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Trying to identify country and uniform

W

windigo

proper brummie kid
I'm wondering if anyone might recognise this uniform? I think my great uncle was in India in the early 1900s. He was originally from Aston, born in 1883 - I can't find him in the 1911 census though.

Many thanks

Wendy

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windigo said:
I'm wondering if anyone might recognise this uniform? I think my great uncle was in India in the early 1900s. He was originally from Aston, born in 1883 - I can't find him in the 1911 census though.

Many thanks

Wendy



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That's certainly the British Army in India Wendy !
(I love these old photos ). Apart from the style of the car, I suspect the pictures were taken in the early 20s, certainly soon after WW1. The men are equipped with the Lee-Enfield SMLE rifle which would not have been on issue if it was earlier.
Some of the men are wearing wrist watches, something which was encouraged during the war, at a time when most men had a pocket watch.
The man posing on his own is wearing his puttees in an unconventional style.
I can't figure out why the men are wearing leather bandoliers, they were normally worn by soldiers involved with horses.
Frustratingly, the single figure has a unit title on the side of his Solar Topee but I can't make it out.
 
Thank you ever so much for your reply - I've learned a lot from it! I'll see if I can scan the photo a little larger which may help in identifying the unit title. I think my great uncle looks very much like John Cleese in that photo!

Thanks again,

Wendy :)
 
Haha, no offence taken at all!! I've hunted out the old photos and realised I'm an idiot! There is some very feint writing on the back of them! Photo 1 (aka John Cleese) it says: 18/2/17; Photo 2 says: 13/6/20 - Curzon Memorial in near backpoint and part of Victoria Memorial in rear"; Photo 3 says: Ishapore Guard Room Nov 1914; and Photo 4 says: 30/12/15 - From Dunmire to Nemiaghat - (6 miles) in a Sampani pulled by 5 or 6 coolies.

I've probably mispelled some of the words though. Unfortunately I can't get a clear scan of the unit title as the photo is really small and the scan ends up a blur :(
 
When scanning some old pictures I discovered that, by adjusting contrast and lighting on the digital version it was possible to see a lot of things that were otherwise invisible. I don't suppose this will add much to the pictures in this case but you might be able to sharpen up any unreadable text.
Sometimes it helps to scan small images at higher resolution.
 
windigo said:
There is some very feint writing on the back of them! Photo 1 (aka John Cleese) it says: 18/2/17; Photo 2 says: 13/6/20 - Curzon Memorial in near backpoint and part of Victoria Memorial in rear"; Photo 3 says: Ishapore Guard Room Nov 1914; and Photo 4 says: 30/12/15 - From Dunmire to Nemiaghat - (6 miles) in a Sampani pulled by 5 or 6 coolies.

(
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It's nice that you found the info Wendy. I must say I'm surprised that troops in India had the SMLE rifle so early in the war.
 
Hi,this is a question for Maypolebaz. Do you know much about army helmets,could you tell the difference between WW1 and WW11 helmets. I have a photograph of my grandparents at home in the early-mid 1950s and behind them on the piano is a photograph of a man in uniform, the trouble is its a bit blurred. I am sure the man is wearing a tin helmet and it could be either my great uncle Tom who was killed in Belgium WW1 or Frank the son of my grandfathers adopted brother who was killed in France WW11. I will give the photo to my sister and hopefully she can scan it on to the website,thanks Angela
 
There's not likely to be much visible difference in the helmet, Angela. I'll "have a dig" and see what I can find.
 
maypolebaz said:
There's not likely to be much visible difference in the helmet, Angela. I'll "have a dig" and see what I can find.
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Hi,thanks Baz,I will get the photograph to my sister a.s.a.p. and ask her to message you as I am on holliday for 2 weeks from next Wednesday. Are you from the Maypole?,i grew up in Westfield Rd off Station Rd Kings Heath,happy memories of tiddler fishing in the canal that crossed the Alcester Road just down from the dog track. Thanks again Angela.
 
The most obvious difference between WW1 and WW2 helmets that I can find, Angela is with the chinstrap.
The early helmets had a webbing strap which looks flat whereas the WW2 version looks a little like a concertina, on each side of the soldier's face.
(I grew up in Sladepool Farm Rd, which runs from the Alcester Rd to Highters Heath Rd. I went to Wheelers Lane school though).
 
