• Welcome to this forum . We are a worldwide group with a common interest in Birmingham and its history. While here, please follow a few simple rules. We ask that you respect other members, thank those who have helped you and please keep your contributions on-topic with the thread.

    We do hope you enjoy your visit. BHF Admin Team
  • HI folks the server that hosts the site completely died including the Hdd's and backups.
    Luckily i create an offsite backup once a week! this has now been restored so we have lost a few days posts.
    im still fixing things at the moment so bear with me and im still working on all images 90% are fine the others im working on now
    we are now using a backup solution

Telephone history: Telephone Service in Birmingham

:D I remember that we had a long wait to get a phone line from the GPO in the late sixties - just like the Quinton girl in the video post-1. When it finally did arrive, it was provided as a shared line with a neighbour across the road. If I remember right we could listen in to their conversations and they could listen into ours. Not sure if it was all the time or only when it rained...
 
We had a telephone line in the early sixties as well, that was number 3 in your pictures and was black, it also was a shared line and it was connected to Castle Bromwich, I don't think there was much choice on type of phone then, you got what you were given, further to my comment earlier, this must make Castle Bromwich, CAS the first exchange, your comment about Broadband speeds rings true as I am still connected to Castle Bromwich which is a fair distance away, plus we on the Vale cannot have cable as it was never laid on the Estate, I wonder why
 
hi mike
yes I remember our vacum, an ancient "Goblin" which you needed to empty every 1/2 hour, our dad used to say he could suck up more dust with his mouth.
paul
 
Aiden, as a retired Telephone engineer I can tell you it was quite normal to hear each party on a shared line, it often caused friction. Also when work was carried out on the cable, if the line got "reversed" when you dialled the one party it rang the other, and when one party made a call it registered on the others exchange meter - more friction!!!! its only advantage was a lower line rental. They were slowly phased phased out as more cables were laid. Could have been worse, in some parts of rural America they had up to ten parties sharing one line !!! Eric
 
I have had a look for Mr Piercy and found the following infomation. I have given first the engineer info, then gone back to his presumed antecedents.
There was a Joseph Piercy (mentioned at the end), with a frying pan etc factory in Newhall St. I have a hunch (only) that he may be the father of Ebenezer, who started off as a drawing master , then went into estate agency, and later brought his (presumed) son Ebenezer Camden Piercy into the business. I assume, from what was said previously that he is the father of Henry James Taylor Piercy. But there was also a Henry Ebenezer Piercy ,( and possibly another Henry, but that does not seem clear).
The firm started as Piercy & Pearson (as already mentioned)at 29 Broad st, changed to pearcy & co, an then moved up Broad st a little between 1873 & 1876 (numbering changed at this time also). I attach maps (from OS 1890) showing the position of the two factories.. They expanded up Oozells st in the early 1880s (the early factory was on the corner of Oozells st). The factory marked is around 1890, but it expanded further down Oozells St. It remained of similar size and purpose till 1921, though a valuation business was also built up. However between 1921 and 1932 it seems to have changed direction and from that year concentarted on machinary valuation and planishing (?) hammer manufacture

From directories:

Engineers
Engineers not mentioned 1862
1867-1868
Piercy & Pearson, engineers & machinists, 29 Broad st. Islington
Piercy Mrs.. home: 11 Legge lane
1872
Pierey & Co. engineers & machinists, 29 Broad st. Islington
Piercy Henry, home: 77 Albion street
Piercy Mrs.home: 11 Legge lane
1873
Piercy &Co. engineers, machinists and tool makers, Minerva works, 29 Broad street, Islington
Piercy Henry, engineer, 77 Albion street
Piercy Henry James Taylor (P. & Co.) home: Camden hill
Piercy Henry Ebenezer engineer (P. & Co.) ; home: Camden house ,Legge Lane-
Numbering of Broad st changed between 1873 & 1876
1876
Piercy & Co. engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street
( Piercey Henry,home: 53 Pershore road. Not sure if is misspelling, but probably not ours)

