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Icknield Street

Zippy
As you say, your terrace has long gone. But attached are two photographs taken around 1970-72 of Icknield st either side of no 257, after 257 had been demolished.They were not taken at the same time however. In the first (Icknield st approaching lodge rd) I estimate the building farthest to the left is no 259. This is by examining this and an adjoining photo of the junction and counting house numbers. The second shows Gee(Birmingham ) Ltd and buildings either side. Gees are listed as being 249-252, which I estimate are the two centre blocks (with signs "Gee" and "Icknield works"). This makes the building farthest right to be no 253.
Hope that is useful
mike


20A__Icknield_St_approaching_Lodge_Rd~0.j


16A__249-252_Icknield_St.jpg
 
Thanks for all the info folks., my (older) cousin in Australia has a vague recollection of visiting our grandparents in Icknield Street. He also thinks it was opposite The Mint. Many thanks.
 
Mike.
Thank's very much for the 2 Photo's taken near bye 257 Icknield St .I have saved these together with all my other records for Icknield St and the Hockley area.
You have been a great help, together with others on this site.When I first started my search I just did not think I would be able to collect so much material about the old day's in Hockley.
 
Re: icknield st back to backs

As an apprentice electrician working in Carver Street we were often sent down to work in Stoddards abatoir. It was a dirty disgusting place where the sport at lunch time was shooting the cockroaches as they crawled round the boiler house. I worked in many of the factories in that area and the jewellry quarter and none of them were fit to work in, dirty, badly lit and probably responsible for the early death of many of their employees. It's all very well getting misty eyed over these places but they should have been demolished years ago. The mint was another dirty hole that is well rid off, ask anyone today to work in those conditions and they would out after two minutes to phone the factory inspector. The buildings in the city centre were no better. If you really want to know about the working and living conditions of people ask an electrician or a plumber, historians never got their hands dirty.
 
George you are a bit hard on your fellow historians, and I think you are right to some extent. Conditions were grim and insanitary, due largely to poverty and neglect.
But I'm afraid what was put up to replace the old buildings (in the spaces left after Sir Herbert Manzoni had finished with his grandiose road scheme) were often imperfect. Much of the postwar housing was downright shoddy and has since been demolished. Same goes for factories of that time, not to mention the horrid 1960s offices and shops in the city centre.
Thank heavens, by about 1980 the authorities accepted that redevelopment had created new social problems, and that a middle way (retaining and improving the best of the old stuff, and adding new bits to avoid disturbing the character of the area) was preferable to total demolition. This was when General Improvent Areas and Housing Action Areas could be designated by the local authorities, enabling them to give grant to owners to improve their properties, or even do certain kinds of work themselves.
I was involved in this work in Lambeth at the time, when Birmingham took the lead in upgrading some of the late Victorian and Edwardian houses which are still standing today. It was about that time that Brum was also in the forefront of its industrial rehabilitation, which has kept some of the good buildings standing, even if they are not being used as workshops any more.
Peter
 
I think the factory conditions were nothing more than good old exploitation of the working classes. If you had the ability to start your own business then you exploited your fellow men, survival of the fittest. I also worked in the grand mansions of the owners of these factories. The Bird family with their splendid houses in Solihull and Knowle, Clutterbuck the solicitor with dingy offices in Birmingham and a fine house near Lapworth. I have never understood the poverty issue. My father was from a single parent family of seven, employed all his life as an electrician at Lewises in Birmingahm, by 1937 we had a brand new 3 bed semi in Acocks Green and a car. How much of the poverty was caused by irresponsible living that today is paid for by the DHSS? . I was involved in a lot of the housing developments in the late fifties and early sixties, I would agree that tower blocks were not ideal but there was nothing wrong with the construction, just the was the occupants treated them. There was nothing wrong with house contruction in the sixties by companies like Macleans. You had drylined walls, proper floor boards and solid internal walls. I have worked in many so called upmarket developments in recent years in Suffolk and the building standards compared with 50 years ago are rubbish. Plasterboard walls with no plaster finish, just scrim over the joints, tiles with no spacers with the grout falling out after a couple of weeks and of course the latest abortion, the combi boiler. Where is your backup when that fails over a Christmas holiday.
 
