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National Service

When I got out of the army Dave, I joined the "Full bore club", here in Cambridge, it was based at Waterbeach Barracks, in the days before Dumblane, and Hungerford, I had a firearms cert, and kept 2 handguns, one was a 1911, American Military Ordnance, Colt .45, the other a Russian STAR, 9mm. Both good hand guns and fairly accurate, they were both made for close quarter fighting, the colt for trench warfare WW1, and the STAR, for urban street fighting. I must say though, with all your military knowledge and experience you will already know this, and don't want to try and teach anyone. Just getting back to National Service though a lot of the member's were University bods many of whom had been National Servicemen, and had either stayed with the University OCTU, or TA, and were dam fine shots. Some of the older members had German Schmeisser Auto, and Lebel rifles, and Walther and luger pistols which they had brought home with them from the war, we all got to fire them, funniest pistol was an American Remington 5 shot .32,which an old guy , ex-aircrew had carried right through the war, for personal protection. Paul
 
Just catching up on things after a couple days away. With reply to post 998,while doing my n/s i was a P.T.I at Hillsea baracks at Portsmouth 1954-1956.

I had the privileged to have had two of the countriesgreatest footballers in my squad for physicle training during thier 6 weeks basic training befor they were posted to carry on thier football carrier. Iam talking about Bobby Charlton and Duncan Edwards, at the time Bobby had only played in the old Central League
at that time, but we all know of the history since
 
I had two hero's when was young Stan Mathews and Duncan Edwards, Like many I was devastated when he was killed, never supported Man Unt but he played for England as well, mus6t have been a great honour for you when ever you saw him later in life.
 
When I was on signals training at Rhyl, in 1959, a bunch of us were returning from leave one night, on the train that ran from New St.
Having nodded off we were rudely awakened by a British Rail bod, telling us that we'd missed getting off at Rhyl and were at Abergele.
We all clattered out of the station in a panic and a bus driver who was passing spotted us and pulled up.
We got to Rhyl bus station just in time to catch the last bus back to Kinmel Park camp.
If that driver hadn't stopped,bless him, we'd have been faced with a six mile walk.
I think people were more helpful in those days.
 
Two other who i forgot who were both P.T.Is in the gym with me through my n/s days are Andy Key who played rugby league for Workington and England and footballer Dereck Mayers who was a professional for Everton,he then went on to play for Preston and Bury. He was always good for a free ticket when he came to the midlands to play. Andy passed away a couple of years ago and is now missed when we manage to meet up with other lads who served there time in the gym.
 
Paul, I cannot remember if I have told this story before, I was on the ranges with R.E lads, most had been in 18 months and were seasoned soldiers, they were doing their tests on the .303. The officer asked me to have a look at one of the lads as he could not hit the target at 100 yds, magpies high, very high. I lay down along side him and viewed his position from the side, right, take aim at the target and hold that position, I thought there was something wrong with me as the weapon seemed to be pointing up in the air,"Are you looking at the top of the foresight"?" Yes corporal""Are you looking through the hole in the back sight? He immediately drew his head away from the back sight to see where I was pointing. "No corporal" "So where are you looking?" " Off the top". Have you ever been able to hit the target in the time you have been in."No corporal" nobody ever shown you where you were going wrong, No, Right put your mag in and set the rear sight then put me five rounds in the target. guess what five rounds almost all in the same hole a I" groupe . I felt good!!
Another lad I had who was slightly cross eyed but by gum could he groupe five rounds.

