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Penn St Industrial School

laraine

laraine

master brummie
Hi can anyone give me any info on Penn St Industrial School & of a person who was there called Alfred Bick according to the 1901 census. Thanks. :)
 
Industrial schools were for children who were destitute or who it was thought might be in the company of people who were a bad influence,not having committed a crime but likely to do so if not taught the evil of their ways and kept busy.It was to try to help them keep out of Reform school.
Alfred Bick born 1886.
1891 census
8 Court 5 house Rea Street
George Bick age 39 Wire drawer born Gloucester
Harriet age 32 b. Staffs
Annie age 10 (1882)
Ada age 7 (1884)
Alfred age 5(1886)
Clara age 3(1888)
have found births for all children in Birmingham and death of Clara age 3 (1892.)
Cannot find on the 1881 census although found marriage March 1881 of George Bick and Harriet Baxter Day
in birmingham ref.6d 76
Believe they are on 1901 but George age 43?
 
:) :) :) Thats great that you have found this information for me, thank you so much. Ive never seemed to get anything before the 1901 census & we've always been unsure if it was the right Alfred Bick that we wanted but judging by what you have told me, alot of things tie up with Rea St being one of them & the occupation of his father being the other. I am Alfred's great grandaughter & this is the most information that the family have ever had. Thanks again.
 
A bit of a mystery here.The 1881 census was taken on the 8th April but the marriage i gave you took place in March.
George is on the 1881,single,age 19 born Gloucs a wire drawer,this would make him 29 in 1891.
I wonder if they would have had to keep their marriage secret or the marriage in 1881 was not your George.
they certainly had a daughter in 1882.Perhaps it would help to get alfreds birth certificate and get his mothers maiden name.
George in 1881.
Dwelling: 29 Mount St
Census Place: Aston, Warwick, England
Source: FHL Film 1341721 PRO Ref RG11 Piece 3017 Folio 153 Page 61
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
John HODNETT M 40 M Salop, Shropshire, England
Rel: Lodger (Head)
Occ: Excavator
Ann HODNETT M 46 F Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Artificial Flower Maker
James Arnold HODNETT U 51 M Whitbourne, Hereford, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Chemist & Druggist
Thomas MALLINGAN W 48 M Armagh, Ireland
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Bricklayers Laborer
William Geo. BARRATT U 46 M Dunstable, Northampton, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Farm Laborer
Alfred ROBINSON U 39 M Birmm, Warwick, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Bone Turner
John ERRICK U 18 M Birmm, Warwick, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Brass Caster
Charles EDGEHILL U 20 M Birmm, Warwick, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Brass Caster
George BICK U 19 M Gloster, Gloucester, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Wire Drawerer
William SMITH U 23 M Birmm, Warwick, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Nail Caster
John BICK U 22 M Birmm, Warwick, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Tube Caster
William RAY U 24 M Hockley, Stafford, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Tin Plate Worker
William FOSTER U 25 M Bolton, Lancashire, England
Rel: Lodger
Occ: Steel Toy Finisher

If you obtain the certificates I would be very interested in hearing how all this fits in.
Happy to have helped even though you support the wrong team ha ha.Alberta
 
:)It does all sound interesting doesn't it. The only document we have to go by is my nan's birth certificate which gives Alfred Bick as the father & his occupation as a wire drawer...the same as his father George. I think that would be the best bet now in getting a copy of his birth certificate. Thanks for all your help Alberta oh & i nearly forgot..Up the Villa !! ha ha. Laraine.
 
Does anyone know if Penn St Ind School's building is still there ? I think it was on Allcock Street in Digbeth. :)
 
Having been sent to an Approved School for persistant truancy in 1956, I was first of all sent to Moseley Rd Remand Centre, which is now a Childrens Home next to the Friends Meeting House, from there to Bristol for assesment at Kingswood, then sent to Tennal School, Balden Rd, Harbourne til I was 15, that was always refered to as an Industrial School on the old A to Z's. I will always remember that they had an old picture of the Gem St School hanging up in the main entrace hallway as it seemed that Tennal was associated or was the replacement for Gem St. The over 12 were sent to Shustoke and also Children were segregated by religion, Proddies to Tennal and Catholics to St Johns, Erdington.
 
my uncle thomas willetts attended gem street in early 1900 and i have his leavng certificate for good attendance
 
chinnychinn said:
my uncle thomas willetts attended gem street in early 1900 and i have his leavng certificate for good attendance
Click to expand...
dug certificate out and headmaster was Sydney J Mountford and the secretary of the education committee is given as mrs ashford palmer as near as i can tell, dated 1904
 
Found a notice in the birmingham post of 3.9.1862 listing the then donations received for the school

birm_post_3_9_1862_donations_to_Penn_st_industrial_school.jpg
 
Are the records for the school still around? My grandfather attended there for a while, but i would love to know why, when his family only lived over the road! Does anyone know how long they would have attended for? I know he went onto join the 4th Militia at Whittington Barracks in 1911 (served in South staffs for eight years)
 
