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jelfs

  • Thread starter Thread starter pawpaw
  • Start date Start date
g'day carl,astonian,
we know nothing----william and annie are a mystery, other than reminising stories of family that we are now placing together. Dennis was evacuated because of the bombing ???for what period of time. The girls had turned eyes......Father felt the war changed so much....and the war was why he missed out on so much.
Silas had 3 children.....(he was always called Bill in Oz,never Silas,and his marine mates called him Bill too)
We are
Maureen Anne (pawpaw)
William Alexander ( Bill too)
Derek James
We are good mates and the boys have me do the communicating-----Isn't that what boys do??????
So always appreciate any information ---- over to you all at the coal face--------
Hot here,40,and Xmas will be at the beach with seafood. Have a wonderful Xmas to you and yours.
Pleased to hear more
 
Hi Astonian,

OK, I have just had a conversation with my uncle (Raymond) who tells me that his father (William) had a brother named Arthur and a father named Joseph. I assume the reference to Park Lane concerns the Jelfs coffee/tea shop that I believe was on the corner. Ray tells me that this was nothing directly to do with his father William. It is my belief that you are following a line of the family that stems from Arthur. Post #6 is a true account of William and Annie's children with the Raymond listed being my uncle and Dennis my father. I do not have a brother only an elder sister named Lynn so again I believe you are following connections to Arthur or this other brother you have mentioned. Raymond does not have any information about his fathers siblings although he does remember a few vague encounters with Joseph (his grandfather). You seem to have done a lot of research - is it for fun or do you have a connection to the name too?

Regards

Carl
 
hi paw
at this stage i would just like to say that willam [ billy ] raymonds father is not alexander
and dennis was arthers son

there was four williams all told and we have two remaining sibblings from a william jelf,s
raymond jelf father was william jelf,s father. [ billy we called him .

the other onewhich is george jelf he was william george ,s son whom is still alive today
they was both high flyers in this country with alot of political history
I have got silas down some-where in my vast paper work
but it will take me some time to trail back through yje vast mountain of paper work
i have got on the jelfs
we have william george jelf married to mary ann hughes i have a will and testoments
of mary ann jelf from william
is yours name annie ; or should it be just ann because this lady as been with the jelfs
brothers one bye one for decades
paws ; i will have to cut off here as my dammed key board is playing up best wishes astonian ;;;
 
Hello Maureen,

How wonderful it is to learn the names of 3 cousins whom I never knew I had until a few moments ago I hope you are all well and as I look out of the widow at the snow that is falling I am very jelous of your sunny bbq christmas. As you will see from my reply to Astonian, it is my belief that he is following a line of the family more connected with our grandfather's sibling Arthur. The post at # 6 is the correct version of our grandparents children although not all of them survived. I have just spoken to our uncle Ray who is the only member of the family that I am in contact with and he sends his warmest regards to you all. I plan to visit him on Saturday (snow permitting) so if I do I will get him to recount some family detail and I will pass it on to you.

You are correct about my father (Dennis) being evacuated during the war but I do not know how long that was for. He never told me that much about it although I have since learned that he did not have a pleasant time and at some point Annie went and brought him back to Birmingham. Pat does have a squint and I believe it was Nelie who had an unfortunate accident as a child which resulted in the loss of sight in one eye. My son (Thomas 12) also has a slight squint it's in the Jelfs genes I'm afraid - did the squint gene make it's way to Australia too?

I will do my best to refer to your father as Bill from now on - it is interesting to see that he named two of you after his parents. I notice from the dates that Bill sadly passed away at a relatively young age - would it be rude of me to ask what happened?

I myself am married to Lorraine and we have two children Thomas 12 and Sophie 7 - what about you guys? I would be more than happy to send some photographs of Ray and ourselves if you would like. I know that Ray also has some photographs of his parents which I am sure he would let me scan and send to you. If you could possibly do the same if you have a picture of Bill I know that it would be welcomed by Ray.

