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Annie Elizabeth Watkins

B

Brockie

Brummie babby
Annie Watkins would have been living in Heneage Street, Aston around the 1890's. She married Gregory Perkins and moved to Hunton Rd Erdijgton. She was my grandma - d 1962 aged 90. Her son Leslie was my dad, born 1900.
I believe she came from.a large family and possibly was a fruit and veg seller on the market.
I know very little about that side of the family and would be interested to learn more.
 
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Ancestry has the wedding details of 22nd August 1897 giving Annie's father as Edward Watkins, a brush maker, deceased at the time of the wedding. Annie's address is 169 Dolman St, and Gregory's is 82 Heneage St. One of the witnesses is Edward John Watkins, perhaps a brother.

From that, I can find the family in the 1891 census living at 80 Arthur St in Bordesley.
Edward snr. the brush maker is aged 50 and a widower. Annie is 18 and has three younger brothers, Ned (14, perhaps the Edward John above), Thomas (10) and George (8). Ned is an errand boy, the other children have no profession listed. All were born in Birmingham.
 
ed.s said:
Ancestry has the wedding details of 22nd August 1897 giving Annie's father as Edward Watkins, a brush maker, deceased at the time of the wedding. Annie's address is 169 Dolman St, and Gregory's is 82 Heneage St. One of the witnesses is Edward John Watkins, perhaps a brother.

From that, I can find the family in the 1891 census living at 80 Arthur St in Bordesley.
Edward snr. the brush maker is aged 50 and a widower. Annie is 18 and has three younger brothers, Ned (14, perhaps the Edward John above), Thomas (10) and George (8). Ned is an errand boy, the other children have no profession listed. All were born in Birmingham.
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Comparing with the 1880 census, the brother I've read as "Ned" above might be Fred, actually.

Here the family is at 148 Hope Street, with mother Jane, aged 39, b. Birmingham. Edward snr's birthplace is given as Evesham, Worcestershire this time. Annie's siblings include the aforementioned Fred (4), an older sister Mary J. (10) and Thomas William (8 months)
 
1871 census has 2 older children.
Edward j born abt 1867 and MaryJ born abt 1870.
Living in Harford Street.
 
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I can't find any baptism records, but have a wedding of Edward Watkins, brush maker, and Jane Rhoda Fullett on 22nd May 1864.
Edward's address is Bell Barn road, and his father is John Watkins, plasterer.
Jane's address is Wrentham street, and her father is Thomas Fullett, a hatter, I think it says.
 
in 1911 annie and husband gregory along with son leslie was living at no 40 hunton road by 1921 they had moved to no 90 hunton road

lyn
 
ed.s said:
Ancestry has the wedding details of 22nd August 1897 giving Annie's father as Edward Watkins, a brush maker, deceased at the time of the wedding. Annie's address is 169 Dolman St, and Gregory's is 82 Heneage St. One of the witnesses is Edward John Watkins, perhaps a brother.

From that, I can find the family in the 1891 census living at 80 Arthur St in Bordesley.
Edward snr. the brush maker is aged 50 and a widower. Annie is 18 and has three younger brothers, Ned (14, perhaps the Edward John above), Thomas (10) and George (8). Ned is an errand boy, the other children have no profession listed. All were born in Birmingham.
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Really interesting information, thanks. Annie sometimes referred to a sister - possibly a half sister. I think her father Edward was married and widowed prior to his marriage to Annie's mother. This sister was only mentioned in 'hushed tones' and appears to have been involved in a scandal with a man called Eric (Cutress?) but no details were discussed. Just 'looks'. Nobody was saying anything in front of me as a child!

It appears that Gregory Perkins did quite well and had what seems to have been a successful business as a carpenter, employing a few local men and engaging my father Leslie as an apprentice at 'Gregory Perkins & Son'. He bought 90 and 92 Hunton Rd Erdington around 1926 when my dad married Irene Hazel, daughter of Arthur Hazel of A. Hazel's undertakers on Erdington High Street.

Gregory died in around 1930. Leslie was no businessman, however, and he sold the firm to Howard Doubleday and his brother Carl.- based in Aston/ Duddeston? They continued to employ him as a salesman.

Annie moved in with Les and Irene after the war and lived with them until her death in 1962. A branch of the family of one if her brothers - a George Watkins, son of another Annie Watkins , formerly Miss Knott, of Acocks Green/ Yardley remained in touch.
 
