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Old Birmingham Railway Sites

ChrisM

ChrisM

Super Moderator
Staff member
I have recently had the following interesting questions from a nephew of mine:

An old school friend has been tasked with leading a group around old railway sites in B’ham / West Midlands, and we recently undertook a recce of various examples, such as the site of the old Central Goods depot (off Suffolk St). What surprised us both was the building known as the Roundhouse, in St Vincent St, off Broad St then Sheepcote St. I’d never heard of it nor seen it before, and I wondered if Forum members know much about it. It appears to have been a railway built stabling quarter for canal horses, and whilst nicely restored there is nothing on site to advise the passer by, nor it seems any uses planned, which is a shame.

After yomping up the tow path to view the remains of the junction where the Harborne branch left the mail line, we headed back to Snow Hill and walked the tow path from Livery St to Curzon St, another fascinating feature of inner city life I never knew about; one example is the shortish tunnel close to the middle ring road. We also tried to visualise where the Grand Junction Railway terminated, whether alongside the London & B’ham at Curzon St, or whether it finished up on the site of what is now the Think Tank. Again, any thoughts from Forum members on this topic would be welcomed!​

He and I would greatly appreciate any comments.

Chris
 
The Roundhouse was NOT a railway site, but stabling for Birmingham Corporation and a stone wharf. The former railway sites include, Granville Street Station, Suffolk St Goods, Curzon Street Goods & passengers, Lawley Street (Goods and passenger), Camp Hill Goods, the old Bordesley Viaduct, Hockley Goods and Interchange Basin, Monument Lane Goods and interchange basin, Soho Goods, Trinity Street Goods, Bordesley Sidings and site of original GWR shed.

Ray Shill
 
I did put some images of old railway sites in Birmingham in my recently published Amberley Book, including shots of Curzon Street when I worked there in the 1970's

Ray Shill
 
Granville Street was the terminus of the West Suburban Railway. The site of that station was lost when the Holliday Street depot was made, though the bridge over the tracks still remains.

Ray Shill
 
my grandad Joseph Martin was a waggoner repairing trains, he shared a business Banks and Martin, but I cannot find any info. If anyone knows anything I would appreciate it.
 
220px-Curzonplatforms.jpg
Thought this may be of interest Chris. Drawings of Curzon street and platforms in 1833. :strawberry:
 
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csmith604 said:
my grandad Joseph Martin was a waggoner repairing trains, he shared a business Banks and Martin, but I cannot find any info. If anyone knows anything I would appreciate it.
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About when was this, and was it in Birmingham or elsewhere?
 
I thought Banks and Martin waggoners were in Birmingham, early 1900s, but then Stourbridge, Kidderminster, then back to Birmingham. My grandad was named Joseph Martin born in Birmingham arount 1877 he changed his name to Joseph Morten when he "went off" with my nan to Stourbridge. She was at the Mitre inn for a while in Stourbridge and I know Railway meetings were held there and I wonder if that is how they met. The Mitre Inn was rebuilt, but the one my gran recalls must have been beautiful. She wrote a story nothing to do with the railway, but I thought some might like it.img033 (2).jpg
 
The nice engraving of Curzon Street, the London & Birmingham Station has to be 1838 or later, and will have to look up that date, as it appears in other publications. The year 1838 was when the London & Birmingham Railway was completed to Curzon Street. The year 1833 is a bit previous. The first public railway station, in Birmingham/Aston, was at Duddeston the year earlier, 1837. It was owned and operated by the Grand Junction Railway. The GJR was extended from Duddeston to Curzon St to a site adjacent to the London & Birmingham station, so there there two Curzon Street passenger stations side by side.

The Birmingham & Gloucester Railway had another temporary Passenger Station at Camp Hill, before trains ran into Curzon Street. The Birmingham & Derby Junction Railway later had a separate terminus at Landor Street.

Later still was the Birmingham & Oxford Junction Railway route that came to use the Snow Hill site as their terminus.

Ray Shill
 
The Grand Junction terminus was on the oposite side of Curzon Street from the London & Birmingham.

