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Canals of Birmingham

  • Thread starter Thread starter O.C.
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DavidGrain said:
This map is from Google
View attachment 139224

The grey/white building top centre is B & Q. If you come down Mucklow Hill (A458), the X10 bus stop is just below the roundabout by B & Q, you will see a dark green line which is the Dudley No2 Canal. It runs at the side of Leasowes Park going south. It has to follow the contours of the land. It leaves the park and runs at the back of houses and other buildings eventually coming out just above Sandvik, the building just left of centre bottom on Manor Way (A456). I have not walked this route for many years but if you can still get through you be able to get a no. 9 bus back into the city centre. The green line slightly to the left on the map is the line of the old Halesowen Railway which closed, I think, in 1962
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Thank you very much

Bob
 
Heartland said:
It is sad that so much graffiti is to be seen these days on bridges and walls along the canal side. It degrades the area and perhaps the troglodytes than leave their tribal inscriptions in this way should be compelled to remove them.
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It's a shame to see the mess on these walls, most of that behavior here is done by young gang members
Many stores will not sell spray paint to the youth and some even remove the nozzle from the cans in a attempt to stop theft
 
Andy Tidy has put together an instructive account of the BCN and has more chapters to recount.

I do have an opinion about James Brindley and am unhappy about the general view that he made the "Old Birmingham Canal". For Brindley, he surveyed the route as well as various alterations to that survey as that route changed following the issues at Smethwick Tunnel, but there were many people involved in the making of the Birmingham Canal, particularly the clerk of works and Samuel Simcock.

The fault for the mis-understanding that Brindley was the main person behind the making of canals such as the Birmingham lies with historians such as John Phillips and Samuel Smiles, that gives Brindley blanket credit for much more than he did. Over the years historians and authors have continued to repeat the fallacy until it has been generally accepted. Brindley is credited with also "making" the Bridgewater Canal, but some people like Hugh Malet, who wrote the book the Bridgewater the Canal Duke places most of the credit with John Gilbert.

Wherever James Brindley was involved with canals, there are modern memorials to his name. To give the name Brindley Place to the 1990's development in central Birmingham is a suitable example. Yes, it is true that Brindley provided for two options for a terminus in Birmingham and the Paradise Street Branch was made along a similar route to the design of Brindley's initial proposals. Yet that scheme changed and at one time included a tunnel through to Broad Street Islington from near the junction with the first canal to Farmer's Bridge, and the original terminus beyond. That then changed to the Deep Cutting as far as Islington where the original bridge is still there at the point where Broad Street Tunnel narrows. Brindley was then in the last year of his life, and was engaged on many other schemes. At the the time the Paradise Street branch was made there was a contest between two locations for the main BCN terminus. The line to Paradise Street won that contest and the company offices were built at the terminus basin facing Paradise Street. Naming Brindley Place certainly gives credit to the man who can be said to be the architect of the canal genesis in Britain and even then there are those that place that genesis earlier. Engineers such as Thomas Steers and Henry Berry are in that mix. As are the contemporaries of Brindley, who concieved canal schemes to rival those that were approved.
 
Heartland said:
Andy Tidy has put together an instructive account of the BCN and has more chapters to recount.

I do have an opinion about James Brindley and am unhappy about the general view that he made the "Old Birmingham Canal". For Brindley, he surveyed the route as well as various alterations to that survey as that route changed following the issues at Smethwick Tunnel, but there were many people involved in the making of the Birmingham Canal, particularly the clerk of works and Samuel Simcock.

The fault for the mis-understanding that Brindley was the main person behind the making of canals such as the Birmingham lies with historians such as John Phillips and Samuel Smiles, that gives Brindley blanket credit for much more than he did. Over the years historians and authors have continued to repeat the fallacy until it has been generally accepted. Brindley is credited with also "making" the Bridgewater Canal, but some people like Hugh Malet, who wrote the book the Bridgewater the Canal Duke places most of the credit with John Gilbert.

Wherever James Brindley was involved with canals, there are modern memorials to his name. To give the name Brindley Place to the 1990's development in central Birmingham is a suitable example. Yes, it is true that Brindley provided for two options for a terminus in Birmingham and the Paradise Street Branch was made along a similar route to the design of Brindley's initial proposals. Yet that scheme changed and at one time included a tunnel through to Broad Street Islington from near the junction with the first canal to Farmer's Bridge, and the original terminus beyond. That then changed to the Deep Cutting as far as Islington where the original bridge is still there at the point where Broad Street Tunnel narrows. Brindley was then in the last year of his life, and was engaged on many other schemes. At the the time the Paradise Street branch was made there was a contest between two locations for the main BCN terminus. The line to Paradise Street won that contest and the company offices were built at the terminus basin facing Paradise Street. Naming Brindley Place certainly gives credit to the man who can be said to be the architect of the canal genesis in Britain and even then there are those that place that genesis earlier. Engineers such as Thomas Steers and Henry Berry are in that mix. As are the contemporaries of Brindley, who concieved canal schemes to rival those that were approved.
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Heartland, your points are very well presented and taken. Unfortunately, the more we pursue history and the facts, the more we find the same type of misrepresentation or misallocation of benefits. There are many aspects of the Industrial Revolution where the actual prime movers are not represented or recognized accurately or even at all. I am new to canal history although not canals and find as you say it is most disappointing that there are so many flaws.
 
I believe it is important to continue the search, so that a better understanding can be found. Attributing true history, I believe is essential, but reproducing some early texts can still mislead true historical search. An example is the Outramway.

