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Cleaver?davies again - any help from the experts on the forum?

K

kah

Flamenco Brummie
Thanks to the expertise of members of the forum (Shera et al) I have been able to ascertain that my Great Grandmother, Eva Cleaver, was the daughter of Kate Davies, born around 1854 in Llanfair, Montgomereyshire. Her father was William Davies.

I also think I've found William, in Manafon/Tregynon on the 1891/1901 census returns. He's a road labourer (as stated on one of the certificates we have for Kate) and his second wife is a midwife - something my Mother remembers being told. Also, in 1901, he has a grand daughter, Claudine Cleaver (born in Birmingham) staying with him. According to her birth certificate her parents were Kate Davies and Harry Cleaver.

This, and a few other 'links' I won't bore you with, made us think 'great, right family'.

So...why is there a daughter named Kate, born in 1861 and single listed on both William's 1891 and 1901 census return??? 'My Kate' apparently died in 1897 and in 1891 is listed as being with her husband Harry in Birmingham??? My mother and I have been going 'round in circles with this. Wrong Kate? Wrong William? Surely you wouldn't have two children with the same name? Or are we just missing something obvious??

Any suggestions/ideas would be gratefully recieved!

Karenanne (and her mom, Margaret)
 
i am wondering whether one or the other used their second name as first name (which often happened) or maybe one was named catherine and the other kate. everything else seems to match up but their dates of birth are about 9 years difference so they are definitely two different people. see what others think :)
 
Could be possible - the William I think is the right one had a daughter named Anne around 1860 - maybe she started calling herself Kate? Just so hard with my Brummie family having roots in Wales and being called Davies of all things!!! Kx
 
I have in the past while researching found children in the same family with the same name... For example: If the father remarried and had more children... If the older of the two children had died before the birth of the younger one... and as has already been suggested 'Nick names', or use of second names.
Even today my Ex-Son-in-law has an eldest son Jamie, a second one Adam James and a third James (He has been married three times and James is his own second name).
All three boys have the same surname and were born over a period of about 16 years, I would hate to be researching that one in 50 to 100 years time:)
 
Thanks for the reply. You could be right. There is so much that links this Welsh family to my Birmingham one. Just wish I could be sure I'm on the right lines! Karenanne
 
My grandad was christened Albert Edward, and he and gran had amongst their children a Bert and an Albert Edward, it has always puzzled me, they both lived to middle/old ages.
 
Thanks for all the replies. No, he wouldn't have married his second wife until at least 1867. There is also no Kate born around 1861 listed on the 1871 or 1881 census. How odd???!!! Karenanne
 
Just to conclude this post - I have now discovered the the second 'mystery Kate' was my Kate's father's second wife's illegitmate child using the Davies surname. Now why didn't we all work that out!!!!! Kx
 
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