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Brummie Ghosts

Hi All,
Has anyone heard of a ghost in Villa Park as my wife has actually seen one in the Holte End?
 
Hiya Folks,

I don't know if any of the forum readers have seen some of the press coverage that we've received recently regarding Great Barr and Barr Beacon hauntings, but a re-cap can be viewed on our new-ish blog page (with more updates pending at present):

https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/

Basically - because of the close proximity / cross over position of this region to Brum, I was hoping / wondering whether any forum users might be able to add something to the affair at all?

I've done a little research on the general history of the area and have come up with some vague references to archaeological remnants on the Beacon itself.. Any info in this direction would also be greatly appreciated too?

Best wishes to all,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
 
its only the people whom have not wittnes a ghost that do not beleive just like
o
they ur scienceist they have never seen a ufo in reality doctors tell patients
and the shrinks tel patients its all in the mind --but,as they say seeing is beleiving
so its all these sceptics make up the percentace that say that it does not happened
if you seen the bbc this morning discussing it they tell you it 43 percent of the population now beleive go to key hill very late evening in the dark
around where the chapel for cremation used to be take a seat in the grounds if the benches are there still beleive me one is sure to appear we have experienced this a group of us in the sixties i will not mentioned any body name of a grave in volved for
i do not want to be seen as offending again best wishes astonian ;;;
they say that 43 percent now beleive go into the cemetry late of a night
 
Hi Astonian,

I'd been asked to go onto local radio this morning to comment on the research that you mention, but something more important came up in the end and they apparently did a feature on something else!!:D:D:D

Personally speaking - I wouldn't advise anyone to go into Key Hill Cemetry after dark...... Nothing to do with seeing ghosts, etc, but mainly because you don't know whether you'd come out alive! If you didn't get set-upon by numerous undesirables, you'd probably get a few needle pricks during your visit and succumb to some horrible disease later on!!! (I would put a couple of smiley faces if it wasn't such a worrying subject!)

I recall reading a report by one group who mentions the needles during an investigation and thought to myself how desperate they must be for an 'experience' to take such risks.....

Regards,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
 
Hi all,

As a child I often stayed with an aunt and uncle who lived in Albert Road Aston and spent many a summers day with my cousins playing in Aston Park. I was enthralled and terrified at the same time by the ghost stories about Aston Hall, about a young girl locked away by her father for falling in love with a man considered 'beneath' her. Did anyone else hear that story or similar? I'd love to hear them.

Macca
 
hi macca
yes i have heard many stories about aston hall when i was growing up
on the lichfield rd and the stories about aston hall in times gone bye
how they offered sums of one hundred pounds to sleep in certain parts of the hall
and one story was told by neibour and freinds of the days when they done guided tours through the secret passages one freind of our family ray jarrett
was relaying the story his parents told him of a murder in the one secret passage
and from that day to this day all such tours of passages were stopped
and also they claim going back in centuries there was a passage coming from the hall down the big hill to the side of the aston parish church
there was one incident in the early fifties one night where upon an old lady was a scraggy face and unkempt hair with two candle on sticks was lying across a grave screaming and shouting and performing people called the police from victoria
rd and they brought dogs and the fire brigade with whopping big search lights
and they scoured the church yard for hours but she disapeared and they went down around the back of the old aston church yard and found a door
which they claiom thats where she came from and disapeared and they associated it with aston hall you know the magic word , seeing is beleiving and thous whom have not seen a chost are sceptitable and say alsorts of things for reasons
never mind what the mad sciecens ,s tell you they do excist but only in small numbers now and it not the figments of peoples imaginations
but yes there is quite alot of people whom have got storys on aston hall
what about the loueigie board for spirits how many have you experienced that
i have yet got to find some-one whom will come and perform one for me they all decline because they have seen the spirits -- chost if any body will do one cal me or visit the key hill cem late early evening
best wishes astonian
 
Macca said:
Hi all,
the ghost stories about Aston Hall, about a young girl locked away by her father for falling in love with a man considered 'beneath' her. Did anyone else hear that story or similar? I'd love to hear them.
Macca
Click to expand...

