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Palmer William Henry

  • Thread starter Thread starter ezza
  • Start date Start date
E

ezza

Guest
Can anyone help?.
I`m trying to trace the origin of William Henry Palmer.
The family thought he came from Stow on the Wold and was brought to Birmingham at an early age.
The family thought he never knew his Birthday, but estimated around 1890.
He was supposed to have grown up in Aston.
The Dates I am sure about are;-
Married Emily Lingard July 2nd 1911 Bullock Street Aston.
Children;-
Ada Ellen,Harry,Gladys,Kenny and Ronnie
Died 22nd July 1938 Lord Street.
On his wedding certificate his name was Harry Palmer
On his death certificate William Henry Palmer
On the electoral roles for 1932-1938 he was William Henry Palmer
On Emily`s death certificate his name was put as Harry William Palmer
I`ve found an entry in the 1901 census quoting;-
Harry Palmer born 1891 from Stow on Wold living at 6 Lingard street,Windson Grove, Aston but unable to travel back for any of the family.
 
Do you have his marriage certificate, if so does it give a name for his father


bren
 
His father is Harry Palmer occupation Shoeing Smith (Blacksmith).

Oh hello by the way
 
There is (on ancestry) only one William h palmer of about the right age in the 1901 census whose father is William.
No 10 35 court Irving st
William Palmer head 28 military ornament labourer
Kate Palmer wife 30
William H Palmer son 8
A blacksmith might well make military ornaments (ie riding gear etc)
Only thing is they are all supposed to have been born in Birmingham
Just a suggestion
mike
 
dont know if you already have this but his older brother albert was with his grandparents in 1891 in stow on the wold

john acocks 68 formerly blacksmith b. longborough glouc.
elizabeth 47 shirt maker b. warks
john c. son.14 post office messenger b. stow on the wold
arthur w. son 12 stable boy b. stow on the wold
albert h. palmer grandson 4 b. stow on the wold
 
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I don`t know if this helps, but the story in the family was that William`s mother died in child birth and his father rejected him , so he was bought to Birmingham by a Mrs Bayliss.
Just before my mother died last year she started to talk about her experiences when she was a child, including visits to her fathers family, who were Blacksmiths, around Canal street Birmingham which blows the original story out of the water.
Anyway the facts common to both stories was that William`s father was a Blacksmith and that the family all came from Stow on the Wold (well I hope they are).
This is the reason the 1901 census seemed to make sense.
Oh and thanks Shera i`ve checked Albert on the 1891 census but he`s down as Albert H Palmer and not Albert E, but as you know anything is possible.
 
Shera said:
theres a birth of henry william palmer 1890 apr-jun glouc. 6a 103

just a possibility :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Yes, i noticed that one, it was Barton Regis which i think came under the Clifton area of Glos' and quite a way from Stow-on-Wold, by the way, nice place, my brother lived there many years ago, not that that helps lol. It could be him, born there and the family moved to Stow when he was too young to know and assumed he was from there.

bren
 
When trying to trace William, from the 1901 census I came across a Harry Palmer married to a Mary Jane Mills in Stow on the Wold.
While tracing these I found that Mary died in 1890 in child birth, which adds credability to the story and may account for Albert being with his granparents.The 1901 census shows Harry snr married to Ada M Palmer from Northampton which may have been his second marriage.
If anybody wants my limited results,which I am having trouble confirming, I would be glad to send them a copy.
 
there must have been a previous marriage if the ages on the 1901 are correct. otherwise ada had helen the oldest girl when she was only 14
 
I agree that was the reason I searched and came across Mary Jane Mills.
 
If anyone can help, on the 1911 census for Ada Mary Bayliss, it states her and Alfred William Bayliss have been married for 4 years but I can`t find any record any help.
For census see my Photo Album.
 
This search has left me a little confused I posted earlier but deleted it as irrelevant but I thought it worth a go.
In 1907 a William Henry Palmer married Ada Mary Cutler in Birmingham.
The only Ada Mary Cutler I can find was born 1882 Birmingham,could they fit into your family somewhere.Where are they in 1911?
 