1878-1880
Piercy & Co. engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street
Piercy Henry. James Tavlor, home: Kingston lodge, Edgbaston road
1883-1892
Piercy & Co. engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street & 60, 61 & 62 Oozells street; & ironfounders, 42 & 43 Oozells street
Piercy Henry. James Tavlor, home: Kingston lodge, Edgbaston road
1895-1897
Piercy & Co. engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street & ironfounders, Oozells street
Piercy Henry. James Tavlor, home: The Laurels , Wake Green Road, Moseley
1899
Piercy & Co. engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street & ironfounders, 40, 41,42,43 Oozells street
Piercy Henry. James Tavlor, home: The Laurels , Wake Green Road, Moseley
1900-1908
Piercy Henry J. T. & Son, valuers, 53 & 54 Broad street. T A " Piercy;" T W 20 Central
Piercy & Co. Limited,, engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street' & iron founders, 40, 41, 42 & 43 Oozells street. T A "•Piercy ; " T N 20 Central
Piercy Henry James Tavlor, home: The Laurels , Wake Green Road, Moseley
1912-1921
Piercy Henry J. T. & Son, valuers, 53 & 54 Broad street. T A " Piercy;" T W 20 Central
Piercy & Co. Limited,, engineers, 53 & 54 Broad street' & iron founders, 40, 41, 42 & 43 Oozells street. T A "•Piercy ; " T N 20 Central
1932
Piercy Hy. J. T. & Son, machnry. valuers, 42-43 Oozells st. T A "Piercy;" TN Midland 6521 .
Piercy &. Co.'Ltd. planishing hammer mfrs. 40-43 Oozells st.T A " Pieroy ;" TN Midland 6521



Estate Agency

1855
Piercy Mr. E, home:. Legg's lane
Piercy Mr. E. , home:77 Albion street

1858
Piercy, Ebeneezer, home : Albion St

1862
Piercy, Ebeneezer (EP & Son) home :77 Albion St
Piercy Ebeneezer Camden, (EP & Son) home: Camden Hill

1867-1868
Piercy Ebenezer Camden, home the Hermitage, Hagley Road
1872-1908
Piercy Ebenezer Camden; home: Tame Valley house, Hampstead

1823
Piercy Ebenezer., drawing master, 3 Brittle st
1829-1833
Piercy Ebenezer., drawing master, Brittle st (off snow hill)
1839
Piercy Ebenezer., drawing master, 29 Hall St
1841-1845
Piercy Ebenezer, drawing master, 29 Newhall St

1849-1858
Piercy Ebenezer, estate agent, 30 Bennetts Hill

1862-1878
Piercy Ebenezer &Son, estate agents, 30 Bennetts Hill
1872-1880
Piercy Ebenezer &Son, estate agents, 1 Cherry street


1883-1897
Piercy Ebenezer & Son, house & estate agents, 7 Cherry st
1899- 1903
Piercy Ebenezer & Son, house & estate agents, 19 New Hall St
1904-1908
Piercy Ebenezer & Son, house & estate agents, 26 Temple St
After this an Ernest E. Piercy , estate agent does appear., at a different address.

There were other Piercy’s, presumably related, including a greengrocer, tobacconist, bookbinder and a military ornament gilder.

In 1815-1833 there was :
Piercy Joseph, manufacturer of spades, shovels, frying pans, and edge tools in general, steel toys, hammers,,&.c, &c. New hall-street.
I suspect he was the father of Ebenezer (his factory being in Newhall St)

Mike

broad_st_c1890_site_of_piercy_pre_1873.jpg


broad_st_c_1890Piercy_works_around_1890.jpg
 
Mike, I'd never heard of a planishing hammer either. Here's a couple of definitions, courtesy of the Oxford English Dictionary (second edition, 1989) :):

planishing hammer: a hammer with polished slightly convex faces, used for planishing sheet-metal.
planish: to flatten (sheet-metal or metal-ware) on an anvil by blows of a smooth-faced hammer, or by rubbing a flat-ended tool over the surface.
 
bobbyb said:
... this must make Castle Bromwich, CAS the first exchange...
Click to expand...

Well bobbyb I am sure from that info that CAS was one of the earliest Exchanges in the area but is not mentioned in connection with the early Midland Co growth (such as Aston, Jewellery Quarter, etc). As Castle Brom was (surprisingly) not included within the boundaries of Birmingham until 1931 then perhaps it was operated initially by the Provincial Co? :010:
 
There's some information about Joseph Piercy (perhaps H J T Piercy's grandfather) in the London Gazette:

7 July 1801: promoted from Quarter-Master-Serjeant (sic) to Quarter-Master. [This may not be our Joseph Piercy.]
27 November 1802: another army notice re Quarter-Master Joseph Piercy.
20 February 1810: partnership with James Easthope as steel toy-makers dissolved by mutual consent.
26 July 1823: partnership with Richard Saunders as edge-tool-makers dissolved by mutual consent.
1823-1826: several entries referring to bankruptcy proceedings against Joseph Piercy and Richard Saunders. [They appear to have "met all requirements".]