Hi Macca,

Indeed, this is the classic / legendary ghost story associated with Aston Hall. I have a postcard (from the early part of the 20th Century) which shows a photograph of a small door..... on the back is printed 'The Prison Room - Aston Hall' or some such. Funnily enough, though - if you speak with anyone who has actually witnessed something potentially paranormal at Aston Hall - the only possible sighting of the girl ghost occurred some 20 plus years ago now??? All of the other stuff listed seems quite unrelated to the legend concerned - i.e. the figure of a small boy being seen; the figure of a middle aged / elderly lady being seen; smokey effects being seen, etc.

Re. some of the comments being put forward by Astonian: 'seeing is believing' to a great many people - and, of course, we solely rely on such stories for our bread and butter - but you ask any policeman (or anyone involved in law enforcement or the juducial system) and they'll all tell you that the 'least reliable' form of evidence possible is eye-witness testimony. Certainly food for thought.

Re. ouija boards - I have no problems at all with using such contraptions, except for the simple fact that they have nothing whatsoever to do with the paranormal, spirits and so on...... I'd be more inclined to play Monopoly or Ludo in an endeavour to contact the spirits, personally!!:D:D:D

All the best,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
hi nick
the story of the girl was around more than forty years ago it goes
further back and that i would say eighty years ago to my reckoning
and the disapearing lady from the secret passages so surely if this did happened would there have been some kind of written story line in them days was it the birmingham post about the reporting of a person so my calulation it would have been late 1800.s possibly very early 1900.s but i think its strange that we don,t hear so much about ghost now or spirits like they did in the old days i myself do beleive it still excist today but you have to be in the right place right time
i could say alot more on the subject but i will not for reasons of my own
have a nice day nick , best wishes astonian ;;
 
Astonian said:
hi nick
the story of the girl was around more than forty years ago it goes
further back and that i would say eighty years ago to my reckoning


and the disapearing lady from the secret passages so surely if this did happened would there have been some kind of written story line in them days was it the birmingham post about the reporting of a person so my calulation it would have been late 1800.s possibly very early 1900.s


but you have to be in the right place right time
Click to expand...

Hi Astonian,

The story concerning the daughter of Thomas Holte - Mary - has been doing the rounds for a century at least..... though, strangely, there is no actual evidence that the crime concerned (incarceration in the tower room for 16 or so years, etc) actually occurred??? It would be interesting to discover exactly when this story began? Apparently, Holte was a horrible bloke and has long been credited with murdering his cook in a fit of anger!!?? Some stories say this happened at Aston Hall - his body being buried under the cellar floor - but other accounts say it occurred elsewhere.....

The tale of the vanishing lady would also certainly be something to try and chase up, if at all possible?

If there is anything to ghost sightings and experiences, I would totally concur with you Astonian on your 'right place at right time' comment. I would also suggest that you have to be the 'right sort of person' in the 'right frame of mind' too....

All the best,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
The family crest of the Holtes was in fact a Red Hand, and the legend goes that one of the Holtes (maybe Sir Tom) lopped off the hand of his butler when the poor bloke served up the wrong wine at dinner. However, the Red Hand crest is actually the Red Hand of Ulster, otherwise the Bloody Hand, and I suspect that superstitious Aston locals, after a gutful of Ansells, came up with the butler story to impress their kids.

My dad used to tell the tale of the lady who disappeared at Aston Hall - his story was that she vanished at her wedding-feast. But this is just a re-hash of the ancient legend of the Mistletoe Bough - half the stately homes of England have such a legend. The famous Victorian song was apparently inspired by the Minster Lovell Hall version of the legend.

Big Gee
 
I'm sure that the 'lopping hand' story and that of the murdered cook (a skewer stuck through him, etc) are one and the same tale really - but with a considerable bit of poetic licence added, of course, Big Gee!!:D But this does go to show how these things get started, twisted out of proportion and finally taken for fact (in a great many instances). :D A lot of our ghostlore falls into the same rut, needless to say.......

The tale of the Mistletoe Bough Bride that you mention is certainly no exception. As a child, I used to read through different ghost related books and find myself utterly perplexed at the amount of houses where giggling brides had - during a post-wedding game of hide and seek - secreted themselves in some box or other (in an attic or cellar, depending on the tale)..... and never been re-discovered for years!?!?:D:D

Regards,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
Ghost of a Gamekeeper at Cop Mere Staffordshire...Cat

Nicholas, my story is somewhat similar to yours, Holte cleaved the cooks head in two because He/she kept forgetting the salt...Cat
 
Last edited by a moderator:
The tale I heard as a child growing up in Aston was there was a ghost known as the Grey Lady who wafted down from the Hall towards Aston Parish Church, I don't remember whether it was supposed to be the daughter that was locked up for years.

