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James Burgoyne photographic collection

Astoness

Astoness

TRUE BRUMMIE MODERATOR
Staff member
hi folks..thought it would be nice to start a new pic thread dedictated to the early 1880s photos that james burgoyne was commissioned to take by the the city council...i personally find them absolutely fascinating and they just prove how much birmingham has changed since then...over 100 where taken but i only have a few so will post them all as i can...

first off we have the white house pub..this stood where county hall is now...at the junction of brickiln lane and staniforth st.on the left..i will also post a map showing the extact spots of each of these first 3 pics...


top arrow ....the white house
middle left arrow..pic 2
bottom left arrow...pic 3

lyn

james burgoyne 001.jpgjames burgoyne 002.jpgjames burgoyne 003.jpgjames burgoyne 004.jpg
 
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pic 2 cannon st 1880s...with the advertisement offices of the birmingham daily mail..the building was on the corner of cannon st soon to be rebuilt and re named fore st..cherry st is at the far end..

pic 1 the same scene but taken more recently..
 

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img925.jpgthis back court once stood where priory queensway is now..

Edit this photo is the rear of 12-13 Upper Priory Court. Viv.
 
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img926.jpgimg927.jpgimg928.jpgand now we have the imfamous pic of the gullet...i have posted this one before but it got lost in the hack..always found this most scary...this was situated at the site of the queen elizabeth law courts...

also court 7 back o 21 thomas st...

top left arrow...thomas st
bottom left arrow..the gullet..
 
Lyn

Referring to the first post on this thread. the second photo is Little Cannon Street which was later renamed Fore St. In the first photo the building on the corner (flower shop) used the be Pattisons Restaurant.
 
Phil - Pattisons used to be on the other corner of Fore Street, it was at the Corporation Street end. One of my relatives worked at Pattisons in the earlyish 1900's. I can't remember what is there now, but margaret Tregonning was still there the last time I went down Cannon Street. Pattisons used to have a Corporation Street address, I know that because I have postcards sent to this relative at work, and that's the addresss, Corporation Street.
 
I think these photos are just brilliant. They give a good idea of what the poorer folk used to have to put up with - you can just imagine, damp beds, cold houses, it doesn't bear thinking about. You can see why Joe Chamberlain wished to improve the lot of the working man.
 
shortie

There I am again with my foot where my mouth should be, of course you are right. Even though the building looks very much like a cleaned up version of this photo. You would think I would know better after all the time I spent in Pattisons upstairs eating their horrible green curry on plates of chips. The only reason we ate it was because it was the cheapest meal they sold and you could share it.

Phil
 

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img931.jpgimg932.jpglooking at these old 1880s pic next time i am in the city centre i think i shall in my mind travel back in time....
 
img930.jpgimg929.jpgfire station...little cannon st and the spot in corporation st where it would have been....the victorian firefighters not only had to hitch up the horse in a hurry but their station was a cul de sac..little cannon st (now fore st) ended with a brick wall where the C & A store is now...
 
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Phil said:
Lyn

Referring to the first post on this thread. the second photo is Little Cannon Street which was later renamed Fore St. In the first photo the building on the corner (flower shop) used the be Pattisons Restaurant.
Click to expand...

no phil both pics are of cannon st which is still there. and both pics showing cherry st in the distance...if you look at pic 2 you can see the street sign that little cannon st is on the right...

lyn
 
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It's easily done, Phil, and you get so much right that no-one will hold it against you! I think I was taken into there a few times as a child, but by whom I cannot remember. The lady who worked there was Gertrude Davies - although strictly speaking my gran's cousin, she became her 'sister' as my gran was brought up by her aunt after her parents died. I think she used to back for Pattisons, I think on the 1911 census she was described as a 'confectioner'. My mother remember Gertie baking cakes at home, not using a wooden spoon to beat the mix with, but her hands, which sounds pretty gross to me, because she used to smoke! She used her hand quite outstretched, so it was her thumb and little fingers that seemed to do most of the work.
 
bull st 001.jpga gentlemens garden reaches its final autumn..its classical summerhouse deserted..it was at the rear of nos 92/94 bull street and the largest in the area if not the city...this garden would now be in corporation st..between north western arcade leading through to martineau square..the houses in front of james burgoyne as he took this picture would now be the shops and offices which front corporation st and back onto martineu square..bull st was the dividing line between the nicer parts of the town and the start of the slums..
 
Lyn, this last one is one I have got another view of - the caption says 'Part of Coprporation Street in the mid-19th century. The classical summerhouse is on the left hand side of the picture and now I have seen them both, I get a better idea. I will try and scan them in later, but it might have to be tomorrow.
 
CorporationStreetsite_0001.jpg


I expect this is part of the same collection Lyn.

Now I have finally worked out how exactly to use this scanner I will spend a bit of time in a couple of days scanning others that I don't think have been on the Forum.
 
Great pics Lyn thank you - unbelievable to think what came before, although sometimes we think how concretey Brum seems, it must have been a great improvement in some places. Good on you shortie :-)
 
glad you like them stephen....good pic shortie as we now have a shot either side of the summerhouse...
 
I know Lyn, it's just amazing. How brilliant to know what was there originally. Now all we need is for someone to tell us who lived there. We have such brilliant people on this site that I am sure that will happen shortly.
 
the earliest kelly i have is 1892 a bit after these pics were taken but i will have a look later on...

lyn
 
I would think that as Corporation Street was built early 1880's or at least demolition started then, it might even be earlier than that. Somone with Find My Past might be able to see from the census as FMP allows an address to be searched unlike Ancestry. This is one of the most exciting finds for me, knowing just where these pictures were taken and then being able to know who lived in the vicinity even if not the house. If that makes me 'sad', well so be it!
 
must be lot of us saddies on here then shortie lol..after all this is a history forum and this is history....hope we have some luck..
 
Lyn it has occurred to me that the Cadbury residence and shop was in Bull Street. Thinking of the large garden, and the interest the Cadbury family had in making sure all their employees had a good sized garden so they could grow veggies that were healthy when they built Bournville, has made me wonder if this is the remains of the Cadbury garden? Does that make sense? Wouldn't it be lovely if this was indeed their garden?

Yes, Lyn, if I am sad, I am in good company! LOL
 
Great photos Lyn - Interesting to see how conditions were in those days before Chamberlain made a difference. Thank you for taking the time to put them on the Forum for us all to enjoy.
Anthea
 
happy to oblige anthea..it was another world back then wasnt it...

shortie there could be a cadbury connection...im sure if mike and a few other clever members see this they may help in trying to find out who lived at 92/94 bull st in the early 1880s...ive got dinner to sort soon and then watch the footie so will come back to this..its a mission now..

lyn
 
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Lovely pictures as always Lyn thank you. I've got to go and "do" the dinner too but I couldn't resist a quick look at FMP. It only goes up to about 88 on the address search so I went page by page after that. It's
shocking writing but I think it's Samuel Hunt (Hurt) Draper and a list of others at 92/3/4. Will that do for a start?!!
rosie.
 
rosie in the 1892 kellys ive got

at no 92..paragon trimming warehouse
93..barrow stores tea makers
94..william hunt funeral warehouse

but as shortie has said this date would be after the redevolpment started...the pics were taken 1880/1 so i think we need to go further back...

just out of interest what year did you look up...
lyn
 
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1869 Kelly's: Bull Street, near Page's Passage.

92 Oates & White, linen drapers & c
93 Richard Barrow Cadbury, tea merchant
94 William Hunt, funeral warehouse
 
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