Dave
 
Sounds as if you were dam fine full-screw Dave, I am sure somewhere there are some old lads who remember you well, that feeling of glowing confidence when your lads did well is something you wont forget ever, even now with knackered knees and bad hips when ever I watch "The Troop", and the (Parade Major,, 'That's him alone on the horse at the beginning' ) screams "PARADE", I get the hairs on my neck get stiff and I nearly still stand to attention, it will never fade. Paul
 
I Can understand how you feel,Paul, you have been there and the atmosphere. it all comes back to you. Good memories .We all get them from different things, I am half Welsh and everytime I cross over the border into Wales I get them as well. We are funny animals!!!
That's what the army was all about, teaching young lads how to live the army way and survive if ever called into action.
Here is a good one, "Were you tidy before you joined up and if you were not, did any of the tidyness rub off and now do you always keep things in order so that you can find them. If you all remember your wardrobe had to be set out in a certain way with everthing neatly laid out, is it still like that, be honest
Dave
 
I sure am Dave,things in my draws still all folded square, wouldn't dream of going out with polishing my shoes etc, probably nearly every one on this site too. paul
 
Listening to you guys, from a past generation, who put on the uniform as a Regular/N/S, is really absorbing. Your memories and actions seem to flood back as if they happened yesterday. It must have been really rough for the guys who in earlier threads described how some of their mates got it during their tour of duty in Aden, Palestine, Malaya, Cyprus, Africa (Mau Mau etc....) Northern Ireland. Also losing mates during accidents/road. I just had to get this off my chest.
Thanks
 
thecaptain51 said:
Listening to you guys, from a past generation, who put on the uniform as a Regular/N/S, is really absorbing. Your memories and actions seem to flood back as if they happened yesterday. It must have been really rough for the guys who in earlier threads described how some of their mates got it during their tour of duty in Aden, Palestine, Malaya, Cyprus, Africa (Mau Mau etc....) Northern Ireland. Also losing mates during accidents/road. I just had to get this off my chest.
Thanks
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You forgot to mention the action in the NAAFI Captain. Friday/ Saturday night, The Irish, Welsh & Scots would be singing about how much they miss their beloved country, & then just before closing time the inevitable punch ups, tho they were mostly broken up before anyone got seriously hurt. I was stationed in Rheindalen & just across from our billet was a large esablishment we called the "Joss house" for the use of the Germans & Jugoslavs who worked for the British army & even tho it was out of bounds to us, we still used the place most nights. The Germans & Jugoslavs never caused any bother, but you would get the odd Brit who after a couple of "sherberts" wanted to fight everyone in the place. What is wrong with us Brits who want to cause trouble after a few drinks?
 
I Know the Big House well at JHQ Rhinedahlen, and the Blue Pool Club, the Cinema and the "Police Station" all on Queens Avenue, lived in Monchengladbach for a while too.
 
Smudge, talking of the N.A.A.F.I. the first morning after joining the camp we all ended up in the Naf for tea and buns when a lad got on the Piano and started rattling the keys, he was playing music that was not so popular to the day and when requested to play up to date ones he woujd not.maybe he did not know any others. A Sgt came into the Naafi and spoke to him as he was getting some bad banter from the lads, we never saw him again. I recon he never did any training and went to work in the Sgt mess entertaining them and their wives in the evenings.
Dave
 
paul stacey said:
I Know the Big House well at JHQ Rhinedahlen, and the Blue Pool Club, the Cinema and the "Police Station" all on Queens Avenue, lived in Monchengladbach for a while too.
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I was in Rheindahlen for 18 monthe & never ventured up to the big house ( HQ?) Not familiar with the blue pool club either. I used the cinema a few times, but as i was a good boy i kept away from the police stn. I occasionally drove the big chiefs ( Gen. Stirling?) wife who suffered badly with arthritus. I had to address her as "My Lady" The house where the General lived was guarded by Jugoslavs & the first time i went there, the driver who i was standing in for, thought it would be funny to omit a vital piece of info, flash your headlights as you approach the guard. I didn`t flash & this guy stood in front of the car with rifle raised. I can`t think why everyone at the house thought it was funny! My memory is crap, but was there a few shops somewhere on the main drag? I think i can remember buying my girlfriend a watch, & there was a pub with a Mynah bird in a cage outside that used to have a foul mouth!
 
I don't know when you were there Smudger, I am talking the early seventy's, there was allsorts, Italian Airforce, Dutch and Belgian army Danish, and Norwegian forces, even a small contingent of Russkys I believe. The Blue Pool was a RAF club, it had 3 bars and a small swimming pool any ranks and affiliation could use it, it was facing the car park, opposite to the cinema and adjacent to the cop shop, can't remember the pub with parrot though. good luck.
 
