Ages on Church marriage transcript

[OldBrummie2018]

Hello,

I wonder if anyone is able to shed some light on the ages given on a Church marriage transcript.

Attached is the 1851 marriage transcript of John Clark and Mary Jenkins , their ages are given as 32 and 28 respectively.

However a baptism record I have for Mary Jenkins states she was born July 1814 (baptised 1816), this would indicate Mary would have been 37 at time of marriage in September 1851

While the 1841 census lists both Mary and John as living at the same address and being aged 25, this is possibly not a good measure of age, as sometimes ages were rounded to the nearest 5 years on the 1841 census.

The 1851 census again has John and Mary living at the same address (6 Digbeth) and with ages of 36 and 37 respectively. This was just before their marriage: Mary is listed as ‘Head of family’ and John as ‘Partner’. Both are shown as condition ‘u’ (unmarried)

Unfortunately John Clark died in February 1859 with age at death stated as being 45.

While I do not have a definitive baptism record for John Clark, I am confident all the persons named here are the same people.

So apart from the marriage certificate all the ages match, but the marriage certificate differs by some 5 to 9 years. How could this have come about?

Speculation:

1. The couple are listed on 1841 census as living in same house and maybe they determined their ‘marriage’ started earlier than 1851, and gave incorrect ages?

2. The individual completing the marriage transcript made a mistake on ages? But would not this have been noticed by the signatories?

3. Anything else?

Thank you.

 

[Jason Ellis]

All sorts of factors apply:
*1841 census only gives DOB to nearest five years.
*Illiteracy means that some 19th C people wouldn't even know their birth date with certainty, particularly if they were orphaned.
*The officiant at a baptism would do his best but could only work with what he was provided.
*Transcription errors occur when the records are digitised.
*Marriage records often simply state "of full age", meaning (in 19th C) over 21. This often results in a DOB in the digitised record of exactly 21, whereas the individual was actually older. Or even in some cases younger (shotgun marriage).

The good news is that you are researching post 1837, so use https://www.gov.uk/research-family-history, which is generally more accurate than parish records and gives you the added benefit of confirming mother's maiden name. In my experience this has uncovered many second marriages that were not visible when relying solely upon censuses.

Finally, rely upon the advice of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle who put these words in the mouth of Sherlock Holmes, "when you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"
Good luck
Jason

 

[MWS]

You can only speculate when a relationship may or may not have begun and I'm not sure why she would lie about her age? If you were telling people you were already married and wanted to hide your late marriage you'd get married somewhere non local.

The only reason I can imagine that she'd lie is that she was embarrassed that she's older than her husband but that was not uncommon and as she's been living in the same place for 10 years everyone would probably know.

The most likely reason is it's just a simple mistake, either because the vicar misheard or he wrote the wrong number. Not sure if people got a copy of the church registration and if not the only opportunity to notice would have been at the signing and in the excitement easily missed.

 

[cba]

I have a copy of my grandparents 1912 marriage cert from St josephs RC long acre. My grandfather gave his age as 33 when he was actually 35 and my grandmother gave her age as 22 when she was actually 19. I think the marriage may have been without the familys' blessing as the witnesses are not recognisable family members.
The checks that we have now days were not done then. My grandfather came from a large Catholic Kidderminster family and my grandmother was not a catholic and came from Erdington this may have had something to do with the subterfuge!

 

[OldBrummie2018]

Hi All

Thank you all for your replies.

Both the ages of John Clark and Mary Jenkins are incorrect on the marriage transcript. Their ages should have been 36 and 38, respectively, as opposed to 32 and 28 as given on the marriage transcript.

One reason for falsely stating an age could have been embarrassment of age at first marriage, they are listed as bachelor / spinster. But as MWS pointed out, it you wished to do this then it would be better not to do it in a local church.

A error by whoever completed the marriage transcript is certainly feasible, (I have seen several instances of ‘crossing out’ where the wrong information was written in the wrong column). In this marriage transcript both the participants are tradespeople – they did run a successful Ironmongers shop. The witnesses are similar: Michael Jenkins is Mary’s uncle who ran a Cabinet and Furniture makers business (Jenkins and Ashford 58, 59 and 60 Digbeth); Rebecca Jenkins (nee Woodward) is Mary’s sister-in-law, whose father was a broker and husband (William Jenkins) was a wine merchant (681/2 Edgbaston Street) . It is strange no-one noticed the error. But there again at the occasion of a marriage who is really looking that closely?

The actual events are lost in the mist of time.

[As a postscript, John and Mary had three children, before John died 15th February 1859, a few days after their youngest child had died aged eight months on 11th February 1859. Mary never remarried, rather carried on running the Ironmongers shop* in Digbeth with her eldest son until at least 1881 before dying 1892 aged 78]

*this was the shop which belonged to Mary’s father, James Jenkins, started around 1820.