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iron founders

K

karro

master brummie
This is my first posting so hope I'm doing this right.
I'd like to know more about what being an iron founder about 1848 would entail. What kind of things would one make. My 3xgreat grand father was an iron founder and when he died his wife took over their business.
I'm just trying to understand how they made a lving. Would they have worked in their home?
Thanks Karro
 
3_Foundry_pouring.jpg



Founding is casting so an Iron Founder would be in the business of casting Iron in an Iron Foundry

Many thing were made from cast Iron, there are even some houses with walls of iron, parts for steam engines, so many different things with so many different uses. The Black Country Museum has some Iron Houses built around 1925 because of a shortage of more traditonal materials, and if I remember correctly Iron Houses are shown on some 1800's maps of Southern Aston/ Newtown. Bridges, Wheels etc etc etc the list is almost endless.

The Soho Works is perhaps worthy of note with regards to a foundry.



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180px-Ironbridge002.JPG
 
Great pictures Rod. I have always thought foundries quite scary places. In the early 70's my husband drove a CO2 tanker and often delivered to foundries. I sometimes went with him onmy day off (it was ok in those days). I remember looking into these dark dynegy place's with the white hot metal being poured into moulds. I thought it so dangerous........well I supose it was. The men worked so hard in these teriffic tempratures. I can remember one day we were in Craidley Heath and they were pulling out an anchor chain it went across the road and stoped all the traffic.

On another note I remember my first visit to Ironbridge I was about 10. My Dad was going in to raptures about this bridge and I couldn't understand why. Well of course I do now.:)
 
Hi Rod
Thanks for the great photos. Obviously no one could do that kind of work in their home. I heard that iron founders use molds but from your photo I can see how unlikely that would be.
the reason I thought that they may work in their home is that on the 1861 census under the occupation area it stated "iron founder empl 5 men & ___boys".
Do you (or anyone) have any thoughts about how that would be????

Karro
 
The fact that it states he employed people denoted that he was self-employed and not just working as an iron founder. He probably had a small foundry which would have produced many smaller items. Many if not all of these would be made using a mold in a wooden cask filled with sand. The molten metal poured in to access holes and left to cool.
 
Iron Foundries

I worked the best part of my life for a company (Foseco in Nechells) selling consumables to the foundry trade.

Very quickly, iron foundries were at the top end of the foundry trade in terms of size, as the equipment required for melting iron was large and required a good deal of space. A typical iron casting is a car-engine cylinder block or cylinder head. Made in a sand-mould comprising special sand bonded with clay or chemicals. There were relatively few iron-foundries in and around Birmingham, and the ones that did exist largely supplied the shipping and, later, the car industry. My g-g-g-grandfather was a Mr Kesterton of Aston who was described as an 'iron-master', and he ran a foundry that in the mid-19th century produced parts for things like stoves, gratings, drains, window-frames, and so forth. Iron was melted in a device known as a cupola, the operation of which could be seen from miles away in the shape of flames and clouds of acrid smoke. The large iron foundries were located mostly in the Black Country, as this area was close to the coal-fields, as it was coal and coke that was used to fuel the cupolas (and later the blast-furnaces for steel-casting - a very different technique and one which eventually became dependent upon electricity).

In Birmingham, the majority of foundries were engaged in the casting of non-ferrous metals, mostly brass and gun-metal, and latterly aluminium. These metals required far less in the way of energy to melt, and were also used to produce, in the main, smaller castings such as gas-fittings, pots and pans, gun parts, etc. These days, there are still firms which produce small non-ferrous castings for precision-instruments, cars and aircraft parts, jewellery, etc. But the techniques they use are very far removed from the old days.

I have a photo of yours truly standing in one of the bores of a marine-engine block casting made at GEC Rugby in the 1980's. Such castings these days come mostly from Eastern Europe or India.

I can tell you that molten metal exerts a certain fascination....

Big Gee
 
I am given to understand that one of my ancestors was a "pudler", there are other job descriptions on the forum, but the one I am talking about was working in a foundry, a pudler would be involved in the process of making cast iron and was usually self employed, and would employ boys and youths to help. Maybe this would exlain it?
 
Badger,

Puddling was originally the process by which molten wrought iron (different to cast iron) was kept open to the atmosphere and a supply of oxygen. As it formed, the slag, or scum, was carefully scraped away from the surface of the metal using metal tools like a hoe, to maintain the correct purity of the metal. It was said to be the most physically-demanding work of any in a foundry. Puddling as an occupation died out when wrought iron was no longer produced, I'd guess in the latter half of the 19th century.

Wrought iron was used to produce window-frames, pumps and marine-fittings amongst other things, because it was more resistant to rusting than cast iron.

Regards,

Big Gee
 
Sorry Big Gee, got my Irons mixed up (a senior moment).
I have a write up somewhere saying that the majority of puddlers were self employed and would employ youngsters to assist.
 
