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Saxonw.
Guest
The Vampire Tavern
Does anyone know anything about the Vampire Tavern , 33 Great Hampton row , operating in the 1850"s?
Does anyone know anything about the Vampire Tavern , 33 Great Hampton row , operating in the 1850"s?
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Rod
Guest
![City Great Edmund Street vampire1a[1].jpg](https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/data/attachments/29/29601-6402b25f3a9e6d958786ed67bbc04c11.jpg?hash=ZAKyXzqebZ "City Great Edmund Street vampire1a[1].jpg")
Not sure it's the same Vampire but we posted this on Virtual Brums forums some years ago now. I love the picture. What is your interest in it Saxon
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Saxonw.
Guest
It was run by by ggg grandfather's brother John Stagg. it's the name that gets me.
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Saxonw.
Guest
I know ggg grandfather's brother John Stagg was there both in 1858 in Dix's and in the 1861 Census. (33 Great Hampton Row) (with his wife Eliza. I'm wondering if they are still there in 1868 because I know thye've gone by 1871. It would be nice to think that is them in that picture but it must be too late for them
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gingerjon
GONE BUT NOT FORGOTTEN R.I.P.
staggs and pub
there was no pub or John Stagg in 1845, he and the pub was there 1855 and 1862 but not in 1868
also William and John seem to have the same trade are they related also who is Henry Neptune Stagg he is in the beer trade
William info from 1852/53 Slaters directory
there was no pub or John Stagg in 1845, he and the pub was there 1855 and 1862 but not in 1868
also William and John seem to have the same trade are they related also who is Henry Neptune Stagg he is in the beer trade
William info from 1852/53 Slaters directory
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Saxonw.
Guest
Thank you for that. I wonder if its them on the picture .
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Saxonw.
Guest
No Neptune was born in Nottingham unlike William and John so he's not related . As for William that is very interesting as I have him as a button burnisher in 41, 51 and 61. and in 62 when his son gets married. I supppose that in the great expansion of Birmingham in the mid 19th C other people came in. The greatest density of Staggs come from Wiltshire and Somerset so not too far to come for work. John was originally a brass founder but when he remarries his widowed wife was a ginger beer seller -so presumably it was her expertise that enabled them to run the pub. But thanks for the pictures.! it gives a complete shape to the story. I wonder why it was called that (And no jokes about only serving Bloody Mary's -we've done all those!)
Lyn
its difficult to be absolutely certain , but i think it is the red building. Certainly either this or one of those either side of it. This also fits with the picture showing quite a wide building , and that the outhouses at the back would be appropriate for a pub
Mike
PS Added while reposting. we now can be certain that this was the Vampire
its difficult to be absolutely certain , but i think it is the red building. Certainly either this or one of those either side of it. This also fits with the picture showing quite a wide building , and that the outhouses at the back would be appropriate for a pub
Mike
PS Added while reposting. we now can be certain that this was the Vampire
...ahh the hampton...ive spent many a happy hour or 10 in there when it was the minerva vaults....totally wrecked it now..it was busted a couple of years ago i think....it was being used for growing drugs but i dont think it was open as a pub at the time...
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Lynn
The census of 1861 gives john stagg at 33 Gt Hampton row. the page itself doesn't name the road , but the page before shows it as Gt Hampton row. No 33 is not named as the vampire, but john is a retail brewer adn the court behind is named "Vampyre court", so I think it is definitely GHR. Will send you the pages.
Mike
The census of 1861 gives john stagg at 33 Gt Hampton row. the page itself doesn't name the road , but the page before shows it as Gt Hampton row. No 33 is not named as the vampire, but john is a retail brewer adn the court behind is named "Vampyre court", so I think it is definitely GHR. Will send you the pages.
Mike
brianthelion
master brummie
any views as to why the pub was called the vampire though, always struck me as an odd name for a pub but also a fascinating one. Cheers
brianthelion
master brummie
lyn
Thanks for the responses but i guess the question them becomes why call somewhere vampyre court thats seems very scary!!
brianthelion
master brummie
scary name and a scary looking pub but how i wish I could have seen it. Living literally just up the road from the likely site I also wished i had been living around here when the Gothic was open. would love any detail on that pub plus any pictures people may have. Cheers
what a shame that saxonw is just a guest now i think he would have liked what i have come across. ...anyhow here are 2 pics of the vampire 33 gt hampton row along with a map pinpointing it and the yard at the back was called vampire yard..what confirms its address is this 1850s advert which i found fascinating as it seems as though it was also a most unusual museum and also confirms that saxonw.s gt gt gt grandfathers brother john stagg ran it...kellys confirms a butchers next door..to those who are familar with the area the vampire would have been just a bit further down from the minerva pub heading towards gt hampton st..
lyn
lyn
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cookie273uk
master brummie
what an unusual (and unpleasant) name for a Pub !!! I see it was a Holt Brewery pub, this Brewery was in Holt Street if I remember correct and it had a pub attached called The Holt (surprise surprise!). My Wife worked in the Brewery offices for a time many years ago and we would occasionally call in the pub, it was always full of 'hard up' students from the nearby Aston University. It has long since gone although I cannot remember the year of its closure.
