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Elizabeth Baker

Lady Penelope

master brummie
Thanks for that MWS. I've looked for the marriage you suggested but I think it's probably at the Register Office as I haven't found a church service yet.
 

Alberta

Super Moderator
Staff member
Hi Lady P, about the wealth of Joseph the butcher, from census entries it says own account so he didn't work for anyone else.Also he left over £500 which is about £32,000 today.
Joseph Baker married Elizabeth Morris in 1869 Aston
 

mikejee

Super Moderator
Staff member
Alberta
I think you are being a little conservative in your estimate of the value today. I know different tables give wildly different equivalences, and different items increase or decrease in value considerably, but £32,000 divided by 500 is an increase of 64 times. Now when I was young a pint of bitter in the south in a not cheap pub was about 1shilling and 10 pence (about 9 new pence) Multiply that by 64 and you get £5.76, not too far from what London pubs charge today. so I reckon over the period concerned the value of the £500 then would be a bit more than £32,000
 

Lady Penelope

master brummie
Either way it definitely puts a different perspective on Joseph's income. Thank you both very much for that information, it's a great help.
 

Lady Penelope

master brummie
Alberta, just checked on FmP and it lists their marriage under 'Civil Marriage & Divorce' which presumably means a Register Office wedding so no added information. However, I'm more confident that this is the right couple than I was before. I there any way of finding the details of a civil marriage do you know please?
 

Alberta

Super Moderator
Staff member
LadyP, I don't know of any other than to get the certificate
You can order it online from Birmingham register office website
The info you need when you get to the end of the form is is ( Aston, 1892 Sept quarter Volume 6d page 166)
My friend just ordered one they said it takes 15 days she got it in 3 days , I think about £12.

I wondered why Walter Woollerton dealt with the probate and not Josephs son Robert, perhaps he parted company with him somehow after his remarriage, he was a butcher like his father but changed jobs after his marriage and became a gardener.
Perhaps Walter was a friend or associate, he had a Bakery business in Coleshill street a very
profitable one I would imagine as at his death in 1937 he left £4750 ( about £320,000, in todays money)
 
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MWS

master brummie
The baptism of Joseph's and Ellen's eldest daughter appears to be on Ancestry - 1894 - it should list address on that. Unfortunately it's at St Stephen's, Newton Row so I suspect even if she wasn't born there (her sister's birthplace is listed as Summer Lane in 1911) it was probably after they moved to Summer Lane.
 

Lady Penelope

master brummie
Alberta, my theory is also that Joseph and Robert became estranged although Robert was still a butcher in 1894 so this possibly didn't happen immediately after Joseph's marriage. Robert was 94 when he died and lived in the parish of St Michael's at Driffold Cottages opposite to what is now the Odeon in Sutton (or whatever its called now).

I'm reluctant to buy a certificate at this stage as I have a few more avenues to explore (probably more like cul-de-sacs than avenues!)

MWS , Baptism of Nellie Victoria, I followed this up and they were living at 164 Summer Lane in 1894 and then 181 in 1901 and 170 in 1911 (where he seems to have stayed until his death). I wonder if the houses were bigger in the moves?

Thank you both for this added information. Very helpful.
 

Lady Penelope

master brummie
Thank you to everyone who contributed to this thread. I'm very grateful.
I'll let you know if I ever find out the significance of 114, Victoria Road on Elizabeth's grave.
 

cba

master brummie
Alberta, my theory is also that Joseph and Robert became estranged although Robert was still a butcher in 1894 so this possibly didn't happen immediately after Joseph's marriage. Robert was 94 when he died and lived in the parish of St Michael's at Driffold Cottages opposite to what is now the Odeon in Sutton (or whatever its called now).

I'm reluctant to buy a certificate at this stage as I have a few more avenues to explore (probably more like cul-de-sacs than avenues!)

MWS , Baptism of Nellie Victoria, I followed this up and they were living at 164 Summer Lane in 1894 and then 181 in 1901 and 170 in 1911 (where he seems to have stayed until his death). I wonder if the houses were bigger in the moves?

Thank you both for this added information. Very helpful.
I lived in 3 Driffold Cottages in 1963 for a few years. My parents rented it for a couple of years. I don't know who the landlord was. They must have a really interesting history. I think they were all sold together and converted in later years.
 

Lady Penelope

master brummie
cba, What a coincidence! I passed the cottages on Tuesday on the way to the library and thought they must all be owned by the same person. Thanks.
 

Attachments

cba

master brummie
cba, What a coincidence! I passed the cottages on Tuesday on the way to the library and thought they must all be owned by the same person. Thanks.
Thank you for the photograph. They were a bit more basic when we lived there. Entered through front door into a living room. Kitchen through from that, with a bath in it, covered by a board to use as a work surface. Through the back door to an outside toilet, one of 4 in a block. Small garden semi shared.
The stairs were through a door off the living room and led to two bedrooms. I suppose you could call it cosy. I know that's how Mum and Dad made it. I hated the outside loo because you could hear anyone using the one behind yours! I don't know the age of the cottages but the structure is very similar to some Elizabethen ones in Stratford upon Avon.
 
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