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Victoria Law Courts

Steve.c said:
I agree, handing it over as a 'leisure' development would be a crying shame. The law acadamy is the prefered idea, trouble is the place is extremely expensive to operate (around 4mil per year).
As it stands though, it is going to remain as Court of law. It's possible the Crown court could move back in. Either way, there needs to be quite a bit spent on doing up the cells as they are not upto standard!
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Hi All,

Why should the Crown Court move back in? They are in a building that is only a few years old and was purpose built? As for the cells they are only hollding cells. When prisoners who have been kept in custody either at Steelhouse Lane Police Station or Winson Green Prison are due to appear in court they are taken from Steelhouse Lane Police Station through an underground passage to the area under the Viictoria Law Courts. They then wait in the holding cells until their case is called. They are only there for a few hours at the most,

As for the courts themselves they have been allowed to deteriorate. They used to be the responsibility of the police. A Chief Inspector lived on the premises in a flat with his family and acted as curator. He saw to it that everything was maintained as it should be. Nowadays no one seems to have the responsibilty to ensure that everything is clean and kept in good repair. Hence, the courts are gradually disintegrating.

Old Boy
 
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hi old boy well how interesting...i did not know about the underground passage or the fact that the courts used to have a live in chief inspector....this is no way to treat such a fine building...i sometimes just give up....

lyn
 
Hi old boy
a you saying that from th old victoria law courts from steel house lane they actualy built an under ground tunnel across from the the victoria
to the moderern dat day new victoria courts the courts hey built afew years back ; i know of the history of th orinional law courts
and the under round channels below ground which goes from one end of he courts in steel house lane
which is way below ground level to take prisoners up to any given court witin the complex from steel house lane
and that number one and two courts was the major court rooms for big seriuos cases and was used by judge argly
the most feared judge in the days they called the quarter sessions and of course the cadbury family
and for hanging cases and it also the designed of cells below ground and yes the chief used to be a care taker there in days gone bye
but i am surprized to hear that they built an extended tunnel across the road to the new victoria courts
and es my family ancesters was some body in he legal sysem of birminghamand my gand paents was connected to the central law courts as i said afew years ago now as they served the birmingham courts of high postion as my grand father was a serving police oficier and the oher side of my grand parent hood was a serving judges and in specal cases of being serving certain jurriors for certain cases and certain uncles was solictors
with in birmingham in the early years right up until the fifties
and with in the city houseing dept ment of the old bush house early years so i do know alot of the history of birmingham central courts
and to think they are going to sell off this fantasic building of hearitage and history of birmingham for a gym
whom his responible for that i would like to know ;personaly we did not need that new court they built a waste of public money ;
and the planning department wants to reorganise themselves astonian
 
Well as it stands it is not going to be sold off and will remain as a court building.

We would potentially move the crown court back in as a bid to cut costs. QEII law courts was purpose built for the Crown, however it is not a protected building and so would be easier to change the use of it.

The cells at Victoria law courts may well be holding cells but they must still meet certain standards, the ones at Victoria do not come up to those strandards. To put it into perspective, a day in court cells is usually counted as a day in prison, however the conditions at Victoria are so bad that prisoners spending a day in them are creditted with 2 days in prison to take into account the poor living conditions. Although prisoners are not routinely held over night in court cells, it is possible for them to be in them for many hours, especially if produced from the prisons early, and kept till late evening at court.
 
hi steve
what is the difference between the two cells i presume they have a toillet facil;
and a bench from the old victoria to the new courts they are locked in there for a reason it should not be like a hotel lobby of confort
and the old vic will stand emty and deteriate or are we just keeping it for its capicity of number of prisoners it can hold
over the old vic and steel house lane for any other purpose than that as it holds a large capicity i know it must be about two hundred
but then you may say its heating problems as to why it moved yes the old vic does look like old dungeons
 