We are still no closer to discovering how mechanical engineer H J T Piercy became Birmingham's pioneer telephone entrepreneur. There's a story just waiting to be discovered there!
 
I agree Thylacine.

But thanks very much to Mike for the extensive info. If there is a relative of Piercy on the Forum they will have a lot to go on (and hopefully more on his telephone service career).

Thanks Mike for the maps too. I see that the works were opposite what is now the church of Flares Nightclub (one of my fave haunts when I get back to the smoke). I think the Presbyterians would have approved of the historical surrounds more than the current! https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&...jylpdHWN6XZOyoAeenfOA&cbp=12,306.09,,0,-20.75
 
Its funny that we nearly all remember old telephone numbers, but when asked for our own and someone elses mobile numbers we havent got a clue. Is it age??
 
Hi Carolynn I think age may play a part (hippocampus deterioration, relative loss of neurons, decreased blood flow) as do the amount of other health-affecting vices :puppyeyes:. However, I think i read somewhere that although the brain can remember up to 7 things with concentration and repeating, it is happier with 3 or 4. So remembering HAR-234 is easier than 4271234 and certainly a lot easier than the 11 digits of a mobile phone
 
Aidan, as a matter of general reference, I found an e-book of the article "Telephone - Commercial Aspects" from Encyclopaedia Britannica (1911). It is written by none other than British Electric Traction Co Ltd supremo Emile Oscar Garcke, and it gives a very detailed chronology, but sadly :( there's no mention of Birmingham or Piercy.
 
Thylacine, thanks for this, it is a good write-up (of course) on the general history, although anything outside of London is dismissed as "the provinces". A fascinating cross-over with BET (what were they eating/drinking/smoking?)

I love the old wiring diagrams from the PO Electrical Engineers Journal and I must get one framed as art work (getting permission to hang it may be more problematic!), possibly one of the 746 Telephone.

The Timeline gives fascinating detail about the obstructionist behaviour of the Post Office which really seems to have set back the development. Even more reason to celebrate our Piercy!
 
Yes, "the provinces" (strange expression since Britain never really had them). But so is Brum dismissed by many a high-handed Londoner. Garcke himself, though "king of tramways" and raking in the loot from the Midlands and further north, was based in Berkshire (I wonder if he joined the hunt?) and moved in "London circles". What did they eat / drink / smoke? Ground up municipal tramways! ;)
 
Mike Fisher said:
Joined GPO Telephones 3 Sep 1962 signed official secret act over a stamp. Made reduntant from BT 30 Sep 1995. Spent 27 (1965 to 1992) years on Strowger exchange maintenance at Springfield Telephone Exchange ,Stratford Rd, Hall Green
Click to expand...

Pam, this quote from Mike Fisher's earlier post answers your question.
 
Thylacine said:
Mike, I'd never heard of a planishing hammer either. Here's a couple of definitions, courtesy of the Oxford English Dictionary (second edition, 1989) :):

planishing hammer: a hammer with polished slightly convex faces, used for planishing sheet-metal.
planish: to flatten (sheet-metal or metal-ware) on an anvil by blows of a smooth-faced hammer, or by rubbing a flat-ended tool over the surface.
Click to expand...
Panel Beaters used to use Planishing Hammers possibly still do, my Father used to use a set to take out dents in Cars, they came in a variety of heads and were used with formers to take out dents and what was left was filled with lead and smoothed out prior to painting, seems only used with panels that could be taken off.
 
Aiden,when I left the RAF and joined PO Tephones in 1956 to get promotion to Technical officers grades you needed City and Guilds qualifications, whilst I was studying at evening classes I was advised to purchase 2 books, Telephony volume 1 (theory) and volume 2 (practical) bt J Atkinson, volume one is full of the wiring digrams you like so much, Purchaed in 1956 and I still have them, now 54 years old. Spent 31 years wit company, took early retirement shortly after they were privatised
Eric
 
Last edited:
BobbyB - you are certainly right there. I have wealded a few in my time and my Gramps whole career was as a retrousse art metal worker (didn't pay too well so then worked at the Austin - I can see a few hammers in the pic but not any Planishing ones sadly). Veering badly off topic now....

