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Soho Road Handsworth

Shortie, I think you are wrong,The Little Red Shop was opposite the Red Lion,there was another hardware shop next to Darlingtons or was it Darringtons ? on the corner of Boulton Road, not quite sure but Dorringtons maybe further down the "Main Road" past Baker Street.
 
I don't think I am Alan, but perhaps MikeJee can help out here. I am sure the shop was Darlingtons - remember our shop was at the top of Linwood Road and we could see Soho Road shops, albeit just about. We used to sell a lot of the same things as the Little Red Shop, so it was a place I was very aware of. I think it was on the corner of Boulton Road, opposite the bus stop and the Red Lion was just a little way up, although I suppose you could consider it as being opposite, although it was not quite. On the side of Linwood Road, before the Red Lion was a shoe shop, a greengrocers, a butchers (Stoddards), a shop selling lingerie and I think another one, and then there was the Red Lion. I am sure Mike will let us know from Kelly's. I have a map, but I think it is too early, I think the shops will still be houses, but will check later.
 
OOps, it was not a greengrocers, it was a shop selling china, etc next to the butcher's shop. The greengrocers was next to Wilkinsons on the other side of Linwood. My husband confirmed that the paper shop was Darlingtons, they had another branch near or at the end of Somerset Road.
 
Mmmm,casting my mind back Shortie I can picture those shops,you are right there was a greengrocers next to Wilkinsons,they also sold fresh fish ( That maybe before it was a greengrocers) I can see in my minds eye a stuffed fish in a case (Pike I think) but you were right there also was a greengrocers opposite Boulton Road called Jacques with a entrance to the public bomb shelter under the shops,another entrance to the shelter was at the top of Linwood Road next to the shoe shop (Cannot remember the shop name though) my wife may well remember she lived in Woodstock Road.
Sorry but I still think I am right regarding "The Little Red Shop) I can once again see it in my minds eye,only a small shop painted Red,the shop on the corner of Boulton Road was a bigger shop but indeed it was an Ironmongers.
Where is my time machine can never find it when I want it.
 
Darlingtons newsagents was 305 Soho road. 307-9 was william Henry Cole, ironmongers and then was Boulton road. the other side of the junction was Edward Jukes, grocers. This is for 1956
 
Thanks Mike - that confirms what I thought. We could see, I am sure, both Darlingtons and the Little Red Shop from our shop at 10 Linwood Road, which was on a corner facing Soho Road. I have sorted out my map which is a 1913 one and the building on the corner of Boulton Road was a pub at that time. I don't remember that, but the Little Red Shop was certainly adjoining Darlingtons. I remember it as looking like it started life as a small cottage. I was sent, from time to time, to see the prices that the Little Red Shop charged, for paraffin and other hardware goods which my mother also sold. A common occurrence in those days.

Alan, I don't remember fish being sold at the greengrocers next to Wilkinsons, but I remember the shop being on fire. We awoke in the middle of the night to what sounded like shooting - it was tins of peas bursting with the heat! The name Jaques rings quite a bell, so it must have been the one by the bus stop. I don't remember knowing about an air raid shelter though. The shoe shop in 1960 was Shoefayre, I was friends with someone who worked there. The manageress was a Mrs Trigg who lived in the Broadway at Perry Barr.
 
Shortie
The 1913 Kellys shows no pub on the corner of boulton Road. There was the Cross Guns on the corner of Barn road, a few buildings away though
 
Well the map shows it Mike, perhaps it did not last long, I have to say I cannot remember seeing a pub. I am, however, talking 1960 when I went to live there, so plenty of time for a pub to close. There is the possibility that if Kelly's entries had to be paid for, that they did not wish to be included.
 
To be honest shortie , I am wondering if the OS made a mistake, The Old maps site gives a map marked 1917, which also shows it, but this is the same map as the AlanGodfrey 1913 map. It is just that alan godfrey has estimated when it was surveyed and Old maps gives the publication date. The Cross Guns is not shown on this map, although it is listed in kellys, whereas it does show the mysterious pub, but the 1935 map does show the cross guns, but not this pub. I can find no pub listed there in the Kellys around this date, though the cross guns is listed by name from before 1900 amd as a beer retailer from at least 1890
 
Mike,can you look in Kellys in 1956 for the shops after Boulton Road about 4 or 5 shops past Boulton Road towards Babbington Road, sure there was a ironmongers there.Thanks
 
Mike, I am sure it is perfectly possible that a mistake could be made by anyone, none of us is p[erfect. Perhaps also it was designated a pub but maybe one did not open? If that makes sense?

Alan, before Mike does what you ask, let me tell you what I remember - although it's not much. There was a curtain shop on the corner, it used to have all pretty nets in the window on the side of Boulton Road. I can't remember what was next or even after that but I seem to remember a TV rental shop? I think a small branch of Barclays and Firkins. I know I have missed many out, but those are the ones I remember. I don't remember an ironmongers at all, but that's not to say there was not one. I look forward to hearing what Mike has found out.
 
