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Birmingham characters

Yes Donna
it was during the 1950.s[ mid to late 50.s ]
there was four of us passing and we looked at each other and said to our selves she wants
to be nicked but i could not stop thinking she was known to them because in those days
there was quite afew characters around and the old bill new them all
and all the jack the lads and the crimms, and in those days there was quite afew old lags whom was
out on the streets and tramps whom was meth,s drinkers and only wanted a bed for the the night
and the lane was very acomadating in those days,i have seen a tramp stand out side dudley rd nick
which is summer field park and lobb a bottle through the window and wait for them to come tearing
out of the nick and find whom was responible and he said its me
and he new he would get a lift to steel house lane for the christmas dinner at winson green prison
sadley today the coppers have there work cut out and endeavour danger and they do not know whom the crimms are today
best wishes Astonian ;;;
 
Astonian said:
Yes Donna
it was during the 1950.s[ mid to late 50.s ]
there was four of us passing and we looked at each other and said to our selves she wants
to be nicked but i could not stop thinking she was known to them because in those days
there was quite afew characters around and the old bill new them all
and all the jack the lads and the crimms, and in those days there was quite afew old lags whom was
out on the streets and tramps whom was meth,s drinkers and only wanted a bed for the the night
and the lane was very acomadating in those days,i have seen a tramp stand out side dudley rd nick
which is summer field park and lobb a bottle through the window and wait for them to come tearing
out of the nick and find whom was responible and he said its me
and he new he would get a lift to steel house lane for the christmas dinner at winson green prison
sadley today the coppers have there work cut out and endeavour danger and they do not know whom the crimms are today
best wishes Astonian ;;;
Click to expand...
Hello Astonian, i just love your stories, they pu tyou right back there. the lady in question was my gt gt nan and she had 14 children. i can understand why she would try and get put away for christmas dinner with all them mouths to feed!!!!!!
 
Hi Donna
I Donna i can recall her as clearly as yesterday times would have been hard for her with all those kids
and there was me thinking that we was a large family my mother had a eleven kids
when people heard this , they used to say blimey as your old man got his own foot ball team
he used to work at charles harris on the flat at hockley [ lodge road ] he was a bakerlite moulder
he knew the owner through my mother whom came from the same village when they was young
but any way ,getting on track , in those days it was most popular way of getting christmas dinner
and a warm bed for that period of time you would be amazed how many people would do it
it was always on the run up to christmas week people would do alsorts of things to get them locked
up .but years ago you was locked up for debt, but now they used the bailiffs to empty your house
and in those days some people used to get worried sick over there problems for
the fear of being locked up and being sent to winson green nick where they used to have to wear a brown uniform . and the robbers and theives would wear a grey uniform so the officeirs knew whom was who
and whom was the real bad guys
but it was a common thing to do to get a bed and a christmas dinner when things was really bad
and getting tough with all those kids i did not blame her
when i reflect back over the years and think how my poor mother struggled i think she was marvelous
the old man always worked but never seem to hand over money to her but always had is beer money
to be quite honest it was her rich mother bertha hinton whom was always there for her
as my mother was there only child and they provided every year for us food and presents for us
but when her mother died her father never came back to us for forty years so we was in the same boat
as your grt grand mother and because she was well known to be the daughter of these
high society and legal people in the city for generations of her family tree she never put a thing wrong
and she suffered in silence
have a nice donna , best wishes Astonian ;;;;;
 
Hi Astonian, I was just wondering with all you know about Birmingham, do you remember an asian chap called Johnny Mo, he was a bit of a lad about in the 60's and 70's. He had his finger in a lot of pies. My dad used to do a bit for him now and then but i don't know what this bit was. I do remember going to a maisonette in Short Heath Rd and the place was empty except for hundreds of chickens and i mean hundreds of chickens just running about, this would of bin about 1969. When I used to travel round the pubs emptying fruit machines, Johnny Mo had the Rose and Crown, Gravelly Lane. I didnt make myself known to him cos he wouldnt remember me as a little girl and i didnt like to say that my dad used to do for you as im not sure if they fell out or not. I presume Johnny Mo has passed away now but it would be nice to piece together a few of my memories, if you can help. My dad also used to be with Bill Cutler racing, if you know anything abuot that as well. Thanks.
 
I don't remember my Grandad by the way, he & my Nan got divorced in the 70's i think, but she carried on in the same circles/ business & with his family. What was your dads name?
 
Does anyone have any information about Jimmy the Rock Man? He used to be in the Bull Ring, unfortunately I don't know the year.
 