Big G thanks for the facinating information about the working of foundries. I have only a little knowledge mainly from the other arf and the wonderful Fred Dibner films.
I noted the name of your ancester being Kesterton, being unusual would this have any connection to the Kesterton Road in Four Oaks incidently where I grew up!
 
Moma P said:
Big G thanks for the facinating information about the working of foundries. I have only a little knowledge mainly from the other arf and the wonderful Fred Dibner films.
I noted the name of your ancester being Kesterton, being unusual would this have any connection to the Kesterton Road in Four Oaks incidently where I grew up!
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Hi Moma P.

Always a pleasure to talk about the metals industries, a big part of my early life but now sadly almost a thing of the past in this country. I have many of Fred Dibnah's programmes on video, and even now, when I watch them, I can see how totally devoted he was to the actual making of things, and all the effort and skill and hard work that went with it; something I feel that's been lost to recent generations. Yet only the other day I saw on TV how a team of dedicated enthusiasts are building from scratch a steam locomotive, and how they are finding it so difficult to locate skilled tradesmen who, not so many years ago, could have been found in almost any street in Birmingham and the Black Country.

The Kestertons were my maternal grandmother's mother's family in Aston. I have never been able to locate their foundry, but I think it was somewhere around Summer Lane. I'm talking about the 1850's here. I rather think it was little more than a backyard operation. My dear old gran married William Diaper from Worcestershire, and he got a 'respectable' job driving a shunting-engine at ICI Witton - much better than a dirty old foundry! As far as I'm aware, there is no connection with Kesterton Road, Four Oaks. My lovely old gran wouldn't even have known where Four Oaks is, bless her.

Big Gee
 
Well Big Gee I have envolvement in metals as far as my Dad was an engineer so was/is my eldest brother who posts occasionally and my cousin who lives in Sutton sells steel. I love Fred's films and always have, strange for a woman I suppose. I also had the Mark Williams DVD for Christmas, Industrial Revalations........brilliant! My brother will tell you about skilled tradesmen, he has watched the decline first hand for years (he has just retired at 65). I wrote an article last year for Carl Chinn's mag about my father and his work. I was amazed to receive several emails about how sad people were with the decline in engineering. One came from the director of a firm in Hockley it made me feel extreamly sad. My brother is always being asked to help with the steam trains, he worked on the minature ones for years and I suppose its the same principal. He decided not to start as his health has not been good,unfortunatly often people want the work for nothing. How sad it is we are loosing these craftsmen.

Re your foundry why not post something on the trade directory look ups you will be suprised what John can find.
I always wondered about Kesterton Road as its an unusual name, I don't think there is another road with that name in Birmingham.
 
I work in the textiles industry, and from time to time I get inquiries from places such as the Severn Valley Railway seeking things like tallow-impregnated felt washers for a steam-engine valve gear. Yes, we can still make them - but at a huge cost! Not so many years ago such things were available for next to nothing. We also used to sell huge quantities of felt polishing-pads used in the manufacture of pots and pans, but all this work has now gone to places like India and China.
Regards,

Big Gee
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Google search

Big Gee said:
Hi John.

Your thumbnails refer to a Kesterton who was a 'victualler', i.e., a grocer.
Could well have been related to 'my' Kestertons. I simply do not know.

I Googled 'Kesterton Birmingham' a few minutes ago, and although the name is not as uncommon as I'd thought, there was no reference to the iron trades.

Having said that, residing in the bottom of a wardrobe in my house is a very large box containing family records going back to the year dot - one day I'll sift through them and see what I find.

Thanks and regards,

Big Gee
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Hi Big Gee

Did you find this link on Google;)
https://www.drhop.com/males.htm#male_t
It is a master index of Kerterton males.
Has a couple of pictures and letters too.:)
Over 300 pages if you print it off, I know.
Found my sis in laws G/father and stangly enough an old work mate of mine and his brother, what a turn up.
Still need to find info on the female side of things but at least this is a major step up.
Thanks to those who were unselfish enough to post their very hard work for us all to share.:cool:

Derek
 
Hi Derek,

Wow, that's a heavy link and no mistake - I need to sit down and study it. I also need to dig out my family records one of these fine days. All a matter of finding the time, I'm afraid.

But thanks for your interest and help - I really appreciate it. I have to admit that I'm a hopeless non-starter when it comes to genealogy.

Best regards,

Big Gee
 
Iron foundry's

:DanceBallerina3: My husband said he watched a documenty sometime over the weekend about foundry' of yesteryear. He can't remember what it was called though. Sometimes they repeat them so look out. TTFN. Jean. :DanceBallerina3:
 
Although I never actually worked in a foundry, I visited many, many of them throughout the UK during the course of my employment with Foseco Ltd and other companies supplying the foundry industry. The old sand-casting iron and steel foundries were the worst, whereas a few of the newer non-ferrous (aluminium, mostly) foundries were relatively clean and tidy.