The Birmingham & Oxford built the unused viaduct from Bordesley to Curzon Street to bring their trains into Curzon Street but they were too late as the London & North Western extended their line into New Street.
 
My nephew is very grateful for all the helpful comments so far posted (which just seem to keep on coming!) I hope that the discussion continues.

An apology from me for not having searched the Forum for a reference to the Roundhouse before posting the original question.

Chris
 
Moor Street station must be the least altered of the Birmingham Railway termini with trains calling there from 1909. The terminus buildings, and booking hall, were later being erected in the period 1914-1916. The goods sheds, adjacent, were on two levels and these were finished during 1914. The original Brunel viaduct was enlarged with the various new works requiring additional viaduct width. An interesting survivor for those with keen eyesight are the vents in the new brickwork superstructure for the stables below.

Ray Shill
 
A bit of lost heritage was the wagon lift at Landor Street. The line of the Birmingham & Gloucester Railway joined the London and Birmingham Railway at what later became known as Exchange Sidings. There was a lift on the north side (later near the factory of Wrights Ropes) with a single track that passed under the LBR across Landor Street into the BDJR Lawley Street station.

Ray Shill
 
Just for information. the latest Backtrack magazine (Oct 2023) has an article in which the author , Ian Greig, looks at the survey of Brunel (not used) for the Birmingham & Gloucester Railway
 
Brunels survey was considered expensive for the company and they opted for the services of another engineer. Brunel did survey the Bristol and Gloucester Railway which was completed as Broad Gauge

The Birmingham & Gloucester Railway changed with time and became part of the Midland Railway and then the LMS. Moseley Tunnel is an original structure. whose image has appeared elsewhere on this Forum. Cofton Tunnel was removed by the LMS when the track was widened south of Longbridge. There are a couple of line side gate keepers houses still. although altered somewhat. The bridge over the River Avon retains the original lower metal columns in tact.
 
Heartland said:
The Birmingham & Gloucester Railway changed with time and became part of the Midland Railway and then the LMS. Moseley Tunnel is an original structure. whose image has appeared elsewhere on this Forum. Cofton Tunnel was removed by the LMS when the track was widened south of Longbridge. There are a couple of line side gate keepers houses still. although altered somewhat. The bridge over the River Avon retains the original lower metal columns in tact.
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I have heard a story recently that the German bombers during the war used the Birmingham & Gloucester Railway as their guide intending to bomb Longbridge. However they were using out of date maps which showed the Cofton Tunnel still in place so they continued to follow the tracks and mistook the Edgbaston Tunnel for the Cofton Tunnel missing Longbridge.
 
Edgbaston Tunnel was quite short and parallel to the Canal Tunnel. Travelling north from Cofton Tunnel would have encountered a number of factories before Edgbaston. I suspect the German bombers had better sources of intelligence than suggest here.
 
I worked at the old central sorting office on Blucher St (off Suffolk St) one Christmas. They did have a tunnel that went to New St station but there was no railway in it. As I understand it, it was a low tunnel and you'd never get any kind of engine through there. One day we had to take the parcel mail out to the Central goods depot - but that was Curzon St.
The Roundhouse is now owned by the National Trust and runs tours and the like including some historical bits. But There's nothing obvious about the rail network. It's all about the canal system. https://roundhousebirmingham.org.uk/
Here's a link to an pld map . https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17.0&lat=52.47940&lon=-1.90852&layers=117746211&b=3
If I've got this right it should show the rail line at New Street and by the Roundhouse. There's nothing to indicate a goods depot by Suffolk St and the Roundhouse does seem separate from the railway too. This is late 19th Century so anything different might be earlier and they are missing a sheet.
There should be some kind of contact at the Roundhouse on their site and they should definitely have more on that.
 
