was stationed in Bad Oeynhausen, which was the HQ B.A.O.R, and the army had taken over most of the civilian properties.. We lived in a large house, next door to the HQ of General Harding. The HQ was in a lovely old building. We lived almost like civilians. There were eight of us in the house we were billeted in. Large bedrooms, and two to a room.

The beautiful old Kurpark, its lovely old buildings had been taken over for a forces theatre, a huge all ranks NAFFI Club. A great place to be stationed. Very few Germans around in the park. Probably one of the few places in Germany unmarked by wartime bombing.

A few years ago, whilst taking a trip through parts of Europe, I very nearly visited again, but thought, no, remember it as it was.

When not at HQ, I was stationed at Northern Army Group Headquarters in Herford. That had previously been a German barracks.

 

[norfolk brummie]

I only ever met a couple of guys who did National Service in the Navy. Lots of conscripts applied to join, but 99.9% ended up in the Army or RAF. Eddie

 

[Smudger]

I agree with Smudger. Never go back. In 1952 I was stationed in Bad Oeynhausen, which was the HQ B.A.O.R, and the army had taken over most of the civilian properties.. We lived in a large house, next door to the HQ of General Harding. The HQ was in a lovely old building. We lived almost like civilians. There were eight of us in the house we were billeted in. Large bedrooms, and two to a room......

There must have been more than one HQ BAOR. I was stationed at HQ 1 BR CORP in Bielefeld 1962, & JHQ Rheindahlen 1963 which was also HQ for NATO forces.
BTW, I knew Gen. Hardings son, he was a 2nd lt when i was at 7 coy RASC.

 

[norfolk brummie]

Maybe a few changes were made at a later date. I left at the end of 1953 for demob.

As a cypher operator, I know that Bad Oeynhausen was definitely the HQ in my time. We had direct link to the War Office in London, and SHAPE HQ in Fontainebleau. All messages were cleared by our HQ. Harding himself would often visit our office, which of course, was a restricted area. Although only a corporal, Harding would talk to us all in quite a friendly way. In our office environment, he never pulled the 'General' rank. Eddie.

 

[paul stacey]

Anyone ever based at SHAPE, Mons Belgium?, I have to say about the conversations above, its the same in the UK, whenever I come back to Birmingham I can hardly recognise anywhere from my youth, as for the "Guards Depot Pirbright", well enough said. Last time, (About 3 years ago) I saw Rheindahlen, it was being demolished all over the huge encampment, the Big House was still there but Queens Avenue did't exsist. Paul

 

[Old Boy]

Why is that old boy, couldn`t cut the mustard in the army eh.....

Hi Smudger.
No, My comment was a bit tongue in cheek. Reading the various posts it seems that the National Service lads spent most of their time playing prenks on each other or doing their best to stay out of the way of bullying NCOs. However I have the greatest admiration for those lads who were caught up in various conflicts following WW1 To name a few - Malaya, Cyprus, Palestine. Kenya and, I think. Korea. I am not sure when National Service actually ended.

Old Boy

 

[Old Boy]

I only ever met a couple of guys who did National Service in the Navy. Lots of conscripts applied to join, but 99.9% ended up in the Army or RAF. Eddie

Hi Eddie,

I think the reason for that was ships of the Royal Navy usually went on 3 year commissions. That was not too bad if the commission was with the Home Fleet but commissions abroad could not take National Service men who would have had to be sent home well before the commission ended and replaced.

I, myself, was not National Service having joined in March 1945. By the time I finished my training the war was well and truly over so I did not have to fear the submarines that Smudger mentioned in a previous post. The up and down waves I could put up with as I sailed the seven seas. Well a few of them.

Old Boy.

 

[maypolebaz]

When I worked in the co-op on Moseley Rd there was a bloke in the butchery next door who'd been in the Andrew.
He'd been on Birmingham and I was in awe of him.
As a 16-year old I wanted to join the Navy but my dad forbade it, he said "they treat you like s*** in the Navy"!
It allways raised a laugh with my Army playmates when I told them that one.