Here are all the shops between Boulton & Babington. I guess John Heath ( no 319 ) is the one you mean:
here is Boulton rd ​

......311 Jukes Edwd. Harry Ltd.grocers
313 Keight's, confctnrs
313 TonksMrs. Florence
315 Thompson Frank
315 Wild John E. Ltd. tobacconists
317 Martins (Dyers &Cleaners) Ltd
319 Heath Jn. hardware dlr
321 Arrowsmith Horace,fruitr
321A, Simmons & Bates,bldrs
323 Hatton Lionel Eric,butcher
325 Stephens Kenneth, friedfish dlr
327 & 329 Sweeney R. F.Radio Ltd. radio dlrs
331 Criterion Laundries Ltd
335 Firkin M. Ltd. cookedmeat shop​

... here is Babington rd
​


 
I have made3 a telephone call this evening to Miss Pat Mills, who is connected with Handsworth Historical Society (she may be secretary, I am not exactly sure). I have known Pat for some years, and if she does not know, she will know someone who does. I asked her if she remembered Darlingtons, and then said ' and next door....' - I did not have time to finish, she said 'That was The Little Red Shop, everyone knew that'.

It was painted cardinal red on the brickwork and was extremely tiny - I would say about 10ft square and very dark. I was sure it was that shop as well as Darlingtons we could see from our shop door in Linwood Road. Pat thinks that the society may have a photograph, so she will get back to me as soon as she knows exactly.
 
Another one for Mike here. Does any information exist on The Pilot Cycle Co, which was at 117 Soho Road in 1907. I am now thinking this is the shop that an old lady of 95 said was her grandfather's shop - he died in 1911 so difficult to be sure. She said the shop was down towards the railway station. If there is any information available I would be pleased to know about it. thanks

Shortie
 
Shortie

As requested. Map shows no 117 in red.

Note 83 & 87 Soho rd are definitely different & not misprint

1899 No Pilot cycle Co. no 354 Farm st not listed
1900-1903 Pilot (The) Cycle Co, cycle makers, 354 Farm St
1904-1905 No Pilot Cycle Co .At back 354 Farm st there was a John Ridgeway, cycle maker (with other firms), and 117 Soho rd was “The Main Wheeleries”, cycle dealers (also there in 1903),. John Ridgeway was also there in 1903
1908 Pilot Cycle Co. cycle manuf., 117 Soho rd.Handswth & 354 Farm St
1910-1912 Pilot Cycle Co. cycle manuf., 83 Soho rd.Handswth & (works) 354 Farm St
1913-15 Pilot Cycle Co. cycle manufacturers, 87 Soho rd.Handswth & (works) 354 Farm St
1921 No Pilot cycle Co. 354 Farm st is Guest Manufacturing Co.,sheet metal workers & 87 Soho road is a hairdressers



map_c_1913___no_117_soho_road.jpg
 
Thanks Mike. The place is right where I was told it would be - near to the station. I am thinking that the person I am speaking about, who was self-employed at one time, but not always, may have worked for this John Ridgeway, but later perhaps supplied him with parts. It's not very clear at all really, but the lady I got the information from was told it by her gran, who was married to the cycle maker concerned. The grandfather died in 1911, and so things may have got twisted over the years. The death certificate shows him as working for someone else (journeyman) whereas the 1911 census shows him as self -employed. I think that this shop is probably the one her gran was speaking about, but perhaps she embellished the truth. Thanks very much Mike, it is much appreciated.

Shortie
 
Just a reply on the shops.... circa 1964 onwards

BABINGTON RD -----
Barclays Bank (big cream blding on corner)
Firkins (bread/cakes)
Sweenies (tv/radio - double front) ~ In front of this was the bus stop (No 11 and 74;s) ~
Fish and chip shop.
Fish shop
A DRIVEWAY ------
Pendries (Fruit and Veg)
Not sure next ?
Little Red shop (Our neighbour and his son used to own it).
Not sure about next 1-2 shops
Shop on the corner (yes agreed - a curtain shop called ... Alan's)
BOULTON Rd ---------
Darlingtons (newsagents) on corner of Boulton
(I think they might have knocked a shop down somewhere here to make Boulton Rd larger (maybe?).
A DRIVE THRU ----------
Pub ~ (cross guns) and outdoor in alley way. ( I used to like taking the corona bottles back there for 3d each )

I'd guess that Darlingtons and the cross guns were more-or-less opposite Linwood Rd.
 
Sorry Stephen, Handsworth Historical Society have confirmed that The Little Red Shop was next to Darlingtons and both were opposite Linwood Road, more or less. Darlingtons was not on the corner of Boulton it was on the corner of what you call an Entry which I was suprised to find was Barn Lane. They are going to see if they have a photograph of it, it is thought they may have. My mother's shop was at 10 Linwood Road, which was on the corner of Dawson and Linwood Roads and we could see Darlington's and The Little Red Shop from the shop door. In 1907, Darlington's and the shop next door (an ironmongers in those days too) were both owned by Darlingtons. I have a copy of the 1907 Kelly's directory on the back of the 1913 Handsworth map.
 