All the best

Carl
 
dear carl
give my regards to raymond when you see him , and also tell him i am the one he spoke to
on the telephonr about tyburn rd and i am his cousins son [ joyce ivy beatrice jelf ;
and her father was ernie ,is dads brother william ; but we call him billy ;
whom i have never forgotten and its not just arther i am searching for its the whole family
going back years and i have learnt alot for the book i am writing
and it will be a very accurate and intresting to read
and no carl ; this aint for fun i am a very serious person
and i have written documentation ; with some one whom is helping to compile this book with me
have a nice day ;; astonian;;;;
 
what a big surprise---we were into william and annie and here we are with living rels----lovely to know and have.... I was in Hockley for the day in 1996 looking for people places things talked about by father-----was wonderful to see. Meet no-one but quite a day. Very keen to be included in obtaining the hard research by Astonian when it is completed.
How long have you been researching the Jelfs???? Will follow this Foram sight with great interest.
Thankyou all so much and have a wonderful Xmas and may you and yours have all your dreams come true in 2010. We remain very interested in Jelfs ...Father always said he was a Brit---is this Druid culture????
 
hi PAWS
Yes i do hold a lot of info; on the jelfs going bacl to the 1800.s
but there is a lot more to gather yet beleive me
i have gone back to there roots and discovered by official documents which i had to pay for
and still do today about certain info; sensetive ifo[ regarding some of thejelfs
i do not know if i had mentioned it to you ,but my mother was the only child to ernest jelf
and she was around all the jelfs and seen and heard and lived with in the family business
she went to private school from the age of 4 yrs old up till leaving age
and she had a fantasic memory and she related about every think from the age of five
she related about silas and pearl and him joining the army and remembered a big bomb dropping by there
shop she4 also told me of your family living in aussie land but could not remember which part it was and
also about another member living in perth and george whom is one of williams son
went to canada and came back and they dis owned him for is political beleive
I have got pictures of there old little cottage s where they grew up and these little farm cottages
where they came from even today the village is over run by the jelfs sibblings
i go there and mix we these people quite often
regarding raymond and his side william was his father , but he was not a succesful as the rest of the jelfs
his father only ever had one shop premises,and it never worked out for him [ billy we called him ]
raymond went to the aston commercial grammer school and worked and studyed very hard
he set up a big company on the tyburn rd next to grand fatheres home and bussiness
to do with machines you can get this on google and now ge his a succesful gov,officier up in oxford london
i have spoke afew times with him on the phone
raymond and my mom [ joyce ivy beatrice jelf ] are first cousins as i said mom went to private school
and raymond went to grammer school as i have said his father and ray was not that much involved with the
bussiness side ray had a older brother but sadly he died at a very early age and burried in key hill under the
paupers grave and there mother was a jewish lady but when they got older they took the jelfs name after there father william [ bill ]
but raymond is a very high profile man in the oxford
if you can get into google and type in the names of the jelfs you will see where they came from and what
they stood for and our fore fathers
ernie marid a wealthy woman by the name of bertha victoria hinton and a stage dancer with well know
people in the thearter world to mant names to mention at this stage
all the other members of the family i can mention
silas , thomas . edward. henry , charles arther william william george and george william
there is a couple more . oh the one sister ivy
ernie died the same year as silas 1969
they all had bussiness a mile apart but very rarely they spoke tp each other
i can only presume for the society they was involved with charles and henry and arther would sit on the courts jurys in special crim cases such as hanging cases
edward sent william yarnold to the gallows for murder of his wife in our county of worcestershire
thats where i live now afew miles from where all the jelfs came from before moning into birmingam
and he sent for henry piepoint to come from bradford to hang him there
i also have pictures of william yornold in the dock with the constable being sentenced to death by
edward jelf in worc 1925 these was sent to me by a retired journalist by the name of
michael grundy of our worcester news . and incidently the hanging cell
it was a pity i never heard of you before now because i would have loved to have met you
pwesonaly paws and i could have taken you on a conducted sight tours as to where all the jelfs property
was around brum also taken you to the village of cow honeybourne eversham where the farm they had
and still there today along with there little cottages that they lived and worked in
and introduced to you the people pf relatives to us whom was still alive and given abit more info ;
stil not to worry i will keep in touch with you and let you know abit more about the thomas and silas.s
as i have got to shoot off now and yes i am compilng the book on the jelfs
and its gonna be a good read i have a very long old friend whom they call mr BBC whom
is helping mre to put it together i have to tell you there was alot of skeletons in the cubbard
on the subject of the dreids yes they was grand masters of this society
and this is not the druids that practice relegion at stone henge either
well paws until the next time have your self a happy christmas and a very happy and prosperous new year
for 2010
astonian ;;
 