Hi Bobbyb​

Read your thread with interest as I read the first one calling itan industrial school and you are quite correctly saying about yourtruancy; in those days they did that any kid whom wagged it fromschool way back in time for persistently wagging would have beentaken into the system from normal school and took to court andmore likely it would have been one of the Cadbury family members whomwould be on the sitting of the juvenile courts along with theold education department whom was well known for putting kids intothese establishments and also the school board man whom wasresponsible for calling at your house to asked why you was not atschool and i can tell you there was a lot of truancy going on inthose days but the department of education always singled out largefamily's just like nitty nora the nurse whom always came aroundthe schools checking for nits [ targetting large families ] and itwas all those families and the kids
always got there cardfor suspecting to have had nits and was embarrassed in the class bybeing called out in front of the class by the teacher when theyhanded them a brown envelope other kids would snigger at them.​

On the subject of Gem Street it later became a school foryoungster with a learning disability and handicapped kids but as youknow in those earl days it was an industrial school for the badones it was called reformatory schools but the name of these schoolslater became and called approved schools which was for junior agedkids; and for the youths was called borstals
on the subjectof Bristol it was a combined schools [ Kingswood was a classifyingschool for minors up to the age of sixteen years old ] where theyassessed the junior child for his religion and various psychologicaland mental abilities and mainly holding him until they can find him aplacement with in the system of such placed school until eitherthe age of 15 years old or some cases sixteen years old before goingout into the society more often than not the kids whom was sentto these places was kids whom was of a naughtiness by stealing ; butthere was also kids like you say about your self for truancy or theyhad no father for guidance and the mother could not control them andthey was playing truancy​

i know there was a lot of kids whom done that and ended up inthose places for such things
and of course there wasborstal; which basically was the older youths prison ;that was alsoan industrial school calling in those days as well if you was sent toone of those institutes from what ever age you was whether 14 upwardsyou would have been there until you was age 21 before getting outagain and it was brutal for them being there on the subject ofmoseley rd that was correct a remand home for the juvenals inBirmingham and across the country
and also Forhill house inKings Norton was a remand home for kids and of course as it as beendiscussed many times on here was Tennal an approved school for theexperienced crim's of the younger generation it had high walls and asearch light on the walls for any kid whom wanted to abscond andwhich some did.
that was brutal for some kids whom didsucceeded in doing so was taken out and moved to another place forsecurity to another home and some was taken to Moseley Rd remandcentre where it was secure no-one escaped from there occasional therewas brutal activity going on there and some times after it became ahome with a relaxed order around the area of Moseley Rd. The councilgot rid off it from a person then after they surveyed the place theyclosed it down; and its been closed down now for donkeys years butgetting back to the word of industrial schools that what they laterbecame and named as approved schools and borstals and then prisons.​


Best wishes Astonian​
 
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I did a search for Penn St. Ind. School on the web and came across a very interesting page. However no mention of lists of pupils except it does mention that Birmingham Archives hold the admission and discharge registers. Birmingham Archives and Heritage Service is located in the library in Broad Street. You would probably have to go in person but probably worth contacting them first.
 
They are. They are shown under 10 Allcock Street "Penn St Industrial School" on the 1891 Census.
 
KGmoore - I used to be able to find streets in the 1881 census but don't seem to have the option on Ancestry anymore. If you use the same programme can you tell me how to search on streets please?
 
suemalings said:
I did a search for Penn St. Ind. School on the web and came across a very interesting page. However no mention of lists of pupils except it does mention that Birmingham Archives hold the admission and discharge registers. Birmingham Archives and Heritage Service is located in the library in Broad Street. You would probably have to go in person but probably worth contacting them first.
Click to expand...
Many thanks, as an exile it's a 2 hour train journey each way but hopefully worthwhile.
 
suemalings said:
KGmoore - I used to be able to find streets in the 1881 census but don't seem to have the option on Ancestry anymore. If you use the same programme can you tell me how to search on streets please?
Click to expand...
I couldn't do that on Ancestry either so I used findmypast where it does allow you to search by street name.
 
For interest there was the Superintendant, his wife (the matron), two daughters, one son, a school master and 62 scholars.
 
cliff a word to the wise...gone are the days when we can just walk into the archives dept of the library tell them what we want to see and see the documents there and then...now we have to go to the archives fill in a form stating what is is we wish to view then we have to make an appointment usually a week later to go back up to the library by which time it is hoped that the staff have retrieved the said documents from the archives...you will also need to hold a valid CARN card to view archive material so if you do not have one take the relevant ID with you ie passport..driving licence..utility bills...

my advise to you would be to phone up the archives dept and ask them if they have the material you require ..would hate you to have a long round trip for nothing especially as its only a part time library now for the archives section..think its open 3 days a week 11 till 5 and only 1 saturday in every month which is not ideal for working folk only being able to visit on one saturday in each month....best to check the library of birmingham website to confirm what i have said just in case things have changed

lyn
 
Does anyone happen to have a photograph of this school? I have ancestors who stayed there and am currently creating genealogical videos so a picture would be great.
 
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