1911 census
BAYLISS, Alfred William Head Married M 36 born 1875 Aston Parish ( Plasterer )
BAYLISS, Ada Mary Wife F 45 born 1866 Northampton Byfield (Charwoman )
Married 4 years
MOTT, Fanny Niece F 13 born 1898 School Duddeston Sub Dist
living at 91 Rocky Lane
RG number:RG14
Piece:18263
Reference:RG14PN18263 RG78PN1101 RD385 SD3 ED33 SN6
 
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1911 census
PALMER, William Henry Head M 27 born 1884 Birmingham (Wood Turner)
Married 4 years
PALMER, Ada Mary Wife F 29 born 1882 Birmingham
PALMER, Leslie William Son M 3 born 1908 Birmingham
PALMER, Norman Son M 1 1910 Birmingham
PALMER, Ruth Aunt Single F 50 born 1861 Birmingham ( Paper Box Maker)
RG number:RG14
Piece:17888
Reference:RG14PN17888 RD383 SD2 ED4 SN248
living at 83 Court Road Balsall Heath.
 
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Sorry for the confusion but this story is a bit complex as you can see from my original post .
I have all the proof of William Henry from 1911 onwards its the story before which I can`t prove I think because William`s mother died in child birth having him he came, with his family to Birmingham.
In the 1901 census I think Ada M Palmer is Harry snr`s second wife but can`t find their marriage.
Also Harry snr died in 1906 Lingard st. Aston I have the certificate.
In 1911 census an Ada Mary Bayliss is married to Albert William Bayliss, as you have already found, living in Rocky Lane Aston.
The family always talked about a Mrs Bayliss from Rocky Lane having something to do with the story, so could this Ada Mary be William Henry`s step mum?.
Unfortunately I can`t find their wedding either.
Would this help:-
​

When I talk about William Henry please bear in mind my original post about him changing names.

Thanks to all comments I have received so far.
Here is the list of all I have found, although anything before 1911 is down to a lot of speculation.
Please forgive any confusions as this is the first time I have attempted anything like this including Forums.

1871 census
Barnett household Elizabeth Palmer nee Barnett lives here with Harry Palmer in Stow on the Wold Father not known.
Charles Barnett 55 1816 Farrier
Maria Barnett 58 1813
Elizabeth Palmer 30 1841
Harry M Palmer 12 1859
Church st. Stow on the Wold
1871 census
Mary Jane Mills Lives with her family in Stow on the Wold.
Hannah Mills 54 1817 Char Woman
Mary J Mills 16 1855 Servant
Thomas Mills 14 1857
1879 have certificate
May 17th Mary Jane Mills marries Harry Palmer in Stow on the Wold
1881 census
Mary Jane Palmer, Henry Palmer And Nellie Palmer are boarders at Charles Barnett`s house in Stow on the Wold.
Charles Barnett 65 1816 Farrier
Henry Palmer 27 1854 Farrier
Mary J Palmer 26 1855 Housekeeper
Nellie Palmer 9mts 1881 (could be Helen)
1890 have cert.
May 2nd Mary Jane Palmer dies in child birth Stow on the Wold.
Ada M ? marries Harry Palmer.(cannot prove)
Harry(William Henry) is born(cannot prove)
1901 census
Harry Palmer, wife Ada M (nee unknown) palmer, Albert son and Helen daughter now live in 6 Lingard St, Windson Grove Aston.
Harry Palmer 42 1859 Shoeing Smith
Ada m Palmer 35 1866 Laundry Washer
Albert E Palmer 15 1886 Bolt Screwer
Harry Palmer 10 1891
Helen L Palmer 21 1880 Ammunition Worker
1906 have cert.
February 19th Harry Palmer Snr dies in 37 Lingard St Saltley Aston.​
1907
Ada Mary Palmer marries Alfred Bayliss.(cannot prove)​
1911 census
Alfred William Bayliss 36 1875 Plasterer
Ada Mary Bayliss 45 1866 Charwoman
living at 91 Rocky Lane Aston.
1911 census
April Emily Lingard lives in 3 court 4 house Bullock St. with her family.
July 2nd Harry Palmer marries Emily Lingard.
29th September Ada Ellen Palmer is born.
1920 Electoral role
Alfred William and Ada Mary Bayliss live at 87 Rocky Lane.
1920 Electoral role
William Henry and Emily Palmer live at 21a Lord Street with Albert Lingard
1925 Electoral role
Alfred William and Ada Mary Bayliss live at 158 Rocky Lane.
1925 Electoral role
William Henry and Emily Palmer live at 21a Lord street.
1930 Electoral role
Alfred William and Ada Mary Bayliss live at 158 Rocky Lane.
1930 Electoral role
William Henry and Emily Palmer live at 21a Lord street
1932
James Jones marries Ada Ellen Palmer
1935 Electoral role
William Henry and Emily Palmer live at 21a Lord street
1932
25th April James Edward Jones marries Ada Ellen Palmer.
1938 have cert.
22nd July William Henry Palmer (Harry) dies.
1939 Electoral role
Emily Palmer lives alone at 21a Lord Street.
1939 Electoral role
James Edward and Ada Ellen Jones live at 5 Cooksey road.
1945 Electoral role
Emily Palmer lives alone at 8 York Avenue.
1950 Electoral role
Emily Palmer lives alone at 8 York Avenue.​
1957
Emily Palmer dies.