I kind of agree with both George and Peter. Keep the best and ditch the rest with historical kenotes where thought appropriate. I presume that plaster board is what is known as gypsum board here in NA. Pretty much every house built in NA in the last 60 or more years has used gypsum board over 2x4 wooden construction with sometimes brick outside finish and sometimes wood outside finish (now aluminium or vinyl). None of the ouside brick walls are load supporting, this function being the responsibility of the total 2x4 or 2x6 framing and cladding. All of this constructed on a concrete or cement block foundation going down below the frost line and creating a basement below the house.
When I first came to this country, I thought that this kind of construction would not last long and would deteriorate quickly but I was totally wrong. They do last and the house that we live in now is a half century old and as comfortable to live in now as when it was built and in appearance no less attractive. This statement goes for every house on the street. The house where I lived in Brum was a brick one and again about the same age, when I think of it; was a wreck and falling apart. So much for mortar and brick walls. (I am not refering to high rise here)
There is a difference though, and that is property here is generally owned by the occupant and kept up and cared for by the same. When you have an investment in something you are more likely to look after it on the whole. Exploitation of workers happens in all societies; it is called 'creating jobs' now. These jobs need to pay enough to provide the individual with a reasonable chance for a happy life outside of work and time to persue the same. Overhead in the form of executive pay is now being considered here. At the moment an average of one days work by CEO's (the recently quoted figure) is equal to a years average workers pay.
 
A lot of those houses from the turn of the century were "jerry built" no cavity walls and often brick on edge. In 1987 I bought a four year old house, half timber construction with 4" x 2" interior partitions and chip board flooring of a non standard size the builders imported from Russia. The shrinkage from unseasoned timber was so great that fitting carpets was a doddle, you cut it to somewhere near the right size and tucked the surplus under the gap between the skirting board and the floor.
 
I would like to know the street number of the pub "The Gate" on Icknield Street. It was on corner of Icknield Street and Pope Street. When was it no longer a pub and torn down.
 
thanks Rupert. I forgot to check back on other sites. Can't see what's not in front of us sometimes.
 
at the risk that this has been posted before i have this pic of the the gate in ickneild st.

astoness
 
Lovely picture of The Gate. My paternal grandparents/father lived in Pope Street and my maternal grandparents in Icknield Street - I'm guessing they drank frequently in The Gate (knowing my lot)!
 
charlie.. knowing my lot they probably did too..

rupert i thought i had seen it before but couldnt find it..

astoness
 
postie said:
I wonder if we will see a mysterious fire that tends to befall historic buildings when attention is drawn to them.:rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Hello Postie,

I am a newbie who was born in Brum. I lived at the back of these derilect shops in a street called Moreton St. Those shops were a post office, greengrocer, newsagent, bakery etc etc., and they were all used by me and my family. I now live in Cambridge but go back every year to see what has been done to these buildings. I worked in the office at Bulpitts and my father was a butcher at Stoddards on the corner of Carver St.
It is all so sad there now, really like a ghost town.

As a newbie I'm not sure how to introduce myself.
 
maggs said:
Hello Postie,

I am a newbie who was born in Brum. I lived at the back of these derilect shops in a street called Moreton St. Those shops were a post office, greengrocer, newsagent, bakery etc etc., and they were all used by me and my family. I now live in Cambridge but go back every year to see what has been done to these buildings. I worked in the office at Bulpitts and my father was a butcher at Stoddards on the corner of Carver St.
It is all so sad there now, really like a ghost town.

As a newbie I'm not sure how to introduce myself.
Click to expand...
When I was an apprentice electrician in Carver Street we carried out work in Stoddards, it might have looked clean at the front but it was pretty disgusting round at the back. We were also called out to Bullpits to make it safe after the fire in 53 or 54, a bit of dodgy wiring nearly finished me off, luckily it was al old fashioned wooden ladder.
 
hi maggs...i am afraid the last pics i posted of the old shops are about as good as it gets as like i said they will shortly be demolished...such a shame...

astoness
 
George Wheeler said:
When I was an apprentice electrician in Carver Street we carried out work in Stoddards, it might have looked clean at the front but it was pretty disgusting round at the back. We were also called out to Bullpits to make it safe after the fire in 53 or 54, a bit of dodgy wiring nearly finished me off, luckily it was al old fashioned wooden ladder.
Click to expand...