Another story I was told was a girl was murdered in the last cubicle of the lady's toilets in the park, never heard this confirmed, but we certainly would never use that cubicle.
 
My Dad was a park keeper in Aston Park in the late 1940's early 1950's and he tells me that quite often whilst ensuring the Hall was locked for the night footsteps would be heard on the servants stairs and doors that had previously been locked had mysteriously managed to unlock and open themselves
 
sylviasayers said:
The tale I heard as a child growing up in Aston was there was a ghost known as the Grey Lady who wafted down from the Hall towards Aston Parish Church, I don't remember whether it was supposed to be the daughter that was locked up for years.

Another story I was told was a girl was murdered in the last cubicle of the lady's toilets in the park, never heard this confirmed, but we certainly would never use that cubicle.
Click to expand...

The female ghost associated with the hall who has been seen numerous times (to my knowledge) is allegedly that of a former housekeeper. She is usually seen on one of the upper landings of the building. I believe I've only ever heard one single testimony regarding the daughter.... and this occurred some time in the 1980's. (The chappy who saw the ghost appeared on an episode of 'The Time, The Place' - concerning ghosts, of course - which was actually broadcast from Aston Hall).

Sylviasayers - I think that the ghost in the park itself has long been thought to be that of 'The Female Blondin', who supposedly suffered a fatal accident during a tight-rope stunt in the grounds in 1863??? (Of course, this sounds unlikely, of course, but - given the silly ways of the paranormal culture - everytime there is a known death in an area and something potentially paranormal happens subsequently, there just 'has' to be a direct connection!!:D:D)

I had also heard that there had been a murder in the park too..... I think it was said to be associated with the old stable block-style building near the hall? (Is this where the lavvies are?)

The problem with Aston Hall as a site of potential (ghostly) interest is the simple fact that the stories are exceptionally hit and miss to record and are evidently prone to change with time. Over the years, it's been a somewhat vexed task to try and record the ghostlore of the property (especially when dealing with numerous members of staff). In the past, details - or people willing to impart information - seem to have been exceptionally rare indeed. There was always a distinct feeling of having approached a 'taboo' subject in some way when asking spook related questions!!:D:D (One old security chap was an absolute mine of information though, having taken great interest in such subjects himself!)

Regards,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
Nicholas, yes the toilets were part of the old stable block. When I first heard the story of the murder I wasn't very old, perhaps about 1947 or thereabouts, we used to go to the park almost every day in the summer, in the evenings after school, and for most of the day during the school holidays. We roamed near and far in those days without our parents having to worry if we were safe. If it rained we would go in Aston Hall for shelter, I knew it like the back of my hand.
 
Hi Nick,

My wife and I were at Northycote Farm, Bushbury nr Wolverhampton today. We've been there several times for the various music festivals, but today was the the first time we've been around the old house. I believe it's been investigated by the WMGC at some point in the recent past. My main concern was my bonce, as I'm 6'4" tall and most of the doorways aren't..... Walking around the place with a dozen others, it seemed to me to have a perfectly normal atmosphere, and was for the most part light and airy. The only sense of melancholy I felt was at the site of the old chapel. But it was chilly, windy and drizzling, so maybe it was just the weather getting at me. Viewing the photo-montage and speaking to the guide, the place was totally derelict until about 30 years ago, when reconstruction commenced. My wife, who's Irish and a bit fey, said she felt nothing but good vibes about the place. They do really good eggs and chips, too....

Big Gee
 
Big Gee said:
Hi Nick,

My wife and I were at Northycote Farm, Bushbury nr Wolverhampton today. We've been there several times for the various music festivals, but today was the the first time we've been around the old house. I believe it's been investigated by the WMGC at some point in the recent past. My main concern was my bonce, as I'm 6'4" tall and most of the doorways aren't..... Walking around the place with a dozen others, it seemed to me to have a perfectly normal atmosphere, and was for the most part light and airy. The only sense of melancholy I felt was at the site of the old chapel. But it was chilly, windy and drizzling, so maybe it was just the weather getting at me. Viewing the photo-montage and speaking to the guide, the place was totally derelict until about 30 years ago, when reconstruction commenced. My wife, who's Irish and a bit fey, said she felt nothing but good vibes about the place. They do really good eggs and chips, too....