wam said:
I worked at the old central sorting office on Blucher St (off Suffolk St) one Christmas. They did have a tunnel that went to New St station but there was no railway in it. As I understand it, it was a low tunnel and you'd never get any kind of engine through there. One day we had to take the parcel mail out to the Central goods depot - but that was Curzon St.
The Roundhouse is now owned by the National Trust and runs tours and the like including some historical bits. But There's nothing obvious about the rail network. It's all about the canal system. https://roundhousebirmingham.org.uk/
Here's a link to an pld map . https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17.0&lat=52.47940&lon=-1.90852&layers=117746211&b=3
If I've got this right it should show the rail line at New Street and by the Roundhouse. There's nothing to indicate a goods depot by Suffolk St and the Roundhouse does seem separate from the railway too. This is late 19th Century so anything different might be earlier and they are missing a sheet.
There should be some kind of contact at the Roundhouse on their site and they should definitely have more on that.
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The sorting office now know as the Mailbox did have a tunnel to New Street Station but that was for the little electric tugs pulling the trailers carrying the mailbags that you used to see coming up the ramps onto the platforms at the station. These ramps have all been taken away. The tunnel replaced the tunnels that used to run to the sorting offices in Victoria Square and Paradise Street. As WAM says there were never rails in those tunnels.

The Roundhouse was always a canal facility and then the Birmingham Corporation Public Works Dept. It was never a railway installation. However there were sidings and a goods station on the other side of St Vincent Street from the Roundhouse. This is about where you come out of the tunnel from New Street Station heading towards Smethwick and Wolverhampton. This tunnel runs under Centenary Square and I think under the entrance to the ICC and Symphony Hall.

The Midland Railway's Central Goods Station was in a small street called Allport Street, off Suffolk Street, which has now disappeared but think of the present Holliday Street on the other side of the road from the Crowne Plaza Hotel. The track to this station ran through its own tunnels and you can see where it joined the main line at the far end of the platform at Five Ways Station. Interesting to me is that there used to be an open air short section to the tunnel on what is now called the Cross City Line roughly where the entrance to the underground car park in Holliday Street is now situated. There is still an open air section in the tunnel, although you cannot see behind high walls, just before the canal aquaduct over Holliday Street.
 
When the Midland Railway goods at Holliday Street was taken down, it was possible to walk through the tunnel, then they built Stanier House for the ill fated Field Organisation, but later was used as railway offices.
 
Heartland said:
When the Midland Railway goods at Holliday Street was taken down, it was possible to walk through the tunnel, then they built Stanier House for the ill fated Field Organisation, but later was used as railway offices.
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There used to be an open air carpark between Stannier House (don't know if that is still its name since it ceased to be railway offices) and the entrance to the tunnel. I often used the carpark on Saturday afternoons after 3.30pm when the attendant went off duty so I could park for free. One day I drove right up to the entrance to the tunnel but chickened out of driving through. I had previously walked through some of the tunnels at the Five Ways end when you could get access from the former Jew's Burying Ground but then they started locking the gate on the bridge in Islington Row. The entrance to the tunnel was fenced off but I thought it could still be accessed from the grounds of Stannier House as the tunnels were used by Network Rail engineers to get vehicle access to the railway line.
 
DavidGrain said:
The Roundhouse was always a canal facility and then the Birmingham Corporation Public Works Dept. It was never a railway installation. However there were sidings and a goods station on the other side of St Vincent Street from the Roundhouse. This is about where you come out of the tunnel from New Street Station heading towards Smethwick and Wolverhampton. This tunnel runs under Centenary Square and I think under the entrance to the ICC and Symphony Hall.

The Midland Railway's Central Goods Station was in a small street called Allport Street, off Suffolk Street, which has now disappeared but think of the present Holliday Street on the other side of the road from the Crowne Plaza Hotel. The track to this station ran through its own tunnels and you can see where it joined the main line at the far end of the platform at Five Ways Station. Interesting to me is that there used to be an open air short section to the tunnel on what is now called the Cross City Line roughly where the entrance to the underground car park in Holliday Street is now situated. There is still an open air section in the tunnel, although you cannot see behind high walls, just before the canal aquaduct over Holliday Street.
Click to expand...
The map link https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17.0&lat=52.47940&lon=-1.90852&layers=117746211&b=3 should take you to a map that includes the railway lines. You can see the main line going into and out of the tunnel under Broad Street and that tunnel is shourt enough that you can see where it must go. I admit I had missed the Allport depot before. That's also on the map on the brown bit that, presumably, came from a different source.
 
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