Warstone Lane Mrs Mann Mystery

[Key Hill Brian]

I recently cam across this conundrum (puzzle)

I recently received an enquiry about the location where a family photograph was taken, by Mr Mann, the Warstone Lane Secretary, who had also developed the print in his own 'dark room'.

There was very little background, but I ascertained it was the rear of the Warstone Lane Lodge.

The enquiry went on to say the family had been friends of the Manns and buried by them in the Catacomb Circle.
So, off I trotted to the circle and took a nice pic & close up of the Manns family grave.

It clearly states it is the last resting place of Emily Jane Mann, who died in 1932, and was the wife of Henry Mann, the Warstone Lane Secretary, who himself died in 1933 and was interred along side her.
Also in the grave is their daughter Elsie Clara Louise Mann, who succeeeded her father as Secretary of the Warstone Lane Cemetery, and passed away in 1976.

Once home I checked the burial records to find the grave number. Henry & Elsi are listed in Grave - 'Circle - M' - HOWEVER Emily jane is not listed!
BMSGH checked their records - no Sign! I went to handsworth and checked the Burial Registers for myself - No Sign!

Elsie is shown, having duly paid the £40 50p fee in 1976 with a note that grave deeds were produced.
Henry is shown in 1933 with a note that there is no charge - He was 'A servant of the Company' - No mention of grave deeds being produced.

A full search of the grave deeds register from opening in 1848 until the end of 1933 produced several graves belonging to Manns, but not this one. None of them had any of these 3 listed as their occupants.

I could not imagine as Secretary mr Mann, erronously put up a headstone in error for his wife who was not laid to rest in there?
But I cannot imagine him burying her without an entry in the Register?

Many entries at WL do not show Grave Numbers - but not showing the occupant is a first!

Did they have a secret slush book for in house freebies?
There must have been many other ledgers, which have not been passed down, or have been archived back in the '50's & '60's.

Here is the grave and a close up of the headstone - Will we ever know the whereabouts of the mysterious Mrs Mann???
:confused2:
I think even the Forum may be stumped...........but I could be wrong........:confused2:


View attachment 69607
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[mikejee]

Brian
I may be talking rubbish, and it wouldn't then have been allowed, but could she have been cremated and her ashes spread at that spot,which her husband had already arranged for his own burial. I know it is a bit convoluted, and cremation was not very common then (apparently there were just over 8000 in the uk in 1934). It could still have been correct that it was her last resting place, couldn't it, and there might be no record in the cemetery archives
Mike

 

[pollypops]

So Emily Jane Mann died first in 1932 and the headstone says that grave is her resting place but the records show that only her husband Henry Mann who died in 1933 and daughter Elsie Mann who died in 1976 are buried there?

That is a mystery. :confused2:
Can the graves either side of the Mann grave give us any clues? What year/s were people buried in them?

 

[Key Hill Brian]

Hi Mike,

It's a possibility, although as a C of E man, and Secretary, I couldn't imagine cremating her!

Certainly in the 1970's entries I have seen in both Burial Registers, Cremated remains are shown and given a Burial Register Number.

Presumably, there were surviving relatives who added Elsie name onto the memorial, unless she had arranged it all beforehand. She would have known of the various ledgers and records that existed. Presumably much got dumped or archived after the takeover, once BCC ran the cemetery down and tried to throw the key away!

 

[Key Hill Brian]

HI Polly,

The grave to the right is Walter & Jane Wright - 1946 & 1958 respectively.
Burial Register shows gravejust as I. The Mann grave is shown as Circle M. !

Looks like the Circle graves just have letters, but not necessary in alphabetical order!


Oh, the knowledge that has been lost!

 

[pollypops]

So that doesn't give us any clues then. What a puzzle :confused2:

 

[pollypops]

Brian, have you seen this?
https://sculpture.gla.ac.uk/view/person.php?id=msib4_1216891026

 

[lindyloo]

The grave to the right is Walter & Jane Wright - 1946 & 1958 respectively.

Don't know if this has any bearing but the Wrights could well have been related to the Manns through Jane because in1911 Henry and Emily have a niece with them called Clara Louisa Wright .

 

[leslam]

I've come across something similar before, where the memorial implied that the person was interred there, when in fact they were miles away! Never have worked that one out!