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Burial of someone who committed suicide

Chris_Baker

Chris_Baker

master brummie
Sad to say, my great grandfather committed suicide in 1928. I recently got a copy of the inquest papers from the Central Library. Very sobering reading, especially when the file contained his original suicide note. Sent a bit of a chill up my spine, I can tell you.

My question is this. Given that suicide was illegal and seen as a very bad thing, would his burial have to be in non-consecrated ground?

Where might my GGF (who lived on Frankfort Street, not far from Summer Lane) be buried if that is the case and assuming he was buried reasonably close to home?
 
Chris I really wish you luck on this I have been searching the same thing in my family but couldn't even get the coroners report because it was destroyed in the war.:(.please let me know if you have any luck:)
 
This is an interesting query, my Gt Gt Gt Grandfather commited suicide, was shocking to learn, although from what i read of the newspaper report on the inquest I have my doubts, I haven't found where he's buried yet as it's Gloucester so need to travel there to inquire, but it would be interesting to know if he was allowed a Christian burial. I wonder if Wendy would know as she does a lot of work at Keyhill maintaining it?
 
Hi Claire
Doubtful if someone who committed suicide would have a christian burial but I don't know for sure..when I was at Dudley Archives looking for info on my one i saw things like children of a couple of months refused because they hadn't been baptised it was such a shame..
 
My g/father committed suicide in 1934 l have the newspaper cutting about it...poor man this was his third attempt, he obviousley was a very troubled man l guess in those days depression was'nt looked upon as an illness....he was buried in witton cemetry and l'm sure he had a christian buriel as he was a devoute Weslyan Methodist.....wished l knew more about him but the family was always hush hush about it. infact his youngest son my uncle did'nt find out untill he was in his 50's....Brenda
 
Hi Brenda It looks like things had changed by the 1900s I was looking for 1881 and was really surprised that the church or whoever could treat people that way..as I said it was really sad
 
Hi Maggie thanks for that, poor old sole, this was back in about 1876, he was drunk apparently, left no note just did it out of the blue in his 70's, I just find it very strange. You would have thought considering most religions preach forgiveness, that they would show some compassion, doesn't seem they had much does it, very sad as you say.
 
Claire Gloucestershire Record Office has the best online database for genealogy that I have come across. I am posting the genealogy search page but have a look round the site as there are many coroners report references if memory serves. When I asked for a particular record on a member of my family who was charged with a criminal offence & aquitted the supply of the documents was very prompt & inexpensive.
https://ww3.gloucestershire.gov.uk/genealogy/Search.aspx
 
Chris Baker,I too wondered about the burial.My maternal grandfather
committed suicide in 1943 and my mother would never talk about it.
She was an only child so there has never really been anyone to ask,but I do know that my grandparents had purchased a plot in the local churchyard long before his death and the grave was never used.
When we came to live in Birmingham my grandmother came with us and she made over the deeds of the grave to her brother.
Perhaps her husband was not allowed to be buried there.
 
Thanks for that Bordesley, will be checking that out now....i only have scant info as it was sent to me by someone i matched with on GR, hopefully i can find more, it's so difficult when it isn't on your doorstep like Brum :)
 
Claire it is possible to search on Gloucestershire Record Office just using the surname. I found an 1814 will using that technique. Good luck.
Shirley
 
I've just been looking on there and there is nothing for him even tho i have a copy of the newspaper article, i did find however quite a lot for his wifes family, including the gaol records for two of her cousins hehe that is going to make interesting reading when i order those hehe
 
The Church of England had (have) some weird mumbo-jumbo and the burial of people who had died by their own hand seems to fit into that category.
It was customary for the bodies to be taken as near as possible to the boundary of the parish and buried. Frequently, boundaries were and still are water courses: streams, rivers and the like. It has to be borne in mind that building development was not at the concentrated level of today and todays cities were at one time numerous villages separated by rural countyside. The grave would be unmarked and unrecorded.
Many people today would consider burial in some rural idyl a peaceful and tranqil last resting place.
At peace at last.
Ted
 
My GGF committed suicide and I have read the coroners report held in Bham library. I went to the burial records he is listed as normal and is buried in a common grave at Witton
Chris B
 
the same priciple applyes to people whom have been sentenced to be hung in prison
will not be burried in a cemetry once they have been hung in prison
they are burried with in the prison walls there is quite afew prisons whom have these poor souls burried with in the prisons including winso green
best wishes astonian ,;;;
 
Claire I am delighted that you have found family on the Gloucestershire site. The RO staff will send you a quote by email & once the cheque is received by them despatch of docs is by return post or the following day, in my experience. You can expect to read, on goal records, a physical description, details of the charge and behaviour. Enjoy!
 