Big Gee
Click to expand...

Hi Big Gee,

Indeed, the group did investigate Northycote Farm a few months ago, but this was something of a re-visit, as we first covered the site (three or four times, I think?) back in 1997.

I've just had to laugh about your 'size' issues, as - when we first went there - one of our (then) group members was six feet 7! Thankfully though, I don't recall anyone having suffered any lasting injuries!?:D At other sites, however, one member did draw copious amounts of blood from a low, concrete beam in a pub cellar once and the Manor House at West Bromwich was an absolute mine field when it came to impending head injuries!! (I once literally 'saw stars' after jogging through one doorway without first checking head-room!:D)

Back to Northycote, there is a list of out activities here - related ghost stories, etc - at this link:

https://www.westmidlandsghostclub.com/page27.htm

It's a most interesting site and, even if the local council were a bit reticent to actually take responsibility for the renovation of the site, etc, it was wonderful that the place was saved after lying derelict for so long. It's just a terrible pity that other places don't receive the same consideration from their local authorities......

Best wishes,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
Thanks to a good friend of mine, I've just been able to post up some video footage - obtained during an investigation of the Manor House in West Bromwich a few years ago - to our photo album. The recording concerned appears to contain the sound of 'someone' walking up the staircase to the chapel / solar area of the property, despite the fact that none of the investigators in the building were anywhere near this area at that time.....

Ironically, until I was presented with this footage last night by the friend concerned, it was believed to have been 'lost'..... having been misplaced around three years ago!

I would appreciate any comments that forum users have on the matter, as I am at a complete loss to explain the sounds away. (A full description of how the recording was obtained, etc, will appear on our blog shortly).

The footage can be viewed here:

https://westmidlandsghostclub.myphotoalbum.com/albums.php

Best wishes,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
Hi Nick,

I just looked at your Club's report reference Northycote Farm. Interesting. Someone I know who's been 'doing' the craft-fairs for many years said that she sometimes gets the weird impression that she's in some kind of time-slip when she's in the courtyard...could be the vodka, of course.

The sad thing about Northycote is that the annual Music Festival has been cancelled until further notice thanks to the activities of certain of the locals, who like nothing better than to steal from tents and camper-vans and to totally ruin the atmosphere in the bar. Feral kids, mostly, who really should be taken away and shot. The cost of hiring security staff is apparently too high for the council to cover, yet really all they need to do is charge a modest entry-fee.

Big Gee
 
Big Gee said:
The sad thing about Northycote is that the annual Music Festival has been cancelled until further notice thanks to the activities of certain of the locals, who like nothing better than to steal from tents and camper-vans and to totally ruin the atmosphere in the bar. Feral kids, mostly, who really should be taken away and shot. The cost of hiring security staff is apparently too high for the council to cover, yet really all they need to do is charge a modest entry-fee.
Click to expand...

I have to admit that I'm not at all surprised by this Big Gee. Despite the fact that the area immediately surrounding Northycote has a lovely semi-rural feel to it, it is situated only a stones throw from some of the worst housing estates in the Midlands!:shocked:

My mother and father lived just on the other side of Bushbury Hill during the 1970's and - even back then - you couldn't pop out to the nearby shops and leave your washing on the line, as it wouldn't be there when you returned!! (I - honestly - kid you not!!) I believe they were burgled 5 times in the few years that they lived there.... Needless to say, the region has certainly not improved with time......

Regards,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
The ghost of the woman in the phonebox in Erdington, does the phonebox still stand?

Also, does anyone have any light on the story about the housefire that killed her family?
 
NN2009 said:
The ghost of the woman in the phonebox in Erdington, does the phonebox still stand?

Also, does anyone have any light on the story about the housefire that killed her family?
Click to expand...

The phone-box is no longer there.

Where did the story originate that the ghost was desperately trying to call for assistance because her house was on fire?

Big Gee
 
NN2009 said:
The ghost of the woman in the phonebox in Erdington, does the phonebox still stand?

Also, does anyone have any light on the story about the housefire that killed her family?
Click to expand...