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Hi Maypolebaz, my sister Angela Burley has asked me to put this picture on the forum. We are trying to work out whether this photo is of a World War 1 soldier, or is it a World War 2 soldier? We lost a relation in both wars and so we are trying to work out which relation this would be. Hoping that we can find this out by his uniform. Many thanks, Linda Bailey
 
Hi paul,I can understand why you think that as it looks like he has a moustache but both of my ancestors were English. Were moustaches more common in ww1 or 2? To be honest I think he looks a bit like Hitler(re the moustache). What about the next photo along ,i would be gratefull for any thoughts or ideas .Angela.
 
Hi Paul,may I ask why you think that,i will be gratefull for any information as I am trying to find out if he is wearing ww1 or ww2 uniform,so I can hopefully identify which one of my relatives he is,thanks Angela.
 
LINDA B said:
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Hi Maypolebaz, my sister Angela Burley has asked me to put this picture on the forum. We are trying to work out whether this photo is of a World War 1 soldier, or is it a World War 2 soldier? We lost a relation in both wars and so we are trying to work out which relation this would be. Hoping that we can find this out by his uniform. Many thanks, Linda Bailey
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Sorry Linda, I'd love to help but I can only see one photo and that is very blurred.
 
The helmet shape Angie, but the photo is so blurred that you really cannot make out much, maybe one of the technical boffins can help you out, sorry. !! Paul
 
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This is the original photograph (before the close up). The photo on the sideboard in the background is who we are interested in if anyone can help at all. Many thanks to all who have already contributed answers.
 
I agree with Paul, that looks like an Italian helmet.
Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever seen a British portrait photo with the sitter wearing a Battle Bowler !
 
Hi Chocs2,thanks very much but I couldn't get the link to work, i will google it. I have have had another idea,i will contact Toms regiment 1st/6th Bn Glosters.Angela.
 
Hi again Chocks. Well,well ,i googled it and came up with the same thing, now the mystery takes another turn,or maybe it answers our question. I may be going off subject but I would like to tell you all a very sad and sometimes happy story that all you lovers of family history will understand and find interesting,i hope. Presuming the Wiki Mark 111 helmet info is correct the photo is more likely to be Frank,my Grandads Nephew,the son of my granddads elder stepbrother. Frank was killed on 30th July 1944 age 36 in France, he is buried in Bayeux Millitary Cemetary . The helmets were first worn in combat by British and Canadian troops on Dday,which was 7 weeks before Frank died. The story our father told us was that Frank was killed in a motorbike accident in Bordsley Green,and thats all he knew. About 3 years ago I decided to try and find out more. I found a marriage in 1930 to Ada Hollick in Washwood heath and found them both in 1935 still in Washwood Heath with more research I managed to find relatives of Ada in Birmingham and my sister and I went to visit them. To our great surprise and pleasure they gave us Franks gold signet ring ,engraved with his initials,which with more research we believe to be his wedding ring, assayed in Birmingham in 1930 the year of his marriage to Ada,then they told us what they knew. Ada was told that Frank was shot in the head by a sniper 2 hours before the Armistice was signed,you can imagine how upset we were to hear this, but then I pointed out that the war ended in 1945 so we agreed this may not be true. They told us Ada was buried in Yardley cemetery and that she had managed to visit Franks grave in France and that Frank and Ada had no children and just lived for their motorbike and the regular outings in the countryside,it makes me cry whenever I think of them and how she must have felt when she got news of his death. I decided to send for Franks death certificate but all it confirmed was that Frank had indeed died in a motorcycle accident but in France,there was no mention of the circumstances. We kept in touch with Adas family and we have since been given his war medals. I think more research is needed to find what regiment he was in ,all I know is that he was in the R.E.M.E. so at least he died doing what he loved. Angela.
 
Again I have to agree with Baz here I don't think I have ever seen a family portrait photo of a uniformed member in a "Tin AT", I may be wrong here, I have seen group photo's of "Dads Army", and wardens and police, but never a portrait. Also the Mk 111, wasn't issued in any great number, and it was very deep in the neck area, which your photo, (of what can be gleened, as it is very fuzzy), does not seem to show that. Paul.
 
I expect you know that on CWGC site for Frank Rollinson it just says REME, number 10588579 and that he was a driver. It lists his parents and wife Ada and says he is buried at Bayeaux War Cemetery.

Janice
 
Hi Paul,yes I have thought the same ,the portraits are usually taken with flat dress hat. My relative Frank was killed in France 7 weeks after the D DAY landings and according to Wikipedia those helmets were issued to the British and Canadians at that time. I dont know if Frank took part in D Day,i think I need to do some more research,Angela.
 
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