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Perry William aka The Tipton Slasher

  • Thread starter Thread starter Christopher Witcomb
  • Start date Start date
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hello - sorry to be pedantic but the Stuffed Monkey was actually a Barbary Ape and most probably brought over by a sailor. It ended up at a pub called - I think! - The Three Horseshoes at Ocker Hill now in Sandwell & kept in a glass case but taken out for the benefit of the regulars!. Eventually- it was taken out and ceremoniously burned as it was riffy and moth-ridden.!!
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

How interesting Carl you have obviously studied the subject well. I had not thought about the alcohol being the staple drink that has cleared something up for me.:)

I wonder how you go about applying for a blue plaque.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

to janeld and carl perry dangerfield

Thank you janeld for your reply, i have now done that. Much appreciated.

Hi Carl, I was wondering if i give u the names that i have that would tie William in with our family if you could please help me. He married into our family and the Link would be Broughton or Adams. The most significant names would be Richard Adams who used to haul Coal on the canals and Florence Broughton who had 3 sisters named Alice, Ada and amy. We know great great aunt Alice married James Adams who was son of Richard Adams from his frst marriage. Great Great gran had 11 children from her first marriage and Richard Adams also had 11 children fromh his first marriage, Grt grt gran raised all 22 of them. Sons of richard from his first marriage were James and Charles. Names that also should appear somewhere are Ray Adams and Charlie (chaz).

Grt Grt Grans children were May Adams, never married. Doris Adams married James Skidmore, Arthur John Edward Adams (who used to spa with William as he was a bare knuckle boxer in his youth too married Florence Russell.Thomas Adams married Fanny. Walter Adams married Betty, Harry Adams married Nell. There is also a Ray adams.

If YOu could tie any of that in with the connection between William and our family i would be very grateful.


Thank you for everyones help, kind regards Melinda
Richard Adams used to haul coal ont he canals until he lost all his horses to red eye.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Melinda its not a good idea to put your email address on its open to every one ask for it to be taken off

Linda
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hi Its me who started this post to try and find out more about my grand fathers relative Bill Perry AKA Tipton Slasher

Gran [Maiden name Lillian Perry] told me about Bill when I was younger. She enjoyed talking about him perhaps because her mother [Eliza Perry ne Long] ,who was very pious and straightlaced, refused to discuss her late husbands relatives especially Bill who she regarded as a drunken fighting man.[I think my late Gran was a bit of a rebel]

However it seems that when my grandfather [William Perry] was alive they went to Perry familly gatherings at a pub [now believed to be the Three Horse Shoes at Ocker Hill , owned by another William Perry , a nephew of Bills]. On such occasions Gran and other children would ask to see " Bills stuffed Monkey"
There was a picture of the ape / monkey in Carl Chinns article in Express and Star [5th Feb 2004] pressumeable taken at the 3 Horse Shoes.

I also read that the stuffed ape was destroyed in a fire - but I also heard that it was not lost but preserved as an archive by Black country Museum [can anyone confirm this?]

As for his death I agree with others in that I do not believe Bill Perry was a pauper or in a workhouse
On his death certificate he was at Gibet Gate Bilston which I believe was listed as 22 Ward St [the Familly home in 1871 census] and he had been listed as "contractor" [employing one man plus his own son, William E Perry] on census and a "general dealer" on his death certificate . Son William E was present at time of death

As for his cause of death, alcoholism and pulmonary congestion were entered on certificate but my Grans info was more specific.
She told me he was found very drunk and very cold in a gutter near the house !
Not unlikely since it was near Christmas and considerable merryment would be expected and its a cold time of year to sleep out!
A modern day cause of death might read " Heart Attack brought on be Hypothermia and alcohol.....
Eitherway Its a rather sad end for a man who had started at the bottom , raised to the top as a local hero, then lost it all, then recovered to have his own familly business.