James Guidney or Jemmy the Rockman was a well-known Birmingham character. He was a familiar sight around the streets of Birmingham, selling his home-made cough sweets from a tin canister - I think around the last half of C19th. Jemmy's original tin canister is also in the Bimingham Museum & Art Gallery collection - see https://www.bmagic.org.uk/results?s=+rockman
 
Although there are a number of possible candidates with a casual look at the records, I believe he is captured in the 1851C as a 69 year old "Labourer & Pensioner" from Norfolk, living at 7-Court-8-House Communication Row (between Broad St & Holloway Head), with wife Elizabeth from Brighton 20 years his junior. If so, he dies Oct-Dec 1866.

If anyone has a Findmypast account it would be interesting to see if he has a service record from the Chelsea Pension.

He is still there in 1861C but as Gidney, age 78, no Elizabeth, but with Son James 36 metal Polisher, his wife Charlotte and Jemmy's granddaughter Charlotte

In 1841C James, Elizabeth and son James (Gedney this time) are living in Digbeth near the White Lion (or White Lion Yard?) and is described as a dealer.

I believe there was another son, Charles, who died in infancy and buried 18 Dec 1828 in St. Mary, Birmingham.

I think it likely that James married Elizabeth Pitt in St Martins 05 May 1828, Although Charles was baptised the same day in St Philips and the other son James is older so questionable.
 
Apparently Jemmy's call was ""Composition! For colds and coughs. Composition…." and his patch was around St Philip's.

The "tour of Birmingham's toy-making district as it was on a mid-October Friday in 1829" site https://mises.org/daily/3072 also suggest he was demobbed after the French wars and came to Birmingham in 1825 and was a churchyard fixture until his death in 1866. Can anyone find his Service/Pension record please?
 
Hi, Jimmy the Rockman was my great, great grandfather. I'm in possession of an autobiography he wrote of his exploits abroad, and a few years back was invited to see a display they had of him in the Birmingham Art Gallery. I've come across this post unexpectedly but will get back with any information I have in the next couple of days if it would be of any interest.
 
Welcome to the Forum & this Thread. That'd be fantastically interesting Seratonin - thanks - awaiting expectantly!
 
Welcome seratonin the info would be of great interest to us........we wait with bated breath!
 
I remember this man and his pictures, I cannot remember the name of the place but am sure it was in asquare or at the junction of two places, I also remember my nan saying he was a millionaire, who got other people who did the art? would have been in the sixty's I think.
 
mossq

I think you are right about this man plying his trade in Eden Place at the side of the Council house as I have seen the photo before, but I don't think this is the original gentleman who was a little older than this gentleman and wore a peaked cap and also I think his dog was smaller.

Phil
 
Phil said:
mossq

I think you are right about this man plying his trade in Eden Place at the side of the Council house as I have seen the photo before, but I don't think this is the original gentleman who was a little older than this gentleman and wore a peaked cap and also I think his dog was smaller.

Phil
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Yes Phil we have discussed this photo before the original artist did most of his work with coloured chalks on the pavement slabs.Dek
 
Hi phil and jean
yes they are only rummours about the very old gentleman whom was the only gentleman to be excepted by the council
he was a very old gentle guy ; with is little dog and he wore is old coat and hat in all weathers for many years
i think he was in his eightys i beleive it looked he never had the strengh to stand up all spraweld out
his cap was full to the brim most days of the weeek and he was very popular with the council and the public ;
this old guy was remembered by every body in brum ; and yes jean it was his daughter or i can say it was a familky member
whom was responible for putting his life story of him and is health he never died as a millionare but he made a little comfy for him self
yes he did die eventualy through bad health for being a very artistic artist of what he was and you can find is story by the family in one of the years gone by in the good old sunday mercury and it was a two page centre i think it was and it was in the fiftys
the guy in the car , tryed to try is luck at the game of sketching and try and get a few shilling but he was warned off by council
because it was classed as hawking on the street in those late fiftys after the old gentlman died and because it was a complete mess od scratched chalk nonsence ; thats why they moved him on band stopped it and no one ever moved on his pitch after the dear old gentle mam died if you have time to search the mercury of yester year i think it was around 1958 this article was publishes in the mercury and with his name
he had to be one of only true street and an artist of brum that ever was ;; astonian
 
I know we have had a few "down and outs" and various tramps and vagrants in our city and outer districts, but there were some charachters amongst them. I will start with one that i remember as a kid. Living in Cotteridge (Kings Norton) for a good chunk of my life, i became aware of a guy who pushed a large pram about. He was known as the "Bottle Man". His pram was full of empty pop bottles, and he used to go to various off licences around the area getting the deposit back off the pop bottles. It was around sixpence at the time. He always tipped his hat to the ladies, and was very well known around the area. Sadly he was killed on the Middleton Hall Road in a hit and run in the early seventies. They never caught the driver. There must be plenty more stories of guys similar to this.
 
Off the top of my head, two characters seen in the city centre come to mind - from the 70's I guess

One was a lady with extremely matted long grey hair down her back who used to wander around and the other was a gentleman in a Polish Airman's jacket and cap (so my Dad said it was) who used to busk with a triangle instrument - not played very well!
 