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I have derived this mostly from newspapers, correcting dates for the fact that most of the reports refer to the day before, so this is given rather than date of report. The details from directories are likely to be up to a year out of date. "From" and "to" mean licence was transferred from someone to someone else. Early reports list both, but later ones only to whom it is transferred.
Neither The Vampire, nor any other licensed premises, is listed at 33 Gt Hampton row in directories prior to the PO directory of 1855, which lists John Stagg as landlord. Below it states when he was leaving, in 1868, that he had been the landlord for 12 years, so he may well have been the first landlord.
4.2.1858 Retail Brewers Protection Soc hold meeting at Vampire, John Stagg landlord.
24.8.1859 John Stagg lined for opening in improper hours on a Sunday.
16.5.1861 John Stagg. landlord had money stolen from Vampire
19.9.1861 John Stagg given music and dancing licence for Vampire
29.10.1868 Vampire advertised as John Stagg retiring due to bad health. Says he has held licence for 12 years
7.1.1871 Vampire advertised to Let as "proprietor has government situation to fill"
25 8.1871. John Collins applied for music & dancing licence -refused
7.3.1872 from John Collins to George Jones
16.10.1873 George Jones falls backwards into a vat of boiling ale and is severely scalded.
10.1.1874 Advertised for sale due to death of proprietor.
4.12.1873 from George Jones to Elizabeth Jones
5.3.1874 from Elizabeth Jones to Thomas Willetts.
21.8.74 Thomas Willetts applies for music licence
5.2.1875 Licence and goodwill advertised for sale, value £140
5.3.1875 Creditors meeting for Thomas Willetts . liabilities £398.2s.11d, assets £71.8s.10d
Kellys for 1876 lists William Simpson as landlord
26.6.1880 W.Simpson applies for music and dancing licence
4.11.1880 Brewing plant advertised
1.3. 1881 to Edward Thomas Trueman
4.8.1881 from H Maynard to H. Thomas
7.12.1882 to Thomas Banford
1..3.1884 to J Tonks
5.6.1884 to E. Child
4.12.1884 to Thomas Keay
5.12.1885 to J. Holland
26.10.1886 Richard Moxon, landlord of Vampire sent to jail for 6 weeks for assaulting his wife Phoebe, and she given a separation order
6.1.1887 to J. Handley
6.12.1888 to J. Beckett
Kellys 1890 lists Joseph Beckett as landlord
7.5.1891 to G. Powers
1.10. 1891 to T Hubble
Kellys 1892 lists Reuben Brown as landlord
1.6.1893 to G H. Deakin
7.12.1893 to J. Wallace
7.6.1894 to A.H.Edwards
Kellys 1895 lists Alfred Edwards as landlord.
Kellys 1896 lists John Jones as landlord.
Kellys 1897 lists Harry Smith as landlord.
Kellys 1899 lists William Adams as landlord.
Kellys 1900 lists James Goodman as landlord.
Kellys 1903-5 lists Stephen Dawes as landlord.
Kellys 1908 lists George Hope as landlord.
Kellys 1910-12 lists Frederick Dawes as landlord.
Not listed 1913 or after, so it must have closed around 1912
Neither The Vampire, nor any other licensed premises, is listed at 33 Gt Hampton row in directories prior to the PO directory of 1855, which lists John Stagg as landlord. Below it states when he was leaving, in 1868, that he had been the landlord for 12 years, so he may well have been the first landlord.
4.2.1858 Retail Brewers Protection Soc hold meeting at Vampire, John Stagg landlord.
24.8.1859 John Stagg lined for opening in improper hours on a Sunday.
16.5.1861 John Stagg. landlord had money stolen from Vampire
19.9.1861 John Stagg given music and dancing licence for Vampire
29.10.1868 Vampire advertised as John Stagg retiring due to bad health. Says he has held licence for 12 years
7.1.1871 Vampire advertised to Let as "proprietor has government situation to fill"
25 8.1871. John Collins applied for music & dancing licence -refused
7.3.1872 from John Collins to George Jones
16.10.1873 George Jones falls backwards into a vat of boiling ale and is severely scalded.
10.1.1874 Advertised for sale due to death of proprietor.
4.12.1873 from George Jones to Elizabeth Jones
5.3.1874 from Elizabeth Jones to Thomas Willetts.