It wasn't all polishing, cleaning, and marching - we eventually did what we had been trained for, working on aircraft. On completion of work or preflight checks on aircraft, RAF Form 700 (log book) had to be signed to verify you had worked correctly. In the event of a problem in flight or in the worst case a crash, the F700 would be impounded and locked away for an inquiry. On the start of a working day I would take a tool kit from stores and the tools in it would have an identifying number etched on them and if one was found left inside an aircraft very big trouble would result. You soon learnt to work exactly as laid down in the manual for a particular aircraft and checked all tools were back in the your tool kit on completion of the job.

I didn't realise it at the time but it was good training for when I completed my two years NS and returned to continue my engineering career.
 
paul stacey said:
I don't know when you were there Smudger, I am talking the early seventy's, there was allsorts, Italian Airforce, Dutch and Belgian army Danish, and Norwegian forces, even a small contingent of Russkys I believe. The Blue Pool was a RAF club, it had 3 bars and a small swimming pool any ranks and affiliation could use it, it was facing the car park, opposite to the cinema and adjacent to the cop shop, can't remember the pub with parrot though. good luck.
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I was there summer 63 to Dec 65 & then the worst posting of my life, N/Ireland. I really enjoyed Rheindahlen, just a small unit, so small we used to struggle to put together a footie & cricket team. If i remember right, we never won a match despite having a fantastic goalie & a couple of Germans playing for us. Never ventured into Monchengladbach, the army wouldn`t lend me a staff car for a night out:-{ As for the mynah bird it was probably dead by the time you were there.
 
Eddie 14 said:
Smudge, talking of the N.A.A.F.I. the first morning after joining the camp we all ended up in the Naf for tea and buns when a lad got on the Piano and started rattling the keys, he was playing music that was not so popular to the day and when requested to play up to date ones he woujd not.maybe he did not know any others. A Sgt came into the Naafi and spoke to him as he was getting some bad banter from the lads, we never saw him again. I recon he never did any training and went to work in the Sgt mess entertaining them and their wives in the evenings.
Dave
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Dave, it certainly helped if you had some sort of talent in the army, musical instrument or in my case boxing. In Yeovil If you signed up for the boxing & were any good you got well looked after. Unfortunately i wasn`t as good as i thought i was & after a few good hidings i gave it up.
 
The good thing about NS men was the fact that a lot of them were tradesmen in civilian life.
The Geordie in charge of our battery charging shop, for example, was also a skilled signwriter. We had bricklayers, painters and decorators, the list goes on. The point is these men were able to take on little jobs that came up, (vehicle signage for example) as part of their everyday duties.
Our Pay Corporal used to lend our Battery Commander books on physics !
 
#1040, that sounds rather dangerous to me, let a bunch of NS oyks, free on expensive government machinery I am glad I wasn't a pilot.paul
 
Baz, me being attached to the infantry I saw most of them come in when 18 with, say, only three years training in their job in civvy st. I did not go in until I was 21 and a fully qualified engineer. It would have been a waste of 5 years training if I had not gone into some trade where I could use my engineering background.I am not saying that the Wilts lads were not into engineering but there were a lot who worked on the land and all who did join at 18 were not in a trade where they could get deferred. Also maybe there was an attraction as they were in the county where they lived and it was easy for them to get home, not like me. I don't think I would have joined the infantry if given that choice but each to his own. I wanted to use my hands during the day day not my feet. I will probabaly get some stick over this one, SORRY!!!!
Dave
 
paul stacey said:
#1040, that sounds rather dangerous to me, let a bunch of NS oyks, free on expensive government machinery I am glad I wasn't a pilot.paul
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In fact, if you were a pilot there was just a chance, in the 1950s, that you were yourself a National Service one. A few, a very few, were taken on as aircrew, lucky blighters. Your own Meteor must have been quite a bird-puller.