hi carl
so your grand father was arther and your dad was dennis and you are denis ,s son
and ray said his father was nothink to do with park lane
did ray mentioned that his father crashed my grand fathers mini van william is father [ bill ]
after my grand father died and wrote it off ?.
also yout grand father went into partnership with my grand father if you check records and directorys
you will see A.E. JELF crockery hire rear of park lane 1968-9 years
and i was speaking with a brother of mine whom told me of one of the family of arthers
younger sons helped him out [ that being ernie] what year did your father died
if you do not find it painful to recall it alsp it was rays father whom wound my grand fathers [ ernest]
business up on her behalf but bill did help him out quite often l
i must admitt i did have abit of an inclination for you being connected to ray .when you first contacted the forum ;
still its a small world aint it . carl
i thought i would mention it to you about bill being involved with ernies bussiness
my brother said it was a very young lad whom helped grand father out at the time
and the reason he asked your grand father was because my oldest brother did not see eye eye with my grand father because of the way he treated my mother and especialy being the only daughter and only child to him
well carl i did expect a reply from you before but you never got back to me
so i would like an reply its what we expect on our forum
any way carl i hope you gave my regards when you spoke to uncle raymond
speak soon 'seasons greeting to you and your family astonian;;;
 
Hello Astonian,

Very interesting stuff however I feel that I must clarify a few things in order to avoid any further confusion. The Raymond Jelfs you mention is not my uncle. We are aware of another Raymond Jelfs who I believe also lives in B;ham and it must have been him that you spoke to about Tyburn Road. The branch of the family that Paw's and myself come from comes from William Jelfs (our grandfather) William was the son of Joseph and he did have a brother named ArthUr. The 1901 census shows Joseph listing his family with William 2 and Arthur 6 clearly shown as his sons. There is no mention of Earnest whom I now see was Arthur's son. My father was Dennis, Silas's brother and William's son. There is no Jewish connection to Silas he was simply named after his mother’s father and we are not aware of any direct connection to the tea shop that you have mentioned although granddad William did mention when he was alive that there may be a distant connection somewhere. Our branch of the family was very poor and none of them ever went to grammar school or the like. You state that a George went to Canada and perhaps someone else went to Perth in Australia but again I believe there is a crossed thread which is also adding confusion. I can understand how difficult it is to research family histories especially when the same Christian names keep cropping up (William, ArthEr, Silas, Dennis, Raymond even Pearl).
What is clear is that Paw's and I are cousins, our fathers (Dennis & Silas) were brothers, and our grandfather was William Jelfs whose father was Joseph. There is no direct link to a tea shop, there is no Jewish connection and it would now appear that the line you have been refering to is that of Arthur with some coincidental Christian names thrown in.
I do genuinely wish you well with your research and book however for my part I will now bow out of this forum.
Happy hunting.
Carl
 
well carl
knowing what i know and with the aid of my producer friend from thr BBC
And knowing what i do know they certainly don,t add up to what you say
nerry christmas to you and your family
i will try and call on our raymond in the new year
astonian ;;;
 
hi astonian,carl,et al,
You put us on the right track astonian and i look forward to reading your posts
Carl and my Oz family have made contact and are swapping photoes.
I could never do what you are doing with family research...i enjoy the forum sights and gain interest in the history. Our Jelfs come from the poor end of town but good stock. Keep up your research and posts; i will keep reading them. Let me know when you finish the book.
A pawpaw in Oz is a papaya in England ---i had just eaten one when i signed in and the taste was in my mouth,hence my name....forgot the difference in names.
Took me a bit to realise the coonection to dogs feet
all the best,keep me posted ---and a merry xmas
pawpaw
 