I have still not been able to find how my Grans father William Perry [1866-1896] and moreover his father James Perry [b 1841, Birmingham] were related to Bill Perry but everything she told me about him is gradually being confirmed.
I believe she even contributed to his memorial fund [1926] but I bet she didnt tell her mother!
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hello - Interesting that how thread keeps going!
Refer to the Tempus publication (which I have) that relates of when David Christie Murray (local novelist) visiting Willam Perry on the 'eve' of his death (knowing the Old Chap had not long to go!) who gives the address as 'Ward Street'. If you see the Toll House, you will note that it is actually covers the corner of Wellington Road and Stow heath Lane : the domestic residence at the back (on Stow Heath) the Toll House entrance being on the main drag!!! Ward St continues over the Cross Roads from Stow Heath Lane - which is where the confusion arises as the assumption would have been it was the same named road. Confusion has also arisen between 'Work' House and 'Toll' House due to the similarity of the name (any way, remember before the NHS, that was the only place to go for terminal medical attention - with no shame attached! )
Murray describes how very poorly and changed William looked on that Christmas Eve 1880- and that William passed later that day. Death certificate states that he died 'Gibbet's Gate' (i.e Toll Gate by where the old Gibbet had once stood)) Bilston at junction of the Wolverhampton Road & Stowe Heath Lane ( now Wellington Road & Ward St respectively).The information is supported in the Tom Langley book as well as personal family history. Certificate gives William Jnr as a Stone dealer & the 1881 census has William Jnr (Stone Dealer) & family living in the 'Gibet' Toll House ( as spelled on Census:the spelling ability of the Clerks was notoriously lax & handwriting illegible). Property/ Roads often were refered to colloquially not by official names.
Hope this clarifies a few bits and pieces !
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

:)hi carl, william aka the tipton slasher was just like every other man of his time i think and if he liked a drink goodluck to him it seems they never had much else in life really. I to am a perry but from summerlane area of birmingham and my perrys liked a drink and also my grt granny elizabeth hobson but they had a hard life and were very proud of being English and they were graffters of the hightest, special people you should be so proud of bill drink or no drink im proud of my lot they worked till they dropped.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hi Chris, there was to many william perrys in BIRMINGHAM i to have grt grt grandfather with that name and his father was james perry living in new summer st birmingham in 1841 and i think we have been in touch before and we are not related . I have never found anymore about my william after the 1951 census i did find his son henry 30yrs later so i think its a name where there is a lot missing between the years hope you find lilians father . The Tipton Slasher sounds fine to me he kept a lot of people happy with his boxing it was a hard life for them all .
 
The Tipton Slasher ( boxer ) and the Bilston Toll House

Hello to you all,

I have looked back at my research and have come across a newspaper clipping reporting the death of William Perry 'The Tipton Slasher' dated the 1st January 1881 8 days after his death.

I quote " The Tipton Slasher died some what suddenly at his residence the Old Toll House about half-way between Wolverhampton and Bilston on Christmas Eve"

This I think this lays to rest any misconception that William died in the workhouse. Also as stated in a previous post by me that the toll house still stands, the front (half hexagon) removed in the 1930's, and is now a barbers shop.
Maybe a plaque, restoration and preservation order should be made.
Bilstontollhouse.jpg

brymon007
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Carl thanks for posting the photograph of the toll house. What a shame it was vandelised in the name of progress and had its frontage replaced by that awful brickwork. I agree with you a blue plaque would be in order. There is still so much interest in the slasher.

As regards the Monkey/Ape.I had it on good authority from a respected local historian , the Black country museum has it. I supose a phone call would put an end to that rumour/ mystery.

My husband found whilst doin research in newspaper archives, An interview with the slasher.
(Robert is not willing to divulge the exact details yet as it is in something he is waiting to have published, I can say it was about 1870.)
Anyway the Slasher is talking about himself and his wife being in Gateshead Workhouse for a while due to Ill health and unemployment.
Maybe this is where the rumour about him dying in a workhouse has stemed from??
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Thank you for your kind words janeld.
As William did exhibition tours around the country and in Dublin he may very well have passsed or visted Gateshead .
However, there was another Prizefighter who called himself the 'Tipton Slasher' no doubt cashing in on the name to earn himself a few bob - and being a Northener thought himself unlikely to encounter the real one! The combination of the name 'William' and 'Perry' was very widespread and common!