 

[oldMohawk]

Although I've mentioned it earlier and with details in another thread, my brother-in-law did his two years National Service in the RN and served on HMS Bulwark. He saw the accident on 16 Feb 1956 in which a Fairey Gannet aircraft went over the side into the sea off the coast of Northern Island - as detailed in the link below which shows photos of the aircraft going over the side.
He also saw active service on the Bulwark in the Suez Crisis during November 1956 ... quite an interesting NS !
https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=154055

 

[Smudger]

Anyone ever based at SHAPE, Mons Belgium?, I have to say about the conversations above, its the same in the UK, whenever I come back to Birmingham I can hardly recognise anywhere from my youth, as for the "Guards Depot Pirbright", well enough said. Last time, (About 3 years ago) I saw Rheindahlen, it was being demolished all over the huge encampment, the Big House was still there but Queens Avenue did't exsist. Paul

Paul, never visited SHAPE, but i did "visit" Belgium twice. Drove through (or should that be over) the Dardenelles (sp) & also got lumbered with guarding an ammo train that was destined For somewhere in Belgium. We were issued with pick axe handles to guard this train, yes pick axe handles! The briefing should have gone something like this, "Now chaps ( there were 3 of us) if by chance you should be attacked by bandits with automatic weapons, deflect their bullets with your pick axe handles & when they finally run out of ammo, under no circumstances must you give them any ammo from the train. This is mod property & not to be used by unauthorised personnel. Two you may may engage the enemy with what is left of your pick axe handles & inflict them with as many splinters as you can. That`ll teach them to attack British property. Of course that silly speech never happened, but it does go to show how the British army worked back then, using pick axe handles to guard an ammo train!!!

 

[norfolk brummie]

Smudger. The good old pick axe handle. I had forgotten that. Used for guard duty in Germany. Your two hours 'on' involved walking around a designated area of the camp, with the pick axe handle for your defence. Bloody stupid.

On one occasion I had to collect a cypher machine from, I think, it was Osnabruck. In the lorry I had two lads sitting in the back of the truck, with their pick axe handles. As the corporal, I was in charge, and sat in the front with the driver.

What we did not know was that there was a reunion of the Afrika Corps around the Osnabruck area, and we ran across them.
As we drove through them, they were banging on the side of the lorry, with two very scared guards holding pick axe handles, in the rear of the lorry.

The driver asked me what to do, and I told to keep on driving, and not stop. Eventually we got through them, and we were very lucky that was all that happened. Can you imagine what would have happened if the Afrika Corps mob have been more aggressive.

I can see the headlines now "Pick axe boys send Afrika Corps into retreat". No chance, they would have killed us. Eddie

 

[ChrisM]

Great story, Eddie!

Pickaxe handles were also the primary means of defence in the 1950s aerodromes I encountered. Picquet duty for me and whichever comrade had been unlucky to draw a similar short straw was a series of two hour overnight stints patrolling the airfield - a vast expanse with a proliferation of buildings dispersed around the perimeter. It was the most easterly base in the country, a couple of miles from the North Sea: the wind blew in direct from Siberia and I often wondered what the hell we were supposed to be doing as I tramped around, warding off hypothermia. Defending the country against Russian special forces, blown in on the same wind and intent on discovering the secrets of our ageing Meteor T7s and Lincolns? Or against the local peasantry looking for bits and pieces with which to mend their hencoops?

I recall no explanation of the circumstances in which I was permitted to use my lethal weaponry. Nor what would be regarded as reasonable force. Little chance of litigation in those days of course but it would have been useful to know how far one was allowed to go in beating up a group of Soviet parachutists.

Chris

 

[paul stacey]

I take it that all this talk of "pick axe handles", infers to what we always called pick elves, and yes I have done guard and picket duty with those Smudge, when one of our younger lads asked the Picket sergeant, "what if the IRA comes to night"? , he put down his daily mirror and rather sarcastically said, "If I was you Ives, I should chuck it at 'Em' and scarper," double quick.!! Paul

 

[norfolk brummie]

Before National Service, I had never used an iron or threaded needle.

I quickly learned how to iron fantastic razor sharp creases in my trousers. That is, when I could hold of the iron!

A bit of brown paper, some water, and bingo. Perfect. Some guys would put their trousers under the mattress of a night, especially before a big parade, but I never bothered. The creases were always good anyway. I did see one or two pairs of trousers with iron burn marks on them!

And the good old "Housewife" - darning socks and sowing on buttons.

Another trick was to send the issued baggy battledress top to the camp tailor, and have it taken in. It came back, fitting perfectly, and looking smart and tidy.

Eddie.

 

[brummie nick]

Another trick was to send the issued baggy battledress top to the camp tailor, and have it taken in. It came back, fitting perfectly, and looking smart and tidy.

Eddie.

I remember having my battledress tailored, he removed the three small pleats, and put what was known as a 'Box Pleat' in the back.
Nick