So thanks Eric for bringing us back "on line" haha. They were published by Pitman and there are two versions - the pre-war edition was by Herbert and Procter, whereas the post-war revision was by Atkinson. They are all out of print of course.... Now if you had access to a scanner you could share one of the wiring beauties with the rest of the Forum without fear of licence issues. Can I suggest the telephone (guess 706 in the post-war volume?) and perhaps Dial Tone? Meanwhile if anyone finds similar on eBooks please let us know!
 
Not quite the same, but evocative and the best I have access to - The training manuals for the 746 and Extention Plan 1A (for those that wanted one in the bedroom, so to speak)
 
Aidan said:
Not quite the same, but evocative and the best I have access to - The training manuals for the 746 and Extention Plan 1A
Click to expand...

Mouth-watering diagrams, Aidan! Not quite on topic, but I went through an electronics craze in my teens: I remember listening to Radio Luxembourg on a little transistor radio I actually assembled myself (probably a Sinclair). No printed circuits in those days of course: lots of soldering and screwdriver work. And the transistors were big. I used to love the colour codes on the resistors and take pride in being able to decipher them (couldn't do it today!). I've long been a sucker for a circuit diagram!
 
Aidan said:
B

So thanks Eric for bringing us back "on line" haha. They were published by Pitman and there are two versions - the pre-war edition was by Herbert and Procter, whereas the post-war revision was by Atkinson. They are all out of print of course.... Now if you had access to a scanner you could share one of the wiring beauties with the rest of the Forum without fear of licence issues. Can I suggest the telephone (guess 706 in the post-war volume?) and perhaps Dial Tone? Meanwhile if anyone finds similar on eBooks please let us know!
Click to expand...

Hi Aidan,

I wonder if the Atkinson books are actually in the same format as the Herbert and Proctors of the 1930s. I have the second edition of Volume 1 (1934) Manual Switching Systems and Line Plant, and the 1939 reprint of the 1938 1st edition of Volume 2, titled Automatic
Telephony, so it would appear that the second volume was added with the introduction of
the later technology. I also have the matching volume 'Telegraphy', 5th Edition 1930,
which is accredited to Herbert only, Similar thickness, but a slightly smaller volume.
The original edition of this was 1906. . I was lucky to acquire these some years ago, and prize them very much.

Kind regards

Dave
 
Thylacine - I have a deep respect for the cleverness of modern electronics but I agree that unless you can see the component unaided and solder it or screw it to something else then it kinda loses me. The circuit/wiring diagram I attached had it's own "feel" too, I guess from the unusual typeface/font. The ones in the Journal and books of the time, if my memory serves, had their own characteristic look which I am eager to see again.

Dave89 - It would be great if you could scan one of the diagrams and share it here also. Then maybe we can do a comparison between Herbert/Proctor and Atkinson. I noticed that eBay and similar have single volumes going for £60!

Similarly I am sure the old PO Journals must have replicated some of these more simpler diagrams, so if anyone has a copy please do post.

Bren - "Dolls-eye" indicators - brilliant. I assume that is your good self acting as the good operator at https://penroom.co.uk There is a useful and entertainingly written overview of this type of board at https://www.johnhearfield.com/Telephone/CBS2.htm with some diagrams of the dolls-eye relays and Circuit diagrams after Telephony (Vol 1), Herbert & Proctor (1932) - be nice to compare with scan of originals.

I like the line at the end "The operator clears the call by unplugging the cord, and goes back to day-dreaming about the handsome young technician who keeps coming round to dust the relays ..." My excuses centred around fixing her rolling dolls-eyes or changing her cords - don't think those lines would work now.....
 
Hi Mike

I read that you had worked at the Springfield Telephone Exchange, Stratford Road, Hall Green and just wondered whether the telephone exchange still exists and where on the Stratford Road it is situated. Is it close to Wickes or Somerfield or is it further towards Birmingham centre? Look forward to your reply. My husband & I have been having a discussion as to which part of the Stratford Road was referred to as Springfield. Can anyone help?

All the best Pam
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top