Hi Carl,
I am related to the Jelfs,via Astonians line, but I was interested to read what you say about squints as I too had squints in both eyes.
I think there is a connection between us somewhere as the Jelfs tended to use the same names. My Great Grandad was George william Jelf born 1864 he had siblings Henry,Arthur and Martha. I will try and see if I can find a connection between us
regards
Jayne
 
the eye sqint is in the genes for the jelfs---we have it here in Oz too
easy to deal with iin this day and age---allthe best
 
hi paws
yes it was a family trait all with fair to blonde hair color
and yes every one had a squint all except the ladies
william .rays father had a very bad one ernest had one eye used to be dangerous on the rd
driving with one eye always onthe wrong side of the rd mo-one would go with him
plus the fact he had a foot with one toe on his foot
and they never communicated with each other even thou they lived about a mile away from each other
it was the same from generations of the jelfs going back to 1800s
in eversham village some ofthem are only a stone fromeach one down there today same applys
one of the sibblings is a germam decent . the mother a germam lady marrid a certain jelf
apparently she left her husbaand and ran off with a certain jelf this man is elderly
he told me the story how is mom ran off and marrid a jelf, i will not reveal his name of anty of the both partys concernrd ,even thou the three people concerned have passed away and burried
there is a couple of the jelfs still alive as you may be aware so i do not want to say to much
because i am restricked to what and how i put things on thisforum
but one of the jelfs are alive whom mother was an jewish origin and marrid a certain member of the
jelfs ,they had there mothers name rather than the jelfs name ,
but when there mother died they changed there name by deed poll to the fathers name . ie . [ jelf]
like before i have just said i will not reveal the name of the jelfsi am referring to .as they are still alive
and kicking and regards pearl my mother remembered her and the other half going to war ;
she told me of the shop and she was a very educated my mother she went to a private school from
the age of five her mother was a decent of a american lady wealthy whom married into the jelfs
she put her through the private school even when my oldest sister was born my grand parents sent her
down to london to a private school where the older and senior members of the british high society
of the jelfs was living [they was judges ] i have tracked down thename of the schol just recently
but any way getting back on track the jelfs come from a long line of breading stock
 
astonian
do you do most of your work in summer or winter?
think cold winter nights would be for me
and go and see people in summer?
 
good day paws
if you really want to know i work day and night,
i am like a dog with an old bone and i work 365 days of the year
and i know my mother said one of the family moved to aussie ,
and i knew about carl and there was two dennis,s one was living in king standing afew years ago
and the other one is lying in the cemetry and a certain jelf moved to eversham
but any way all will be revealed shortly and i know about the uncle raymond carl was referring too
speak soon astonian ;;;;
 
HI JAYNE
How are you keeping fine i hope i was nice to see you back on line
and i must admitt its been a year or two since i spoke to you last or evenwritten to you
in fact i came across a letter of yours in my bed side cubboard and i have been meaning to phone you
have you got a copy of george william ,s death cerificate when he died at tyburn rd
i have got one if you want one ,what i am desperately seeking is a photograph of him
would it be possible that you may have one .? , so i could take a copy off it
the last time we spoke by phone i think you said you was working and wewas going to arrange a time to
come over to your house or it may have been we was waiting for an another lady to come to your house
jayne have you got axcess to an email a private one , if you have i will send you mine through the post
then you could contact me personally if you have got one
i would dearly love to meet up with you we could be hours exchanging pics i have finaly got one of bertha
hinton and grand father abroad on holiday she looked like a very tall lady and slender
i finally got my youngest sister to get the old family pics out of the loft
because she his very ill and she wants to sort the house out before its to late
jayne i will drop you a line by next week and oh yes they most certainly had the sqints
but i did se a pic of william ,i presume he was the oldest when he was young he looked a good looking
fellow in his youner days blonde hair blue eyes a very good looking dazzler
jayne i have to dash now but will catch up with you soon ; best wishes astonian ;;;;
 
Hi.......
I am related to SILAS JELFS, -
My dad (JONATHON -JACK) was SILAS JELFS cousin................
And my DADS MOTHER (SARAH) was SILASs MUMS (ANNIE)SISTER ....
SILAS JELFS was married to my MOTHER (ELSIE), and they had a son (RONALD - RONNIE)......
I remember SILAS COTTERIL who i think was ANNIE and SARAHs brother.......... and later years i remember GLADYS and GEORGE COTTERIL...

FROM Mark Watkins
 
markwwalbir said:
Hi.......
I am related to SILAS JELFS, -
My dad (JONATHON -JACK) was SILAS JELFS cousin................
And my DADS MOTHER (SARAH) was SILASs MUMS (ANNIE)SISTER ....
SILAS JELFS was married to my MOTHER (ELSIE), and they had a son (RONALD - RONNIE)......
I remember SILAS COTTERIL who i think was ANNIE and SARAHs brother.......... and later years i remember GLADYS and GEORGE COTTERIL...