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No they don't have a toilet in the cell, they have to ask to use a toilet and are then escorted to the block. Victoria Law courts are going to be kept as a going concern for the forceable future. the initial plan was to put all the courts together in a court centre or 'super court' as it was being referred to. The MoJ still has massive savings to make, a big chunk of the money is spent on buildings, therfore the pressure is on to reduce the number of buildings. There are 4 seperate court buildings in Birmingham and the MoJ is looking at ways to cut those costs. One way would be to move the crown court from QE to Victoria and then sell off the QE building.
I'm not sure on cell capacity, it certain olds quite a few. I agree that the prisoners are locked in for a reason however, the cells have to be upto scratch, there is an independant board of inspectors, made up of volunteers from the commuinty and they inspect all custody cells. The cells have to meet guidlaines laid down by the Human Rights convention and various other legislation. I'm not saying I agree with it, that just how it is.

I hope Victoria Law courts goes on for many years as court of law.
 
hi steve and thanks for all the info..i am finding this most interesting...and i too hope this wondful building will continue to be used for the purpose for which it was built

lyn
 
Hi Astonian,

You seem to have misread my post. I did not say that there was a passage from Steelhouse Lane Police Station to the new court which, by the way, is named Queen Eliizabeth Courts not Victoria Courts. The passage goes from Steelhouse Lane to the Victoria Law Courts which, in reality, are only next door.

Old Boy
 
HI OLD BOY
I Think we are getting crossed wires here i always knew about that i said this thread about four years ago
i did not dream there was a tunnel across town to your new queen victoria courts it would have been one hell of a job ;
and it was common knowledge of this to every body about the passage way ;
have a nice day best wishes astonian
 
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Chris,
Having passed through from Steelhouse Lane,to the court (a long time ago),I do remember the size of the cells,but not the route taken,and I was not appreciative of the historical surroundings.My mind was racing with what lies I would tell the magistrate,to make sure I was bailed and walked out the front door.:rolleyes:.
 
Wonder why it was named Coleridge Passage? Is there any connection? As always, great photos Ell.
 
Thanks Viv.

Been walking down here a lot lately, so I can get over to Colmore Row at lunchtimes from work.

I know that the QE II Law Courts were built on what was James Watt Street. Seems odd having a little section left Newton Street going past it.
 
Hi Viv: Bill Dargue posted a brief history of Birmingham Street names in March last year on this site and he mentioned that Coleridge Passage was named for Judge David Coleridge.
 
Thanks Jennyann. Was trying to work out the connection with the poet!! I looked on the History of Streetnames thread but only at the early list. Now see that it was extended. Very useful. Very useful. Viv.
 
Ray Barrett said:
Chris, s.My mind was racing with what lies I would tell the magistrate,to make sure I was bailed and walked out the front door.:rolleyes:.
Click to expand...
Hi Ray,

Whatever you told the magistrate I hope he believed it. I also hope you were not done by PC D47 because that was me.

Chris
 
Old Boy said:
Hi Ray,

Whatever you told the magistrate I hope he believed it. I also hope you were not done by PC D47 because that was me.

Chris
Click to expand...
Although I was never in the cells the rumour was that it was best to get taken to Digbeth than Steelhouse Lane as they didn,t slap so hard down there,Dek;);):D
 
Chris,
It wasn't you,I was "interviewed" by two sinister men in suits,:(but was rescued by a uniformed custody sgt.:)In the event I didn't lie to the magistrate,but my guilty plea was quickly followed by asking for bail,it was granted,because someone in the court spoke up for me. After the quarter sessions were over I never went back,and it was more than 50 years ago.:)
 
hi dek ;
you must be joking ; digbeth was worse thats where our horris was the jailer with his big bunch of keys
he was a very tall bloke and nasty he always carried a big ring of keys with him and he always boasted about the carrying on down the cells at digbeth along with the old senior tec; whom came to the big house partys of the grand fathers at number 1 ; new cannal street
yes the simular carrying still goes on behind closed doors at the lane they all feared going to digbeth ;
but as years went on it finally stopped by having the different generation of the human race as police officers being there
this was in the early years of the 1900s horris retired and went into the parks department and became a parkie
and patrolled the old church yard first up the top end of bordesley street just up the rd from is old jail digbeth
and eventualy he was moved to aston park and then summer field park and then the edgbaston resser he used to ride his old police bike
a dark green hercules bike chasing and god fearing the kds if he thought you was doing wrong like playing on and around peter pan at aston park or the playing on the bowling green there or any where near the windows of aston hall if he seen you peeping in the window
he used to race around the resser on his bike to catch kids
have a nice day dek ; best wishes alan ; astonian
 
Another thread that requires a bit of TLC from others, I've done my bit.