21.8.74 Thomas Willetts applies for music licence
5.2.1875 Licence and goodwill advertised for sale, value £140
5.3.1875 Creditors meeting for Thomas Willetts . liabilities £398.2s.11d, assets £71.8s.10d
Kellys for 1876 lists William Simpson as landlord
26.6.1880 W.Simpson applies for music and dancing licence
4.11.1880 Brewing plant advertised
1.3. 1881 to Edward Thomas Trueman
4.8.1881 from H Maynard to H. Thomas
7.12.1882 to Thomas Banford
1..3.1884 to J Tonks
5.6.1884 to E. Child
4.12.1884 to Thomas Keay
5.12.1885 to J. Holland
26.10.1886 Richard Moxon, landlord of Vampire sent to jail for 6 weeks for assaulting his wife Phoebe, and she given a separation order
6.1.1887 to J. Handley
6.12.1888 to J. Beckett
Kellys 1890 lists Joseph Beckett as landlord
7.5.1891 to G. Powers
1.10. 1891 to T Hubble
Kellys 1892 lists Reuben Brown as landlord
1.6.1893 to G H. Deakin
7.12.1893 to J. Wallace
7.6.1894 to A.H.Edwards
Kellys 1895 lists Alfred Edwards as landlord.
Kellys 1896 lists John Jones as landlord.
Kellys 1897 lists Harry Smith as landlord.
Kellys 1899 lists William Adams as landlord.
Kellys 1900 lists James Goodman as landlord.
Kellys 1903-5 lists Stephen Dawes as landlord.
Kellys 1908 lists George Hope as landlord.
Kellys 1910-12 lists Frederick Dawes as landlord.
Not listed 1913 or after, so it must have closed around 1912
this info is brilliant mike...as you know for some time now i have been complying a folder of photos maps and info of anything interesting to do with my neck of the woods and i shall print this off...
mike can you have a look at the photo on post 23 please i was hoping to date it....the landlords name looks like goodhall but cant be sure...i see that from your list from kellys there is a james goodman there in 1900..could be a miss spelling in kellys ?? or maybe my eyes lol
photo 1 on post 19 i can clearly see the landlords name as frederick dawes so that puts that pic around 1910 to 12..dont know if i am allowing my imagination to run away with me here but what is sitting on the step as it does not look human to me and looks to have clawed feet and the head looks strange..
pic 2 on post 19 i just cant make out the landlords name...
mike can you have a look at the photo on post 23 please i was hoping to date it....the landlords name looks like goodhall but cant be sure...i see that from your list from kellys there is a james goodman there in 1900..could be a miss spelling in kellys ?? or maybe my eyes lol
photo 1 on post 19 i can clearly see the landlords name as frederick dawes so that puts that pic around 1910 to 12..dont know if i am allowing my imagination to run away with me here but what is sitting on the step as it does not look human to me and looks to have clawed feet and the head looks strange..
pic 2 on post 19 i just cant make out the landlords name...
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Hi lyn hope you don,t mind me jumping in here, but I thought what an interesting bunch of characters, on post 16,so I looked up james goodall on ancestry,
and found james a goodall aged 36 with his wife Elizabeth at 33 gt Hampton row on the 1901 census so you mus be right about the misspelling in kellys.
by the way I think that's a Staffordshire bull terrior on the steps in the other pic. all the best Michael.
and found james a goodall aged 36 with his wife Elizabeth at 33 gt Hampton row on the 1901 census so you mus be right about the misspelling in kellys.
by the way I think that's a Staffordshire bull terrior on the steps in the other pic. all the best Michael.
hi michael oh please jump in this just fascinates me...nice bit of detective work by you with ancestry at least we now have the dates of 2 of the photos...im so pleased that its a staff on the pub steps i can see it now..just looking again at mikes info and read that in 1873 george jones fell into a vat of boiling ale scalding himself...now im wondering why they boiled ale..
lyn
lyn
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Lyn
Have checked Kellys , incase a made a late night error, but it does say Goodman, but , from the census, that must be wrong. I agree about the Staff and the Fred. Was going to add today, but you got in first, that you don't boil ale, it would have been wort , the mixture of malt and water they boil to extract the sugars that will ferment to give the alcohol. Mind you, it wouldn't have made much difference to him what it was, he would still probably have eventually died.
Have checked Kellys , incase a made a late night error, but it does say Goodman, but , from the census, that must be wrong. I agree about the Staff and the Fred. Was going to add today, but you got in first, that you don't boil ale, it would have been wort , the mixture of malt and water they boil to extract the sugars that will ferment to give the alcohol. Mind you, it wouldn't have made much difference to him what it was, he would still probably have eventually died.
As a matter of interest, someone has used some of our information , (https://www.strangehistory.net/2014/05/13/homemade-beer-vampire-inn/ ) and described us (with link) as an excellent forum.
Just one other thought. Have noticed that , in the US there seem to be a number of breweries that add blood orange peel to their brew (google blood and beer). Don't know who originated the idea or whether it is a new or old idea, but could, when they brewed for themselves before they sold the brewing gear, they have used that in their brew?.
Just one other thought. Have noticed that , in the US there seem to be a number of breweries that add blood orange peel to their brew (google blood and beer). Don't know who originated the idea or whether it is a new or old idea, but could, when they brewed for themselves before they sold the brewing gear, they have used that in their brew?.
hi mike its just that on post 17 you put james goodman...thanks for the info about the boiling of the wort i had never heard of this being done on the premises before..obviously george jones died as a result of this accident as the pub was up for sale not long after...
thanks again mike..
thanks again mike..