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LONGMORE Lookup Please

sospiri

sospiri

GONE BUT NOT FORGOTTEN
Emma LONGMORE reputedly born 26 September 1846 and Henry LONGMORE reputedly born 8 September 1853

These two children of James and Mary LONGMORE appear in a family Bible, but not on any GRO Births or Deaths, nor any Census, nor on Key Hill or Warstone Lane burials indexes. Their five elder siblings were all christened at St Martin. Can someone kindly check whether there are any christenings or burials for these two around the relevant dates please? Many thanks in advance,

Maurice
 
Hi Maurice, I had a look at my St. Martin disk, cant find anything relevant though, sorry! Usually when I write that, someone else comes up with the right result!!
(Familysearch didn't turn anything up either.)
rosie.
 
Thanks for looking, Rosie, and don't worry - I am not expecting anyone to find anything either. The information comes from an old family Bible now in New Zealand with one of my third cousins. Who added this information and when, no one knows, but there is nothing on my database to support this. It is certainly feasible because the mother would have been 41 at the time of Henry's alleged birth, but all the other births were registered properly - just these two that appear nowhere. Thanks again,

Maurice
 
Thanks Shera, I think I can be reasonably sure that this is incorrect information.

Maurice
 
Hi I looked at St Martin's disk and couldn't see anything either. James and Mary's 1851 and 1861 census's have neither Emma or Henry on, but their address at these times is Aston - 1851 47 Gosta Green, Aston Near Birmingham, Birmingham - 1861 41 Woodcock Street, Aston, Birmingham.
 
Spot on, Bewdley, that agrees with my database. Many thanks for checking.

Maurice
 
Just a thought, could these children have been stillbirths, given names and entered in the family Bible.
 
Hi Lynne,

That seems to be the most likely option at the moment. I'm not sure what the official position was regarding stillbirths at home, i.e. disposal, the registers, etc.

Maurice
 
Hello Maurice ,I'm not sure either what happened officially but surely someone had to confirm it was a stillbirth, but this is over 150 years ago so very different times.
It sure is a difficult one, good luck with it.
Lynne.
 
Hi Mo - Not sure if this one is of any help but the only one I can come up with, and can't confirm this as there are no parents' names given and the date is out. Found on Ancestry Birmingham Burials:

Henry Longmore aged 4 - lived in Broad Street. Buried 18 January 1852 at St Thomas, Birmingham.

Judy
 
Hi there Judy,

This one's parents were Lambert & Sarah (nee BEESLEY) LONGMORE, who is closely related and who I already have. However, I am grateful for the burial date and the church - thank you. The ones I am looking for appear nowhere except in this NZ family Bible and I can only come to the conclusion that either the entries are erroneous or they were still births. But it's unusual for still births to be given names and yet there is no sign of a christening or burial. My cousin has asked his younger brother, who has the Bible, to photograph the entries so that we can check whether they were added at a later date, etc.

Do these latest Ancestry entries cover all the Birmingham parishes or just a select few? Information seems to be fairly sketchy unless you have an Ancestry account. FMP added Royal Household (1526-1924) records today, but there is not a single LONGMORE amongst them!

Maurice
 
Hi Mo

The Birmingham Parish Records on Ancestry.co.uk are not complete. Although I have had luck with many of my ancestors, there are others that I just can't find on there. The records are solely for Church of England, and there are no Roman Catholic records. The Non-Conformist records are there also but I don't know how complete they are. Hopefully more will become available in time. I want to check records for St Phillips and although some are there, the ones I want aren't!!!

Could your Emma and Henry have been RC?

I too have a stillbirth on my tree which I haven't been able to find any more about, but to my knowledge this baby was never given a name.

Judy
 
Hi Judy,

No chance - all the other five children were christened at St Martins. Until I get to know a little more about this Bible, e.g. whether it came from the UK or was compiled after 1920 in New Zealand, it's difficult to guess how accurate the information is.

Thanks for the information on the Ancestry records. I notice that the St Thomas burial of Henry is on the IGI. Unusual to find burials on the IGI - are they the result of this latest Ancestry acquisition? I assume that Ancestry and the LDS church are part of the same commercial organisation?

Maurice
 
I just wanted to add that all the burials at St. Thomas were removed to Warstone Lane Cemetery after the Church was bombed.
rosie.
 
Hi Rosie,

That's interesting because he doesn't show on the Warstone Lane Cemetery extracts in Birmingham Archives. (I have extracted all the LONGMOREs for all cemeteries).

Maurice
 
There is an Emma Longmore at KH but wrong date. There is a Henry Charles Longmore at WL buried 1859. Check out the JQRG site which has a free burial database for both cemeteries.

Judy
 
Hi Maurice, when I checked the films to see where my relatives had been placed, it just gives "box" numbers without names, I'm sorry that sound impersonal but I think perhaps with the bomb damage graves couldn't be indentified. I haven't got my notes handy, but I gather they were placed in catacombs or in the vaults above.
rosie.
 
Ha ha - a few years ago I extracted all the LONGMORE burials from the films in Birmingham Archives for all Birmingham cemeteries, Judy. They're on my website here: https://www.msheppard.com/burials.htm along with a few others. No sign of them at all. This NZ Bible is the only shred of evidence that they might have existed!

Maurice
 
Rosie,

That makes sense as I'm sure this particular child would not have had a headstone and it's quite possible the churchyard grave map may have been destroyed. If in catacombs or vaults, they would probably have been better preserved than had they remained at St Thomas!

Maurice
 
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