Phil
 
Don't know about anyone else, but I like re-visiting these threads. I realise it's a burden on those who originally added many images, but it's certainly worth the effort to get these back up to scratch. Thanks Phil. Oh, I've added my (paltry!)single photo to the thread, but apologies should have resized it:emmersed: Viv
 
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Yes, it is good; I missed reading this thread the first time round, so I've enjoyed it. There's just a couple of images missing that ChrisM posted, so it's a great thread to have back. I must go though my books etc as I think I may have information as well.
 
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I remember my one and only visit to the Law courts in the late 1950s when I was called to Jury service,I was most impressed with its size and grandeur, the case concerned obscene books and films being sold at a newsagents by the Aston Hippodrone. We were taken to watch a screening of the fims (with the Judge) in what appeared to be a small cinema still in the court buildings. Its just asgrand inside as outside. Eric
 
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Here's an early shot, sorry don't know the date.

Victoria_Assize_Courts.jpg
 
My Dad used to be one of the Stokers who kept the boilers going supplying hot water.
He worked there from about 1947 till he retired in about 1970 or so.
Several times as a kid I used to go in that first arched door in Coleridge Passage, down a ramp
and into his workshop. Using the overhead electric cranes and filling the boiler hoppers with coke
was a thrill for me. He had a number of boilers to watch over - remember very well going thru the
underground passages to other boilers across Newton Street in the Coroners & Crown Courts.
Just before coming home we'd have a shower in a huge tank of hot water which was cleaning the
air from somewhere in the building.
He also worked in the Police Station on Steelhouse Lane and their boilers were down the ramp opposite
the Childrens Hospital (where I was born). I remember the passageways from the Police Station thru
to the Court Building very well - even they were ornate.
 
hi shortie
surely not they are gonna knock this building down its a great listed building with lots of hearitage and history
with all its grand dezigns through out the structure and with the below ground facilitys of passage ways from one side to another
also there was a whisper that steele house lane police station was beng sold off thats a criminal offence within its self
i say bring back judge Argle he will sort out these highway men of the planning dept ;he would not let them sell off or destroy his courts
they should not be knocking down victoria ;but there again look what happenend t baskerville house ; [ sold of ]
why not sell it to the yanks it seems every think we own w sell them to the americans
there are hundred cells at least dowbn below ground level what happenends if we get a huge disturbance within the city like a huge riot
where are the police gonna take them to ;
i cannot fore see them knocking down our victoria ; extent it to the police department would be the best option closed out the frontage of steel house
lane offices and move them through into the victoria is a feesable option ; my opinion is i think the hearitage society do not have that much clout on certain propertys especialy goverment propertys ; i know the goverment are closing down all the benifits systems offices withinthe next five or six years
and that all claiments will be useing a telephone number to make an unemployed application ; where as up untill now you walk inand make your laim as being come unemployed ; i know thats a different issue but the victoria is a goverment buildig and surelynot these people from the planning department cannottake there own decision on such a building if you whatched the programe on them not so long ago about how they work in brum ; and on the subject of the pubs
one said she had never ever been near or seen the pub in question nor would never enter it but voted agaist the pub to be demoed ;
so that say alot about them; and i for one was warned off ;so what chance have we got or the hearitage society ;
have a nice day best wishes Astonian;;
 
Alan Shortie made her comment in 2011 and the building still stands.

Sent from my HTC Desire X using Tapatalk 2
 
Good Morning BERNARD R
Many Thanks for informing us of the thread and for putting the record straight on the building thats a great relieve to hear
and i am sure it will be for many other members of the forum especialy those like myself are concerned with our heritage
best wishes to each and every other members Astonian;;
 
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