FROM Mark Watkins
Click to expand...
Mark are you Ronalds (Ronnie) half brother---we are confused----
Yes we are related to Silas :cool:Jelfs
 
hi i am related to silas jelfs, i am his granddaughter ,i am ronalds daughter (mark has mentioned on his earlier message ).the information i got is silas had 7 brothers and sisters margie,nellie,desmond who died when he was a baby ,raymond ,dennis,hazel and pat and lived in branston st . TRACEY WEBB XX
 
View attachment 54027Hi paw paw, yes i am RONNIES half brother ...., and i have 2 other brothers PAUL ... JOHN...and a sister LINDA .....
One of RONNIES daughters (my niece) has left a message on this forum ( TRACEY)....
I am on FACEBOOK - MARK WATKINS and so is tracey TRACEY WEBB......(jelfs)
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1321332779

We have quite a bit of information between us all referance names etc ...!!!:)
 
I know this forum is old so I only hope this message gets seen. I have a rations book and national savings certificate, and ID and medical card belonging to Silas William Jelfs, from 1941 when he was 20 years old. My grandad gave it to me (no relation), so they must of known each other. It would be great if I could get it back into the family, so if any relative of Silas reads this, please contact me if it is of interest to you. I can send pictures if needed.
 
Astonian said:
HI JAYNE
How are you keeping fine i hope i was nice to see you back on line
and i must admitt its been a year or two since i spoke to you last or evenwritten to you
in fact i came across a letter of yours in my bed side cubboard and i have been meaning to phone you
have you got a copy of george william ,s death cerificate when he died at tyburn rd
i have got one if you want one ,what i am desperately seeking is a photograph of him
would it be possible that you may have one .? , so i could take a copy off it
the last time we spoke by phone i think you said you was working and wewas going to arrange a time to
come over to your house or it may have been we was waiting for an another lady to come to your house
jayne have you got axcess to an email a private one , if you have i will send you mine through the post
then you could contact me personally if you have got one
i would dearly love to meet up with you we could be hours exchanging pics i have finaly got one of bertha
hinton and grand father abroad on holiday she looked like a very tall lady and slender
i finally got my youngest sister to get the old family pics out of the loft
because she his very ill and she wants to sort the house out before its to late
jayne i will drop you a line by next week and oh yes they most certainly had the sqints
but i did se a pic of william ,i presume he was the oldest when he was young he looked a good looking
fellow in his youner days blonde hair blue eyes a very good looking dazzler
jayne i have to dash now but will catch up with you soon ; best wishes astonian ;;;;
Click to expand...
I’m related to the Jelfs at kings Norton vi and George Jelfs sons Brian /John /Reginald George
 
Alberta said:
Hi Pawpaw ,what is it you are looking for.
Living relatives or information about ancestors?
Click to expand...
John Hughes was the father, (my great great grandfather) of Mary Ann Hughes who married William George jelf. Have you any info on her parents marriage (Sarah Brueton) was her mother. Many thanks.
 
Mattg said:
I know this forum is old so I only hope this message gets seen. I have a rations book and national savings certificate, and ID and medical card belonging to Silas William Jelfs, from 1941 when he was 20 years old. My grandad gave it to me (no relation), so they must of known each other. It would be great if I could get it back into the family, so if any relative of Silas reads this, please contact me if it is of interest to you. I can send pictures if needed.
Click to expand...
I am the son of Annie Marjory Jelfs Annie Cotterell Jelf's eldest daughter. I'm the last of Margies kids of 90 Branston St Hockley. I spent my early life with Annie &Billy who lived at 10/80 Branston St. There are many descendants of Annie & Billy alive today. Most live outside Birmingham. Until Annie's death they had a maisonette in Nechells.
I also spent time with my Aunty Nell in Tyburn Rd. Dennis & Raymond both took me out for trips when I was a kid. I inherited the Jelfs squint which was rectified at age 16. I know probably this post is probably to late to be topical but my family were far from typical as my grandad Billy fought as machine gunner in WW1& led an eventful life. My grandmother was always searching for her eldest Silas but I think Margie knew more than she ever let on as Silas & Margie were devoted to each other. Mum died in 2005 and is not buried in Birmingham. I left Hockley in 1961 for Erdington but that's another story.
 
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