Benjamin Outram - The Outram Way from Locomotive Firemen's Magazine (1901)

todayinsci.com

The information contained is dubious, and it is confined to the development of the plateway style of railway that often joined with the British Canal network. The references to the early railway in Sheffield where John Curr was the viewer are suspect.

As to James Brindley, there are various statues to his memory- this one is in Coventry Canal Basin.

672017.jpg
 
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Heartland, do you see any attempt to rectify this dubious information?
It appears in a number of areas of history that new and developing technology and analysis has helped to re validate and clarify certain historical findings. WW2 for example, we have a better understanding of what why things were going on.
Just thinking out loud but it is a travesty that we continue to mis state history and then teach as fact!
Thank you for you contributions.....
 
Richarddye said:
Bob, I just watched the video...………...Outstanding piece of history! Going to try to follow the series.
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Just watched episode 2...…..Outstanding!

What is striking is that when I was growing up all of this was right under my nose! As an engineer who has built and managed many large plants, we used very heavy equipment, when the canals were built there was no such equipment. All sweat and manual toil. When you look at the enormity of what was done, I do not think people anywhere would have the will or fortitude to do this work today!

Does anyone know if there are any tours around the canal areas?
 
Richarddye said:
Just watched episode 2...…..Outstanding!

What is striking is that when I was growing up all of this was right under my nose! As an engineer who has built and managed many large plants, we used very heavy equipment, when the canals were built there was no such equipment. All sweat and manual toil. When you look at the enormity of what was done, I do not think people anywhere would have the will or fortitude to do this work today!

Does anyone know if there are any tours around the canal areas?
Click to expand...

May be of interest to anyone interested in canals. I have several pictures of the Midland canals from walks over the years. They are together in Albums and can be seen on the link below. Click on an Album to see the larger pictures...

www.ipernity.com

English Canals

By Pedrocut.
www.ipernity.com www.ipernity.com
 
Canal walking - in areas where canals exist of course - is fine. There are no hills, just an occasional slope at some locks and overbridges, no motor vehicles usually, although cyclists may present some caution. I had an aunt who frequently walked a couple of miles or so along the Trent & Mersey most days.
 
Radiorails said:
Canal walking - in areas where canals exist of course - is fine. There are no hills, just an occasional slope at some locks and overbridges, no motor vehicles usually, although cyclists may present some caution. I had an aunt who frequently walked a couple of miles or so along the Trent & Mersey most days.
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All walking is fine, Lake District in Winter?
www.ipernity.com

Lake District Winter Walks

By Pedrocut.
www.ipernity.com www.ipernity.com
 
Pedrocut said:
May be of interest to anyone interested in canals. I have several pictures of the Midland canals from walks over the years. They are together in Albums and can be seen on the link below. Click on an Album to see the larger pictures...

www.ipernity.com

English Canals

By Pedrocut.
www.ipernity.com www.ipernity.com
Click to expand...
Pedro, what a superb collection, you can actually feel the peace and serenity of the canal in all of them. Was that the Hattòn flight in the Grand Union Collection?
Bob
 
Another look at the Lapal Canal site in Selly Oak from the Worcester & Birmingham Canal below Sainsbury's.

Near the Bristol Road.

Possible towpath (not sure).



If the canal is to be rebuilt, they will need to dig up here and build another footbridge.

 
I remember the Stratford canal, being overgrown with weed. before dad could fish he had to clear a patch, The water was clean, the lock pounds were clean, full of wild life and not used. much. we would have a swim when the weather got very hot which it did back then. i sure would not go in the water now.the tow paths were green with wild flowers.and water irises were growing along the banks.
 
Towpaths on the W & B were mostly clear / clean in Selly Oak and Edgbaston, apart from certain patches.

The Stratford-on-Avon Canal from Kings Heath to Yardley Wood was quite muddy the last time I went on it. Both canals have cyclists regularly going up and down.


Ariel Aqueduct on the Worcester & Birmingham Canal today.





 
ellbrown said:
Towpaths on the W & B were mostly clear / clean in Selly Oak and Edgbaston, apart from certain patches.

The Stratford-on-Avon Canal from Kings Heath to Yardley Wood was quite muddy the last time I went on it. Both canals have cyclists regularly going up and down.


Ariel Aqueduct on the Worcester & Birmingham Canal today.





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thanks for pics very nice.
last time i saw the water in acocks green it was like a sewer, filthy. as for cycling my friend and I had a tandom,we peddled miles on that, along tow paths we would camp and off again next day.
 
ellbrown said:
Holliday Street Aqueduct. Mainly to see what it was like with 3 Arena Central above.





I noticed metal fatigue as I went past.

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Thanks Ell, I would come wizzing up Holiday Street under the aqueduct on my way to work and I was always late.
P J Evans Rolls Royce and Jaguar sevice department was on the corner.
 
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Holiday Street Aqueduct is a Grade 11 Listed Building, and according to Historic England wasbuilt in 1870..
historicengland.org.uk

HOLLIDAY STREET CANAL AQUEDUCT, Non Civil Parish - 1076303 | Historic England

List entry 1076303. Grade II Listed Building: Holliday Street Canal Aqueduct. May include summary, reasons for designation and history.
historicengland.org.uk historicengland.org.uk

There is a nice video by Andy Savage on a Blog dedicated to Andrew Hardyside and Co. According to the Blog the bridge was built in 1884.

There is a drawing to the aqueduct on the site Made on the Canal reproduced below... https://madeonthecanal.co.uk/shop/birmingham-skyline-greeting-card-srkhe-en2jd-na6b6

C843D498-44ED-4A32-93FF-790916A0CD0C.jpeg


(edited to say that I have sent a message to Andy Savage concerning the construction date)
 
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