Also the 1871 census unequivocally shows him being in Bilston listed as a Stone Dealer and employing one other with his son William Edward.

Additionally, under the Poor Law which established the Workhouse Institutions, if he had reached the point of needing Parish Relief, he would more than likely have been returned back to his own Parish - and if he had living relatives, especially those 'in funds', they would have been expected to keep him. This was hard nosed Victorian economy!!

I think some people like to see him as a washed up fighter who had one fight to many and who died alone a broken man in the Workhouse.It is the perennial myth that has always shrouded the sport of Boxing etc -and the feared fate of many folk which lingered into the early 20th Century

In 1881 two of the three brothers were still alive - one being my Great Great Grand Father Thomas.
The second ,Timothy , ran a pub in Sedgely Road East.
John Perry the youngest had died in 1873 but had lived close by in Kate's Hill
but was obviously around in the debated Workhouse registration date of 1871

Having family in Kate's Hill is the reason William was buried there and not in Tipton or Bilston. They tended him in last days.

The 1881 census shows his son William Edward Perry living in the Toll house with his occupation given as a stone dealer - having taken over the business from his father.

I , too, have many, many stories and Family details stories which will be put into print one day. One in particular will dispel this niggling myth that The Slasher died as a pauper!
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hello All

First thanks Carl for the photo I had no idea that his house still exists [work I am doing on Witcomb family of Birmingham mostly relates to long gone streets].
I think Bill would have appreciated that it was a betting shop in your photo. As we know he backed himself [as was the belief at that time that it was bad luck not to do] to win his last fight. Whatever must his wife thought when he lost his fortune!
However this does not tie up with being later in a workhouse in Gateshead since he had restarted a business by 1871 and why if he had no money would he go to Gateshead and also he had all familly and friends locally.
Indeed some of his relations had reasonable wealth[ish] - the below for info:

Title
Will of John Perry etc.
Date
1870-1876
Description
Probate (4 Feb. 1874) of the will (dated 17 Jan. 1870) of John Perry of Price Street, Kates Hill, parish of Dudley, shoemaker; all estate to wife Elizabeth Perry, and children, Susannah Perry, John Sambridge Perry and Elizabeth Perry; wife to receive income until remarriage; children receive capital at the age of 20, with benefit of survivorship; executrix, wife.


And also

Title
Will of Zera Perry
Date
3 January 1893
Description
Will of Zera Perry of Church Lane, Tipton, Staffordshire, publican and charter master.
Description
All estate upon trust for sale; proceeds to be divided equally between such children as survive him and attain the age of 21, with grandchildren taking the share of a deceased parent; income and up to one third of capital of trust estate may be applied to maintenance, education and advancement of infant children or grandchildren
Description
Executors and trustees: William John Hayward of Burnt Tree, Tipton, coalmaster, and William Perry of Dudley Port, Tipton, publican.

I have not seen these wills but assume them to be of two of Bills brothers.
Clearly they all liked owning pubs and or had skilled jobs. I also am investigating that one of Bills close relations may even have visited USA [as mining engineer] but this is ongoing work!
The William Perry mentioned on second will [as executor] I assume is the Nephew from Ocker Hill?? (or another William relative e.g son of Bill brother Timothy)

Whilst I was looking back on research I've done I remembered I had an email chat with a reporter from a local newspaper who gave me the following :

"In the 1970s we did a story on a clock that had once belonged to the Tipton Slasher (a prize), that then was in the possession of a Mr and Mrs Warrilow at Coven, near W-ton (probably now deceased). They had been given it by an old lady who claimed to be related the fighter. She was born around 1880, around the time that he died. Her name was Mrs Liza Middleton. She had lived on canal boats, and then at Heath Town in her latter years".

I have no Perry: Middleton connection but maybe somebody else does?

Thanks Janeld - I will phone the Black Counry Museum about the ape!

Thanks Rosie - yes there were loads of Perrys in Birmingham and its difficult to sort through
I am working on a new angle though - a contact in USA has suggested that Bills grandfather had two sons one in Tipton [Timothy] and another in Birmingham?