Hope this helps.​
 
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Having had another look at several sites,I have found,in the 1881 census an Ada M Wright born 1866 Byfield,Northamptonshire,working as a general servant to a family at 24 Summer Lane. Will this be of any help?
 
Spot on Ladylinda.

Not indexed on Free BMD(only Ada) but found on complete marriage records
Harry Palmer/Ada M Wright ,September qtr 1892,Aston ref. 6d 352.

In 1891 Ada is a domestic servant age 25 at the victoria Inn,Lichfield Raod,Aston Manor.

Birth Sept 1865 registered Daventry ref. 3b 105
Ada Mary Wright baptised 22nd October 1865 Woodford near Daventry
parents Richard and Hannah
Richard Wright and Hannah Ward married 1862 Daventry ref 6b 167

1871 9 Mill street,Tipton,Staffs
Richard Wright age 32 labourer
Hannah age 35
Flora age 8
Ada age 6
George age 4
Willy age 1
All born Hinton Northants except Willy born Tipton.
Hinton is next to Byfield registration district Daventry.
 
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Thanks alot Alberta, Ladylinda.
I`ll look into these.
This may be BRILLIANT !!!!!!!!.
The story in the family,as I said above, was William Henry`s mother died having William.
The father rejected William and Mrs? Bayliss, who was a Maid, brought William to Birmingham but I have found out that the facts surrounding William and Mrs Bayliss have been distorted over the years.
It was originally thought that Mrs Bayliss and William came to Birmingham from Stow on the Wold, but it could have been that they moved in with the Palmer`s, who were from Stow on the Wold.
Could it be William was Ada`s son and was adopted ?.
Could It be just a change of name ?.
THE PLOT THICKENS.
 
Certificates finally arrived and they are dead on.
Still cant find William Henry but I am working on it.
Every time I get one step closer I end up one step back, but oh well this is what it is all about.
 
By the way Shera Albert was living with his Grandparents in Stow on the Wold, Elizabeth Acocks was originally married to Harry Palmer`s Grandfather.
Thanks for the help.
 
ezza said:
By the way Shera Albert was living with his Grandparents in Stow on the Wold, Elizabeth Acocks was originally married to Harry Palmer`s Grandfather.
Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...

thats great news, im glad its all come together for you :)
 
Well nearly, but you don`t realise,when you start, just how it can take over your life.
 
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