Chris
 
paul stacey said:
#1040, that sounds rather dangerous to me, let a bunch of NS oyks, free on expensive government machinery I am glad I wasn't a pilot.paul
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A tale of NS and Regulars on an RAF base.
I was a NS Junior Technician with a year to do and quite friendly with a Regular Junior Technician who was in for 12 years. He was promoted to Corporal Technician which was fair enough, it was his career. He was a decent type but after promotion became slightly power mad! I went with him one day to carry out an instrument check on a newly installed altimeter. We had a test machine which applied a vacuum from outside the aircraft to the pipework going to the altimeter, and watched a needle on a gauge to see if there were any leaks. The needle did not move so there were no leaks, and I said I would just go up into the aircraft to see the reading on the altimeter but to my surprise he 'pulled rank' and told me not to do it. I obeyed orders and we went to sign the F700, but still in a 'pulling rank' mood he signed right across in my space on the form and I could not sign. Later the aircraft took off and a rather worried pilot discovered he had no height reading on the altimeter. Luckily it was a clear day and the skilled pilot somehow managed to land it.
I was new from training and knew the Air Publication (manual) stated that the rubber pipe could be kinked and blocked during installation in the confined space and although there would be no leaks, the drop in air pressure as the aircraft climbed would not reach the altimeter. At the inquiry an officer asked me what had happened and why had I not signed the F700. I told him the facts about the situation and the officer quietly discussed it and accepted my account. I was very lucky because if I had signed the F700 things could have been bad for me. The newly promoted Corporal only received a reprimand and we remained friendly and discussing the situation he admitted he had learnt a valuable lesson and became the reasonable bloke he had been before he was promoted. We became a good team working together.
 
ChrisM, I was RAF aircrew (wireless operator) for most of my service from Jun 1948 to Jun 1956 and I have never met any National service aircrew, they would hardly have time to do the training before demob, particularly pilot or navigator, and wireless op and flight engineer was well over a year. Are you getting confused with the University Air Squadron members who were already pilots when they entered for their Nat Service. Eric
 
I could think of nothing more irrisistible in the 1950's than being "air crew" Chris, a great bird puller. It never failed to strike me as a serviceman, that no matter how much you did, and how hard you worked, there was always more to learn anew each and every day. Joking aside Oldmohawk, thank God I never had to carry the amount of responsibility, that you young lads had to carry, and in the main discharged very successfully .
 
Eric,

You had me worried for a moment. I was sure I had known someone in the 1950s who was a NS pilot (AND he had a Triumph TR2 which made the eyes even greener!) but I might have remembered incorrectly. But no, if one does a bit of googling on the subject there are a number of references to NS aircrew, including pilot, navigator and air signaller, flying in different types including Vampires and Meteors. Norman Tebbitt might have been one of them.

Despite the length of training (possibly shorter than Russian language courses) it seems as though the Government thought it worthwhile in those times to build up a reserve of trained people in the event of emergency. Even in lowlier trades most of us were on some sort of reserve or other for years. Pilot reserves might well have been thought particularly important in view of the dreadful rate of attrition among serving pilots on Meteors in particular.

Chris
 
The nearest I get to aircrew is a flight simulator in my desktop computer. Very realistic with real time scenery, interact with air traffic control, other aircraft flying around, waiting in the queue to take off, push back from the gate ... and much more. I fly a Boeing 737 but three out of ten of my landings at London Heathrow would be 'breaking news' on TV, but it is good fun and keeps my old brain active ... :friendly_wink:
 
Same as me oldMohawk, use it most days, when a little bored take off from Munich, and fly a "Douglas DC3", across the Alps to Milan, Magical.
 
ChrisM, You are probably correct, my first Squadron was 82PR based in Africa, a Lancaster Squadron on aerial survey duties, mapping the British colonies in 1949/51 and most of the crews seemed to have been ex wartime bods who had decided to stay in the RAF when the war was over (no NS there) , a mixture of NCO's and commissioned officers. Incidently it was the last Lancaster Sqdn in RAF service. Happy days. Eric
 
Hi Cookie, when in Africa, did you know a Ron Madison? He was a mate of mine, no longer with us.
He flew in that PR Squadron.
 
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