Funny how you get the genealogy bug again - I had not done much more recently until now.

Next time I get to the Midlands I'm going to sink a beer outside Bills house and drink to his health and yes I think a blue sign would be good.

Best Regards
Chris
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

HI Chris
Interesting details which links with existing research.

I think the Workhouse myth can be laid to rest if you note my amended thread to Janeld's

In the 'Warrilow' article it states that the clock and a watch chain became part of Liza Middleton's 'inheritance' - not that she was related only that she was aware of the Slasher. But, it also says she was not born until the year of his death (1880) therefore she cannot have had the 'first hand' stories as quoted in it.
Inheritance denotes a family link! Unless these were passed as gifts outside the Family - but with so many other surviving relatives, why would these precious possessions leave the Family? It says the clock had pride of place on the Family Narrowboat - which would have been a working vessel - after the Freeman fight of 1842 . He had traded with Freeman for it.
This Middleton link - or not! - is a good line to investigate!

As a matter of interest I have an accredited report of William in the Spring of 1836 working as a Bricklayer in Aston, Birmingham between fights - no doubt as a good as a Gym workout in the 19th Century!
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

he had a one hundred fights in is reign and he ran the fountain pub
in tipton as well born in 1818 and he was the first boxer in the boxing world to hold a world boxing title and yes he did his training there as well as running the pub
i gained this info; this morning from a perry whom lives in hales owen and i shall be seeing him again on monday morning
have a nice day guys best wishes astonion ;;
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

As a further follow up - here's a photo montage of the Toll House how it would have looked in situ!!

tollhousebilstoncirca20041904emboss.jpg
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

The info i gave about the slashers interview in a local paper clearly has himself stating that he spent time in the gateshead workhouse due to being ill.I know he was in business in 1871 but the workhouse stay was before this time.
There may have been men pretending to be the slassher but this interview was given towards the end of his life to a local paper .
He travelled to Gateshead due to work he was doing at the time. you'll have to wait for the details in my husbands next canal book due out next year.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hi Janeld - please remember that William is an Ancestor of mine through an accredited and verified line therefore I do have some knowledge and feel somewhat protective of both his name and reputation !!
Whilst I respect your husbands wish to keep it to himself, as one with direct links to the Publishing Industry and Historical Fields , I would really love to look at your husbands back catalogue of work and see if I have any of his books - canals are a real passion with me and mine! Perhaps he could email me for a chat!!

So the Workhouse debate still will not go away!!
I have looked intensively into the Gateshead (and of adjacent) Workhouse records and can find neither him nor his wife - though there is another William Perry but all the dates are wrong and the lady's name is a variation upon Ann's !! Not even as a temporary resident nor the 'sick ' list.
However, you suggest it was when he was ill on his travels- :obviously there was no NHS at that time . The Workhouse was the only real equivalent to a hospital in that era -especialy outside the big towns!! Where else could some one go, if that was the case? No shame - no blame - neccessity dictated , if this was so? A far cry from this old chestnut that William was in reduced circumstances and needed to go into the Institution.

Whatever - without the source seen first hand and verified , it is immaterial and we could cheerfully debate it for ever-but I do hope the book does well.

Even so, Workhouse or not , William has relatives in the US. and that's a long way from Bare-knuckle Fighting, canals and the shadow of the Workhouse!!

Do keep me posted -you have piqued my interest!!!
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hi all

Very interesting about Gateshead - maybe new info will come to light ?

He did travel - have I got it wrong or did I read he had a daughter [Leah / Sarah or both?] who married and moved to the S. coast? but was visited often by Bill?

Certainly he travelled a lot when he was boxing.

I was interested that Carl mentioned bricklaying in Aston area between fights - do we have more info [because my Perry line were in this area - perhaps he lodged locally with an Uncle?]

I noticed while reading info on the 1925 grave renovation fund that a Mr Edwin Perry of Stockton on Tees [not quite Gateshead but well on the way] contributed 5 shillings - is there a North East connection or is this just coincidence?