Astoness said:
in 1911 annie and husband gregory along with son leslie was living at no 40 hunton road by 1921 they had moved to no 90 hunton road

lyn
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Thanks for this - I didnt realise they'd lived in another part of Hunton Road before buying and living at 90. They.must have bought 92 in 1927 when their son got married. Much appreciated!
 
Brockie said:
Thanks for this - I didnt realise they'd lived in another part of Hunton Road before buying and living at 90. They.must have bought 92 in 1927 when their son got married. Much appreciated!
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so they lived at no 40 no 90 and no 92 is this correct....if so all 3 houses are still there

lyn
 
Astoness said:
so they lived at no 40 no 90 and no 92 is this correct....if so all 3 houses are still there

lyn
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They certainly moved out of Aston and rarely referred to having lived there. I imagine they initially rented No 40 and bought No 90 - saved up, probably. Then when all the Hazel sons married and were bought houses around the 1920's. In those days, the daughters didnt get the same treatment 'because they would only get married'. So Gregory Perkins bought No 92 for his son.

After the war, 90 and 92 were rented out and the rents collected by an agent. As they were old properties by the 1960s the rent they brought in barely covered the repairs. I inherited them in 1984 but the leases had almost run out and the leaseholder was asking more than they were worth for the freeholds so I. sold them. I made £3.000 for both after fees.They are still there, I'm sure - although its very different there now to the 1920's!
 
Brockie - you suggest Edward was married before he married Annie's mother Jane - on his marriage cert he declares he is a bachelor,
This doesn'rt mean there wasn't another child but I haven't found an earlier marriage.
All the children seem to be registered with mmn Tullett (the marriage to Jane Rhoda Tullett in 1864)

Thought you might like this - baptism of Leslie
Baptised at St James Ashted
1770036708821.png

He is also on the censuses and 1939 register.
 
pjmburns said:
Brockie - you suggest Edward was married before he married Annie's mother Jane - on his marriage cert he declares he is a bachelor,
This doesn'rt mean there wasn't another child but I haven't found an earlier marriage.
All the children seem to be registered with mmn Tullett (the marriage to Jane Rhoda Tullett in 1864)

Thought you might like this - baptism of Leslie
Baptised at St James Ashted
View attachment 218059

He is also on the censuses and 1939 register.
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Thanks for this! A Jim Perkins - some distant cousin, probably- contacted my dad Leslie back in the 1980s for information about a 'family tree' he was compiling. Dad met up with him but wasn't able to help much. Jim P sent him some photos of the house in Aston with my dad as an infant around 2 years old in 1902. These. and Jim's 'tree' got lost in a house move. Wish I'd kept them, or stayed in touch with Jim - who would have been around 40 at the time so.may be no longer with us. Thanks again!
 
pjmburns said:
Brockie - you suggest Edward was married before he married Annie's mother Jane - on his marriage cert he declares he is a bachelor,
This doesn'rt mean there wasn't another child but I haven't found an earlier marriage.
All the children seem to be registered with mmn Tullett (the marriage to Jane Rhoda Tullett in 1864)

Thought you might like this - baptism of Leslie
Baptised at St James Ashted
View attachment 218059

He is also on the censuses and 1939 register.
Click to expand...
One more mystery. If Annie Elizabeth married in 1897, she would have been around 27, and a mother three years later. She didn't work when they were in Hunton Rd - she employed a woman , a Mrs Bourne , who did the 'rough work' in the house - although the family said Annie was often dissatisfied with her work and often 'showed her how to do.it properly ' !

Prior to her marriage, her story was that she worked 'on the market' selling fruit and veg and that they 'had a stall' Her tales of the less than legal 'black market' shenanigans, and the mischievous throwing about of produce at the end of the day, and the indiscipline and pranks, had a ring of truth, but I can't figure out when in her life she'd worked there - if ever!- and which market it was.

The cousin (?) George Watkins, son of another Annie nee Knott , worked on the Smithfield and appeared to have a wholesale fruit stall, possibly of his own, until he retired in the 1970s. Then he went in every day doing sweeping up for Fyffes and other stallholders. He lived at 9, Blakemere Avenue Yardley. He died in about 1982 His wife Pat and son Christopher are deceased.

At what point Annie would have worked on a stall is very unclear!

Bless you for your diligent interest in this.
 
pjmburns said:
I will double check the census entries but if she worked or "helped out" between census years it might be hard to check.
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i couldnt find any evidence of working on the markets on any census years jan...as you say if she did it could have been between the census years

lyn
 
Frederick Watkins had a fruit /vegetable stall in Smithfield Market in the 1890s up till at least 1921, but there was no Watkins stall in 1932
 
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