Thanks Stephen 0002002,at least you agree with me regarding "the Little Red Shop",Shortie and friend thought it was next to Darlingtons there was a hardware shop on the corner of Boulton Road which was knocked down to make Boulton Road wider not sure when it was knocked down I would have thought later than 1964,I left Handsworth in 64 the property I lived in was compulsory(Dawson Road and Baker Street)purchased by the Council and cleared.
When I lived in Handsworth the No 11 bus stop was in Boulton Road just before it went into the Main Road.
Mike posted the shops from Boulton Road to Babington Road on this thread Stephen
 
Alan - Mike posted the shops from a different date, not the date we are speaking about although it was not a very long way off.

The lady I spoke to from Handsworth Historical Society was born in Handsworth and still lives there now - she is in her late 70's and knows a great deal. She is now trying to see if their archives has a photograph and in the meantime I shall see if I can get hold of a Goad plan which should show not only the owner of the shop, but the trading name. I used these extensively when I was at work, so know exactly what they show, but whether I can get hold of one that old is another matter, purcahsing one is not an option as they were about £40 - 20 or so years ago.
 
Hvae addded to the map , and it now also shows nom 83 in green and 87 in blue, as well as 117 in red

map_c_1913___no_832C_87___117_soho_road.jpg
 
Thanks for confirming the shop that was knocked down next to Darlington's. Yep - Barn Lane thats it. Yes, I am still sticking to my guns atm that the little red shop ( Shortie ) :-) was not next to Darlingtons as far as I remember. Lets see. Our neighbour was called Mr Heath (I think) and he owned the shop for many years. I'll check again this week when I go visit my Moms old house.

Yes the 11 stop was originally round the corner in Boulton, Alan I remember that now you mentioned it.

The Co-op was at the bottom of Babington and the building is still there today I'm pleased to say.

The other newsagents close by was Withers on the corner of Queens Head Road... great memories guys.. keep them coming.
 
The No 11 one way was in Boulton, the other way it was outside the shops next to the Red Lion.

Well Stephen, my mother used to sell some of the items that the Little Red Shop used to sell, and whilst I was still away at boarding school (so not known locally) I was periodically sent into the shop to find out how much certain things were - that is the only reason it stuck in my mind. It is just possible that the two shops were eventually owned by the same person - but I personally have no recollection of a hardware shop on the other side of Boulton Road, just the one. I am hoping that Pat Mills will be able to locate a photograph, as she also confirmed that the Red shop was next to Darlingtons. A Goad plan would be excelent, but it depends on whether my former boss would be willing to copy it for me, if indeed they retain old ones.
 
Thank you Mike. I shall print this off to send to my old lady friend. I think that this must be what she meant, but how do I tell her that her gran was either exaggerating or just plain lying when she said he owned a shop by the station on Soho Road? You have to laugh at some of the things that these people were told, the Victorians might have been Empire builders and fantastic engineers, but my goodness they told lies by the dozen! Thanks once again Mike, you are a star!
 
Shortie, My wife says the Litlle Red Shop was passed Boulton Road opposite The Red Lion,I cannot argue with her because she is always right.
 
Alan, can I just suggest you yourself phone Handsworth Historical Society (they do have a web site, it's not my imagination) where they will confirm the exact site of the building. I have done so and reported on here, but you obviously think I am telling fibs.
 
Nobody is calling you a fibber, Shortie, I think you will find that what Alan was saying was tongue in cheek, chill out.
 
Folks I am really enjoing this thread, many thanks its a great trip down memory lane.
My wifes always right too Alan - even when she's wrong - she must be obeyed (hehe - only joking).

Its great to hear your comments Shortie and you may indeed be proved right in the end about the red shop.
We're going back quite a few years and we were all young then.

Please humour me for a minute ... using google maps (today) I would guess that the little red shop might have been at 313 or 315 (If it was this side). 100% agree tho ... it was a small, darkly lit shop, I'd love to see a pic or something and offer my apologies if indeed I am wrong about position. It wouldnt be the first time !

Come to think of it ... in my memory I seem to recollect there (might) have been a road accidient on that corner of Boulton that wrecked part of Darlingtons (and perhaps ironmongers ?? - I'm guessing that bit ) and it (Darlingtons) was re-built. Looking at the building today it is relatively new ~ anyway one of the owners was a MR Joe Harbourne as I remember. (circa 1970 ?).

I do seem to remember another ironmongers close to Darlingtons (in the vagueness of my grey matter), but that would probably have been early days for me. The cross guns pub just across the alley (Barn Lane) has been there ages too, as I recall.
 
Shorty, massive long shot here ... but my brother had a friend that lived towards the top end of Linwood circa 1962-ish. I seem to remember they had a big aquarium in the sitting room and a dart board covered in darts - just a thought - ring any bells with you ?
 
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