Wow that's brilliant Bordesley, can't wait to get my hands on them.. I knew one was a bit of a rogue as he was in the local police station the night of a census, he died a few years later, I am intrigued to know now if it was in prison lol
 
Alf, thank you for those two sites...lv'e read the first one and never realised it was such a serious crime...thank goodness we have become somewhat civilised in our laws about suicide....my poor g/father was a very troubled man and on the coroners report was he committed suicide while of unsound mind....l understand there was a mystery never to be solved as supposidly he had a bank account that had regular withdrawls untill all the money was gone, the mystery was were did it all go...l will read the second site when l have a few minutes to spare....Brenda
 
There is one important distinction that I dont think anyone has made yet in this thread. Church graveyards are under the control of the clergy and suicides may have been refused burial on the basis that the act was a mortal sin. Cemetaries on the other hand were and are under the jurisdiction of the local authority/ burial company. Burial there would not have been such a problem although there was no guarantee that a minister would have officiated at the interment. Suicide was once a criminal offence and many failed attempts were prosecuted. I lived in rural southern Ireland where attitides have not changed and I do know that many family doctors would invent a cause of death where suicide occured to avoid the awful stigma attached to self harm. I suspect this has happened in the UK more than once.
 
My friends brother commited suicide not so long ago. I will contact her and ask what happened to his remains.
 
Chris_Baker said:
Sad to say, my great grandfather committed suicide in 1928. I recently got a copy of the inquest papers from the Central Library. Very sobering reading, especially when the file contained his original suicide note. Sent a bit of a chill up my spine, I can tell you.

My question is this. Given that suicide was illegal and seen as a very bad thing, would his burial have to be in non-consecrated ground?
Click to expand...

Yes, Chris. I have listed all the inquest cases at Walsall from 1910, when the Walsall Coroner starts until mid 1980s. I have come across some wierd and sad things in inquest files - even do a talk on them for local/FH history groups - tram tickets in 1915 is the strangest thing that survives in a case file as yet!

Suicide was illegal until the 1961 Suicide Act. However, Robert Peel, when Home Sec (i think it was 1823) stopped the practice of burying suicides in public highways etc and they COULD be buried in consecrated ground. Now some clergy wouldnt allow it, some would as they were sympathetic to the coroner verdict which usually says 'took own life, whilst balance of mind was disturbed'.

Most of this moral issue was taken away with the opening of the civil cemeteries after the 1853 Burial Act (Brum also had Key Hill and Warstone Lane, which were private companies in effect until taken over by council in 1950s i think.

These are my early cemetery history notes used in the catalogue in Brum Archives, just put them on for interest: i believe there was also a site that was nearly used at what is now Hodge Hill Comp - the Corp were going to buy it of Lord Bradford.
After the passing of the Act and the inspection by the General Board of Health a few years before, in 1849, the Borough Council created its own Burial Board in 1858. The burial grounds within the Borough were due to be closed in July 1859, so the primary function of this new committee was to identify new sites for burial grounds within the Borough. The Board had to be replaced after a year, when they resigned after a proposal for a cemetery in Knowle, was rejected by the Borough Council, despite the Board negotiating with the Great Western Railway for cost of transporting coffins on the train and passenger rates. The new Board immediately identified a site at Witton, which was purchased and drained in 1860. Over the next few years the buildings were erected and the cemetery opened in 1863. A Superintendent of the Borough Cemetery was appointed and the burial fees established. The Burial Board went on to establish a Roman Catholic mortuary chapel at Witton. The functions of the Board were to maintain and administer the cemetery, investigate complaints, staffing issues etc. From time to time, the Board established sub-committees for specific purposes and there appears to have been a Finance Sub-Committee, but there are currently no minutes for any of these. In December 1874, the Burial Board was merged with the Estates Committee.

Hope its of interest
 
Thank you, Archivist. It is certainly of interest. I must have a go through the Witton registers at some point, but I am not holding my breath that he will be there.
 
Hi Chris

My Grandmother commited suicide in 1937, she is buried in Christ Church Quinton

I think, by the sound of it each Church had its own rules, some had consecrated and uncensecrated ground within the church yard

Jackie
 
I did ask my friend about this, as her brother committed suicide. However, he was cremated, but she thought the law on being able to have them buried in consecrated ground had changed. But like second marriages, I suppose it could be the church's have their own rules.
 
Good day, I have a relative George Carter CHAMP committed suicide in march 1906 while of 'unsound mind'. He was buried in Warstone Lane cemetery which I understand was privately owned at that time. The inquest took place in Birmingham on 24th march 1906; where would I find the courts summary please? I lived too far away to be able to visit but wonder if it can be done online?
Many thanks. Mike
 
MJC( said:
Good day, I have a relative George Carter CHAMP committed suicide in march 1906 while of 'unsound mind'. He was buried in Warstone Lane cemetery which I understand was privately owned at that time. The inquest took place in Birmingham on 24th march 1906; where would I find the courts summary please? I lived too far away to be able to visit but wonder if it can be done online?
Many thanks. Mike
Click to expand...
Welcome to the forum, Mike. I'm afraid you won't find the report on line. Birmingham Archives requires a personal visit. But as these files are open to the public anyone can request to read the report. https://www.birmingham.gov.uk/info/50164/family_history_research/1560/coroner_inquests/3 I'm afraid visiting the archives in Birmingham is not as straightforward as it might be though. Have you read the newspaper reports at the time?
The inquest reports can be very graphic and the detail upsetting. So that's something to consider too.
Derek
 
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