Hi NN2009,

The phone box which features in the original story was apparently removed when the change from the old red boxes was made years ago. Of course, this hasn't stopped people like Richard Felix featuring a new model in his god-awful 'Brum Ghosts' DVD!!!!:D:D

The story of the house burning down, etc, is nothing but one of those embellishments you find being associated with such tales..... Such information was never mentioned in the original story (which was first printed in the local press as a by-product of investigations by a Sutton based researcher called Colin Smith in the 70's / early 80's. The tale was first, widely publicised in the books by the late Andrew Green, who was honorary president of the club run by Smith).

The original published data (from media interviews with Colin who was told the story 1st hand by witnesses) runs as follows (in short): Incident occurred December 1975. Three people were waiting outside the phone box, including a Catholic priest. All saw a woman inside the box - perfectly normal / contemporary looking, 25 to 30 years old and dressed in dark blue costume, with reddish polo-neck jumper. Somewhat impatiently, the priest opened the door of the box - intending to use the telephone directory - and the woman allegedly vanished before his eyes......

Nowhere in the original news stories / book entries are there any further sightings of the woman mentioned...... and all references found for a number of years deal solely with the aforementioned experience. (Colin had suggested that the figure seen was that of a living person apparently falling into the category of apparitions of the living, etc).

However, in the years to come and right up until the present, it is strongly suggested that this matter is indeed a 'haunting' and a number of people had also seen the figure of the woman over a prolonged period, etc. Typically, no witnesses come forward to relate their personal experiences, of course, suggesting that the ghostlore concerned is nothing more than the propagation / continuance of a 'friend of a friend' tale based on the original encounter.

As mentioned re. the 'fire' related aspect of the tale, such stories - with each re-telling - gather momentum (description-wise, especially) like the old snowball rolling down hill....... The figure concerned has - as mentioned - become a matter of a 'long running haunting' over the decades (despite no fresh experiences coming to light and the same initial story continually being referred to!) The woman described has - over recent years - become dressed in period costume.... mainly being referred to as Victorian. (Despite the initial winess testimony saying she seemed totally normal and contemporary to the mid-70's). Also erroneously, she is now frequently referred to as 'the lady in the pink cardigan' and 'the woman in the red dress' for some reason(???) The tale has also been embellished at one point with the details that she apparently smells of 'pear drops', indicating that she has been 'poisoned with prussic acid'........ this detail appears in at least one newspaper article and is almost certainly a mixture of two ghost stories associated with the Brum suburbs (the other case being from the Hockley area, but also appearing in the press around the same time as the phone box case, etc). Needless to say, more recently, the fire related stories have been attached to the case.......

Regards,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
Thanks Big Gee.....

Re. the media - they certainly don't help very much in maintaining the 'purity' of / in paranormal related tales (especially), at times!:D At the end of the day, I guess they see a lot of this sort of thing for what it really is and treat it accordingly....... It's not as if they're going to get sued by any paranormal agency for mis-representation of heritage or what-not!?!?:D

Needless to say, this sort of thing is something of a double-edged-sword to paranormal researchers.... It's interesting to see (from a social history / psychological angle) where these things can actually lead to or what the stories eventually develop into.... However, it can also be a real bind at other times, when you're suddenly and totally bogged down with the complete and utter cr*p which has erroneously entered the ghostlore of a particular place or event.... :D:D:D

Regards,

Nick
www.westmidlandsghostclub.com
https://westmidlandsghostclub.blogspot.com/
 
NICHOLAS.
Have just been looking at the last post in the forum and in particular "Ghosts and the Media"
I think that what you say is fair comment on how the media behaves in general, however, and its a big however!, its also fair to say that: going out to cover a "ghost story" is very unpredictable as I am sure you are aware, coming back with nothing! does not please the editor or, if its radio, the producer!. I speak with experience here as several of our students went out to record quite a few "ghostly happenings for their radio projects, only to come back with nothing!!!
One exception to this was Aston Hall, where in almost every case, the tape machines refused to work. I sent 6 machines on one occaision and none of them would record, however, on return to the studio, they were found to be working fine. I even took one myself, only to find that the battery was flat, until I returned, when It was found to be quite OK!
So, don't be too hard on the media, maybe the ghosts don't want to be recorded or filmed! . Its a thought as, most humans don't either.
Nice to be back on the forum anyway and look forward to more of your "Comments" TEZZA
 
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