Kings Arms Moore’s Row

[flossiefoster]

I wonder if anyone on the Forum knows of a pub that used to be in Moor(e)'s Row in Deritend/Digbeth areas. My ancestor, William Gossage, was victualler of food and drink there for over 20 years from the end of the 18th century. It wasn't a very wholesome place as the district was home to tanneries because of the proximity to the River Rea (hence Floodgate Street). The last mention I can find is in 1848 when a bankrupt man was found hiding out there (published in the London Gazette) and swiftly arrested. If anyone has any information I should be most grateful. I have tried the Archives & Heritage Department of Bham Council but they don't have any pictures or mention of the pub . The information I have about William Gossage comes from Warwickshire County Records Office so I could try there but I know there are so many Forum members who have a wonderful knowledge of old Brum that I thought I would ask here first. Any ideas, please?

 

[mikejee]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

I am surprised the Birmingham Archives “have no mention of the pub”. It is recorded in directories up to the Kellys Directory of 1884, but has gone by the 1888 directory . They are rather busy with the library move at present though. The pub is shown on the OS map of c 1889 (probably surveyed around 1885-6), as can be seen on the map below. I have also given a map covering a slightly larger area so you can see where it was. Moore’s Row is still there, though none of the old buildings survive. William Gossage is listed as victualler in More’s Row in Wrightson’s directory 1815. He has gone by 1818 . I note, however that the victualler’s database shows him as there till 1818. He may have had a connection to the market, as the clerk to the market is his bondsmen.
Mike

 

[Phil]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

I have this rather poor photo of the Kings Arms, Moores Row, Bordesley c1900. I'm sorry but I have no other information with this photo other than I have stated. I know I have had it some while, but I cant remember where I got it.

Phil

 

[Charlie]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

Brilliant to have a photo at all of this pub Phil. I've never heard of Moores Row, time for a wander around Bordesley methinks.

 

[Phil]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

Charlie

There is not much to see now just a factory on one side and the school on the other.

Phil

 

[Charlie]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

Oh well. My grandad was born in Allison Street and lived in Milk Street for a time, so I've been meaning to go round that way for some time.
I realise it will have changed beyond recognition, but still worth a camera outing I think. When the nice weather returns.......

 

[flossiefoster]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

I have this rather poor photo of the Kings Arms, Moores Row, Bordesley c1900. I'm sorry but I have no other information with this photo other than I have stated. I know I have had it some while, but I cant remember where I got it.

Phil

Phil

Thank you so much for finding that. It looks very sad now but I suppose at the end of the 1700s and beginning of the 1800s it could have been quite the place for the locals to go.

I am very grateful as it has made it so real and not just a figment of my imagination (I began to think it was only a name) but now I know it was "real". Thank you, again!

Flossie

 

[flossiefoster]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

Thanks for your reply. Archives & Heritage do have a mention of the pub but no picture or any further details other than the possible age. They were able to tell me where in Moor(e)'s Row it was and the history of Moor(e)'s Row - ie Prince Rupert's army beheading the Moor(e) family because they would not vacate their homes and leave the area as it was a Parliamentary "area" and the Royalists wanted it cleared back in the Civil War.

Flossie

 

[Astoness]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

hi charlie i have posted a couple of pics of milk st for you under new thread...

lyn

 

[flossiefoster]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

I am surprised the Birmingham Archives “have no mention of the pub”. It is recorded in directories up to the Kellys Directory of 1884, but has gone by the 1888 directory . They are rather busy with the library move at present though. The pub is shown on the OS map of c 1889 (probably surveyed around 1885-6), as can be seen on the map below. I have also given a map covering a slightly larger area so you can see where it was. Moore’s Row is still there, though none of the old buildings survive. William Gossage is listed as victualler in More’s Row in Wrightson’s directory 1815. He has gone by 1818 . I note, however that the victualler’s database shows him as there till 1818. He may have had a connection to the market, as the clerk to the market is his bondsmen.
Mike

Thank you so much for this mikejee. I am afraid that I didn't get back to the forum for your response and apologise for leaving it so long - 6 years. I have a benign, inoperable brain tumour which was discovered in 2005. From 2012 I was kept busy with my very elderly parents. I kept my father in his house, as he wouldn't go into a home even if they paid him, until he became ill with pneumonia and died in hospital on his 90th birthday. Meanwhile my mother was in a nursing home acting as the worst patient ever. She died two years after my father in 2016. I have been recovering - not very well - ever since. Anyway, this is great. Thank you so much.

 

[flossiefoster]

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

I have this rather poor photo of the Kings Arms, Moores Row, Bordesley c1900. I'm sorry but I have no other information with this photo other than I have stated. I know I have had it some while, but I cant remember where I got it.

Phil

Thank you so much for this Phil. If you read my recent post to mikejee you will see what I have been up to for the last 6 years when I placed a post for help about More's Row. I gather from other research I did recently that it couldn't have been a very nice area because Floodgate St was home to tanneries where the effluent and smell were toxic to say the least. William Gossage who was my 4th great grandfather and who was born around 1750, made a Will in about 1825 when he said he was in sound mind but not body. He had a number of properties in Moore's Row that he left to his wife for her lifetime and then they were dispersed to his children (he had lost 2 out of 4 by this time). His wife, Dorothy (nee Haddock) died ten years later in 1841 and was buried in Solihull Parish Church graveyard.

5, 2012#2

Re: The king's arms, moor(e)'s row, off floodgate and near milk sts in digbeth/derite

I am surprised the Birmingham Archives “have no mention of the pub”. It is recorded in directories up to the Kellys Directory of 1884, but has gone by the 1888 directory . They are rather busy with the library move at present though. The pub is shown on the OS map of c 1889 (probably surveyed around 1885-6), as can be seen on the map below. I have also given a map covering a slightly larger area so you can see where it was. Moore’s Row is still there, though none of the old buildings survive. William Gossage is listed as victualler in More’s Row in Wrightson’s directory 1815. He has gone by 1818 . I note, however that the victualler’s database shows him as there till 1818. He may have had a connection to the market, as the clerk to the market is his bondsmen.
Mike

 

[flossiefoster]

I have struggled to find out much more about William Gossage (licensed victualler at Kings Arms in Moore's Row) and his family. His daughter, Hannah, became pregnant in 1811 (I think as baby born 6th April 1812 (baptised St Martin's) but not married. She was born in March 1794 (also baptised at St Martins). The family story (which I have always taken with a pinch of salt) has said that a member of the Jennens family was the father which resulted in my great grandfather (born 1862 in Kings Heath) to claim that he was "the rightful heir of the Jennens family. However, he was never hauled up by the police for the claim so I presume he never went to Court with it. This was at the time of the great "scandal" of members of the family going to Court over a number of years so that by the time the case was finished there was no money left as it had been spent on lawyer's fees. Leading to my grandfather's favourite saying: "Only the lawyer gets rich" if someone has to contest a matter in Court.

My grandfather told me about this when I was quite young but I never thought it could be true as one of the rules of tracing family history is to ignore all family stories because they are yarns. The other rule of tracing family history is to remember all family stories because they are invariably true even if not believed.