Probably well known to others but the fund was set up to find £25 to restore the Grave of The Slasher at St Johns, Kate's Hill.
Local papers, Sportsmen, public etc where encouraged to donate 5 shillings to the fund. Whilst only 25p in todays money this was a very large individual sum in 1925.
The £25 target was exceded by 17 shillings [which was donated to Charity] and the grave was restored.

Sadly I arrived alone just after dark to St Johns the other night [thanks to Birmingham traffic and Dudley roadworks] and so gave up searching for his grave within a few minutes. My torch was dimming and as the church is all boarded up and the area is not well lit I felt it better[safer] to press on for a beer at the Fountain.
I have seen his grave before but when I next go back again I'll go in daylight [and avoid the spookiness and fear of being arrested or mugged!]

Before I returned to my hotel I did stop in Bilston and visited the old toll house - its remarkable that it still stands [well most of it]

Thanks Carl for the pictures and location info.

Best Regards
Chris
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

HI All I found this song on a webb site is it any good ?

Best wishes Jean
1 Bill Perry lived the life God gave,
He's gone to his long rest.
We'll write these words upon his grave
'He fought and beat the best.' 2 A King he was within the ring,
A songster in Spon Lane;
No more again we'll hear him sing
'My pretty, pretty Jane.'



3 Ben Caunde 'as gone (of doubtful worth)
And dodging Bendigo.
And Freeman Bold, of giant girth,
And fouling Paddock, too. 4 Tom Sayers, bravest of the brave,
Has long ago passed on;
Their bodies lie within the grave,
Their fighting souls box on.



5 That Death! Grim Victor of us all,
He found the Slasher tough!
For never did the Slasher call
' 'Old on, I've had enough.' 6 'Enough, enough!' he never cried,
But battled toe to toe.
Unflinchingly his fists he plied,
And countered blow with blow.



7 And, if you have a tear to shed,
Friend, let it be a splasher!
And let it fall for him now dead,
The gallant Tipton Slasher.

The Tipton Slasher was William Perry (1820-1880); born in Tipton in the Black Country between Wolverhampton and Birmingham, he worked on the canal but left it for prize-fighting. He was Champion of England from 1850 to 1857. Finally defeated by the legendary Tom Sayers, Perry returned to boating. He died from 'lung problems'. If you want more information in the characters mentioned in the poem, putting 'Tipton Slasher' into a search engine will produce many sites.
Tom Sayers was a famous prize-fighter, and lives on in the song 'Heenan and Sayers' whose first verse runs:
Come all you lovers of the fisticuff
Attention to my song,
For I'll sing to you a verse or two
It won't detain you long.
It's to describe a champion fight,
Your time I now employ,
Which took place between Tom Sayers
And the bold Benicia Boy.So! Hurrah my boys for Heenan and Tom Sayers we will sing,
For they are the beat and bravest ever fought in a British ring!
Heenan was an Irish-American who came to fight Sayers for a purse of £1,000, and was known as the Benicia Boy. The fight took place at Farnborough on April 17th 1860 and went on for over an hour. By then Heenan could no longer see and Sayers had a broken arm. The crowd intervened at this point and declared the result to be a draw.
 
William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher died this day 129 years ago.

Hi to all,
just quick message to wish everyone who who took part on this forum a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Also to remind people that William Perry died this day 129 years ago at the Old Toll House Bilston.
Carl.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher died this day 129 years ago.

Hi to all,
just quick message to wish everyone who who took part on this forum a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Also to remind people that William Perry died this day 129 years ago at the Old Toll House Bilston.
Carl.

Thanks Carl
Wish you, and all, a Merry Christmas & Happy New Year too !

Here's to the memory of Bill [Cheers (!)] - I'm sure he would be touched that we still remember him 129 years on

Rgds & Best Wishes
Chris
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Hi Chris, thank you for your kind words and information though out the year. I'm still looking for a link with your Perry's and and the Slashers.

I may have more information in the New Year, if find anything i Will PM you with it.