Maybe this man was a 'character' pushing his pram in Green Lane by Eversley Road, Small Heath mid 70s
oldMohawk said:
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Further to starting this thread, a few years after the "bottle man" got killed, another tramp emerged on our patch. His was known as Arthur, and was often seen around the area pushing all his belongings about in a pushchair. His favourite trick was to sit in the doorway of the chipshop opposite the Grant Arms pub at lunchtime, and wouldnt move until the owner had given him a packet of chips. On another occassion i went to see a friend fishing on the canal at Kings Norton, and looked up towards the bridge, and there was Arthur washing some of his clothes in the canal. This was around the mid 80s. He was found dead one cold morning a few years later in some bushes by the canalside.
 
Jeepwolf said:
Further to starting this thread, a few years after the "bottle man" got killed, another tramp emerged on our patch. His was known as Arthur, and was often seen around the area pushing all his belongings about in a pushchair. His favourite trick was to sit in the doorway of the chipshop opposite the Grant Arms pub at lunchtime, and wouldnt move until the owner had given him a packet of chips. On another occassion i went to see a friend fishing on the canal at Kings Norton, and looked up towards the bridge, and there was Arthur washing some of his clothes in the canal. This was around the mid 80s. He was found dead one cold morning a few years later in some bushes by the canalside.
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So sad....
 
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My father returned from Korea war weary. Once a year an army friend of his known only as Wee John came to visit. He always came with chocolate and gifts for all the family. He and my father would sit up for hours through the night talking about their time together. Wee John was a good man, a hard working man, a kind man and a true friend to my father. After his visit of no more than two days, he would go off again until his next visit the following year. As children, my siblings and I never questioned this.
Wee John stopped visiting in about 1962. In 1965 I was walking through town and saw him sitting on a bench. He knew me, I sat with him and chatted and I noticed how shabby he looked and how tired. He never complained about anything and when I had to go he said for me to look after my dad and he would visit again when he could. I tried to give him money for a cup of tea or a bite to eat because It was obvious to the whole world that Wee John was a 'tramp.' He refused.
In fact he was suffering PTSD before we had even heard of it and had been for years. The only stable in his life was my father. Obviously Wee John is at peace now. I just wanted at least this one Tramp to be remembered.
 
Butterfly said:
My father returned from Korea war weary. Once a year an army friend of his known only as Wee John came to visit. He always came with chocolate and gifts for all the family. He and my father would sit up for hours through the night talking about their time together. Wee John was a good man, a hard working man, a kind man and a true friend to my father. After his visit of no more than two days, he would go off again until his next visit the following year. As children, my siblings and I never questioned this.
Wee John stopped visiting in about 1962. In 1965 I was walking through town and saw him sitting on a bench. He knew me, I sat with him and chatted and I noticed how shabby he looked and how tired. He never complained about anything and when I had to go he said for me to look after my dad and he would visit again when he could. I tried to give him money for a cup of tea or a bite to eat because It was obvious to the whole world that Wee John was a 'tramp.' He refused.
In fact he was suffering PTSD before we had even heard of it and had been for years. The only stable in his life was my father. Obviously Wee John is at peace now. I just wanted at least this one Tramp to be remembered.
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what a fitting tribute to wee john butterfly and a good reminder that even in todays society not all less fortunates are in that sad position through choice....thank you

lyn
 
Great post Butterfly, he probably refused your kindnes because he was a proud man. You dont get many true friends, but your Dad had one in Wee John, fantastic story, and may John Rest In Peace.
 
Yes I remember the grey haired lady that use to go round the city center .She use to be always in the Midlands bank doorway that was never used in st Stephenson's street opposite the toilets and phone boxes.We use to see her son talking to her many a time.The story we were told was that she was a teacher and she had a nervous breakdown and she kept all her money strapped to her waistband and she was very pleasant to talk to sometimes.So whenever I see a tramp I always wonder what life they had before and wish myself how lucky I am because it could happen to any of us one day.This was in the late 70s early 80s.
 
there was a man of the rd that was camped on the 446 at coleshill. his name was lorence. he had a few convances as he called them (prams) everyone left him alone.when i was on duty i would spend my dinner break and talking to him. he was worth a few bob,and not a tramp, he told me he was a miner but it was to much so he hit the rd,a very inteligent man.
and quite funny. does anyone else remember him
 
I remember him Pete, many people were fond of him and they had a hut placed behind the hedge on the main road before your get to Balsall common,to keep him warm at night. people would take him dinners and pass the time of day with him.Sadly one. day one of the visitors found that he had passed away.
he was also given food by the Coleshill Hotel kitchen staff.
The Coleshill Hotel in the High Street has a weather vein on the roof in memory of him.
 
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