Thank you George,

I don't remember the fire at Bulpitt's. I was still at school at that time, but yes I know the back of Stoddards was filthy. Moreton St., at the back of Stoddards was attached to the yard where the pigs were brought in on Sunday afternoon ready for slaughter on Monday's. They were indeed back to back houses and also in bad order. The landlords didn't really care. I still have nightmares about the crooked staircases and cellars for coal. However, in spite of all that the people were fine, trying to keep their homes as clean as the area would allow. They were decent people and we never feared for our lives then. We could walk the streets without fear.

I am so glad you were on a wooden ladder!!!!

Regards,

Maggs.
 
maggs said:
Thank you George,

I don't remember the fire at Bulpitt's. I was still at school at that time, but yes I know the back of Stoddards was filthy. Moreton St., at the back of Stoddards was attached to the yard where the pigs were brought in on Sunday afternoon ready for slaughter on Monday's. They were indeed back to back houses and also in bad order. The landlords didn't really care. I still have nightmares about the crooked staircases and cellars for coal. However, in spite of all that the people were fine, trying to keep their homes as clean as the area would allow. They were decent people and we never feared for our lives then. We could walk the streets without fear.

I am so glad you were on a wooden ladder!!!!

Regards,

Maggs.
Click to expand...
In the early sixties I was with a firm of consulting engineers in Birmingham and one of my projects was the new Cambridge Fire Station, I think it is still there.
 
I went back to this post having seen Virusman's brilliant pictures.
According to news reports at the time, they WERE back-to-backs, but not considered important because of the shop fronts. They're obviously beyond salvage now and best gone, I s'pose. Sad though, ain't it?
 
thanks charlie.....i wasnt to sure about them being back to backs...yes i agree with you..its a shame....

lyn
 
Yes Charlie ain't it sad? I lived at the back of these shops and these are the shops were we did our daily shopping. There was everything there we could want.
 
I used to shop there as well Maggs when I worked in the area. And down The Flat. Times change though, and now everyone's so busy they get everything they need in one go from one of the big supermarkets, there doesn't seem to be room for the individual shop. A shame really, but we all do it.
 
We do try to use the village shops where we can Charlie. Of course things are a bit more expensive, but if we don't use them we will lose them, as they saying goes. We have lost several shops in this village already, I suppose the Post office will go eventually. Those shops in Icknield St were smashing, and as you say the Flat was fab too. There wasn't anything you couldn't buy down Icknield St in the 1950's and 60's. So sad the way things have changed around there. No life or soul to the place anymore. I know it was all a bit scruffy and in some way's I suppose it needed a clean up, but the warmth of the people and the way they cared for one another and the area they lived is lost forever. Anyway, it was home to me dirt and all.
 
Astoness,wonderful pics,and going crawling through some pretty rough stuff to get them makes them even more important,as we're not likely to see a repeat of that.

Yes nostalgia can make a shoddly built place into an historical nicety,but it is nice to keep examples of your history,just so we can see what went before.

With local history you have to remember it's not about the quality of the buildings,but the memories they hold.I grew up in the 70s,so missed a lot of the 60s reconstruction.So what was left becomes even more interesting and relevant.

An old building demolished means not just the destruction of bricks and mortar,but the destrustion of memories.People lived and died in these places,the evidence for these is destroyed along with the physical removal of the building.It can hurt when something you remember well is destroyed,and we should remember this when deciding what we destroy.
 
Well said Wessex. It's why we rely so much on yourself, Virusman, Lyn and the like to photograph these places so that future generations will have a point of reference for these pubs and buildings.
 
hi charlie...according to virusman who took some more pics last week these buildings were coming down this week...

lyn
 
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