The most impressive foundry that I can remember was British Steel Renishaw (near Chesterfield) where they cast ingot-moulds for the steel industry. That place was like a scene out of Dante's Inferno, due to the huge quantities of steel they cast and the sheer size and racket of the electric furnaces. Health & Safety? Didn't really apply. But I loved visiting there. The noise was terrific, the heat almost unbearable, and the sheer scale of the muck indescribable. The men who worked there were supermen, in many respects, and they earned ten times over every penny they were paid.

But I can tell you that molten metal has a strange effect on even the hardest, toughest bloke, because when they tapped a furnace all of a sudden all (shouted) conversation ceased, and there would be dozens of upturned faces all glowing in the reflection of the hot, liquid, living metal as it began to flow...it was a kind of mad magic that gripped you; it was almost hypnotising.

All gone now. Flattened. I think it's a housing-estate now. As so many of our foundries and factories are. I can just remember (when I was a wee lad) standing on the top of Clent one evening with my old man (who was also connected with foundries) watching the sky light up as somewhere down in the Black Country one of the very last blast furnaces was blown, and I wanted to be a part of that.

I left the foundry industry in 1988, much against my better judgment, but I had to earn a living.

A past age, and boy! do I miss it!

I'm all nostalgic now!

Big Gee
 
Just for the record, Victualler was the general term, not for a grocer but the proprietor of a pub (or tavern, inn, or hotel). In early records they were sometimes also called Ostlers - the same root as the French word hoteliers.
Peter
 
Peter Walker said:
Just for the record, Victualler was the general term, not for a grocer but the proprietor of a pub (or tavern, inn, or hotel). In early records they were sometimes also called Ostlers - the same root as the French word hoteliers.
Peter
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Peter,

The word ostler does stem from the word hostel, but according to my OED it specifically refers to someone who was employed at an inn or other kind of hostelry to look after the stables. My paternal grandfather (about whom I know nothing) was an ostler according to my dad's birth-certificate.

Big Gee
 
Birmingham Iron Founders deserve more mention than have been given on this site. It was an important trade with various branches, one being Malleable Iron Foundry. Some of the other trades also had iron foundries as part of their operation. This includes the metallic bedstead trade.

Local iron founders made such useful iron goods such as stoves, grates and fireplaces. They supplied parts for various engineering disciplines and this included stationary steam engines and even the odd locomotive. Structural ironwork was once another aspect as was the various components required for weighing machines. It is a very long list when cast iron products made in Birmingham are considered.

Whilst the making of pig iron was general confined to area outside Birmingham, such as South Staffordshire and East Worcestershire some working up of iron to wrought by the Puddling Process was done in Birmingham in a few select ironworks (e.g Eyre Street).
 
Hi, I lived in Albion Road Greet at the end of the road was a foundry called Fishers Foundry. I will try to find out some more about them.
 
Bronson said:
Hi, I lived in Albion Road Greet at the end of the road was a foundry called Fishers Foundry. I will try to find out some more about them.
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Bronson, I lived on the corner of Albion and Tomey roads and remember playing football in the road down by Fisher Foundries.
 
I have just, this morning, been looking at a draft map of 1781 on the Birmingham Library website - ref: Plan of Birmingham Thomas Hanson c.1781 WCRO CR1086/5. This shows an iron Foundry next to the Canal Terminus at Paradise Wharf. Does anyone know who owned that foundry?
 
The 1781 Hanson map shows two foundries next to Old Wharf (see below), though assume that you are referring to the one which is between the wharf and what would later be Broad St, though it is not marked as such on the map. This was the Eagle foundry, owned by Sir Thomas Gooch. He certainly owned it in the 1820s, as it is so marked on the Pigott Smith map c1824 (below). Hanson map c1781.jpgPigott smith map c1824.jpg
 
Whilst it may be true that there were not many iron foundries in Birmingham making castings for sale to other companies I have come across quite a few companies that had foundries for making castings for their own use. I used to work for Hunt & Mitton in Oozells St. North who had their own foundry, I visited Taylor & Challen who made their own castings and I also went for a job at another company making power presses in Kidderminster who were in the process of molding a press frame which was moulded into the floor. Needless to say all these have now gone.
 
mikejee said:
The 1781 Hanson map shows two foundries next to Old Wharf (see below), though assume that you are referring to the one which is between the wharf and what would later be Broad St, though it is not marked as such on the map. This was the Eagle foundry, owned by Sir Thomas Gooch. He certainly owned it in the 1820s, as it is so marked on the Pigott Smith map c1824 (below). View attachment 153229View attachment 153228
Click to expand...
Thank you for alerting me to the later map. Very interesting. I have established that one of the Foundries was first opened by Richard Dearman. Not yet sure about the second one, though. By this time, Dearman was m. to Elizabeth Freeth - dau of Sampson Freeth, Ironmonger (and sister of the poet). Not sure if that sheds any more light as yet.
 
Mr Grandfather worked at R C Gibbons & Co foundry in Ladywood in 1921. Does anyone out there have any information on this company please?
 
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