Take care and best wishes Carl.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

Does anyone know if William's mother "Sarah" remarried? My great great grandfather was Zerah Perry (married Honor Hateley) and his father was Timothy Perry. I am trying to connect my Zerah to William. Any information would be appreciated.
 
William Perry's Great -Great Great Grandson!!!!

I can now confirm without ANY doubt 'The Tipton Slasher's' Great Great Great Grandson is alive and well and living in the US - well, actually visiting the UK at the moment for a 'working holiday' &taking chance to look up his roots.
I met with Doug Powell & his family on 8th January at the Fountain Inn where we had a great time exchanging and comparing documents and family anecdotes which more than confirmed his lineage and our kinship as First Cousins 4 times removed!!
He is a Professor at Kansas University - so in the end 'the Old Slasher's' line has done more than well for itself.
We have arranged to keep the contact going once he returns home!!!
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

he had a one hundred fights in is reign and he ran the fountain pub
in tipton as well born in 1818 and he was the first boxer in the boxing world to hold a world boxing title and yes he did his training there as well as running the pub
i gained this info; this morning from a perry whom lives in hales owen and i shall be seeing him again on monday morning
have a nice day guys best wishes astonion ;;

Here is a picture took by me last Summer.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

he had a one hundred fights in is reign and he ran the fountain pub
in tipton as well born in 1818 and he was the first boxer in the boxing world to hold a world boxing title and yes he did his training there as well as running the pub
i gained this info; this morning from a perry whom lives in hales owen and i shall be seeing him again on monday morning
have a nice day guys best wishes astonion ;;

Here is a picture of The Fountain taken by me last Summer. You can clearly see The Slasher on the sign.
 
Re: William Perry aka The Tipton Slasher

hi all
I am going to relate something I think I remember from long ago 59/60, I may well be mistaken ( having had two small strokes now), but I am sure there are some Brummies out there that will put me right. I was sitting outside the Castle pub, Weoley Castle with a pint of mild ale it was very hot. It was summer and there was not the plethera of tables and chairs like you have now in pub gardens, people were sitting on the small brick walls etc and there was about two small tables and a couple of chairs. I noticed a couple of what I thought elderly men walking with there jackets off into the sort of car park which passed as a garden and came up to one of the tables. there was a few empty glass's, one of the men picked up an empty glass and turned it over sort of upside down. A couple of the people sitting round looked up and one of the lads went into the bar, he came out with the land lord and a thick set big bloke. They talked for a minuet and then all went round the side of the pub and some of the men followed. I went round after a few minuets and one of the"old" men had taken his shirt off, he was very skinny, the big bloke took off his jacket and they squared up to each other. one of the other men started asking for bets, I only had 2/- but put a 1/- on the big bloke, well it was over in about 5 sec's this little old bloke dropped him like a stone, I have never seen anything so fast in my life, he looked like he hardly moved. One of the older blokes told me that in the 30's depression men would go around the pubs and take on anyone for a pint and that's what the upturned pint glass ment. he also said that he had bet on the little bloke as most were fair ground boxers!
I wondered if anyone else had witnessed or knew of anything like it?
regards
paul
 
Re: William Perry's Great -Great Great Grandson!!!!

I can now confirm without ANY doubt 'The Tipton Slasher's' Great Great Great Grandson is alive and well and living in the US - well, actually visiting the UK at the moment for a 'working holiday' &taking chance to look up his roots.
I met with him & his family on 8th January at the Fountain Inn where we had a great time exchanging and comparing documents and family anecdotes which more than confirmed his lineage and our kinship as First Cousins 4 times removed!!
He is a Professor at Kansas University - so in the end 'the Old Slasher's' line has done more than well for itself.
We have arranged to keep the contact going once he returns home!!!

Here's a link to Doug's university website

ttp://www.barfblog.com/blog/139070/10/01/09/journey-through-past-tipton-slasher-edition

Just copy and paste into your address bar.
 
130 Years Ago Today My Great Great Uncle William Perry The Tipton Slasher Died.

Hello and seasons greetings to all.
130 years ago today William Perry 'The Tipton Slasher' died at the Old Toll House Bilston. May he rest in peace.:(
 
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