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Grogan family Chester Street

M

mariawilsonryan

proper brummie kid
Has anyone got any links or information on Chester st ( Aston manor) in late 1800’s by husbands grandmother was born there her birth certificate says “back 51” her father originally came from co mayo in Ireland an worked at the eagle foundry as a range fitter he also signed up in the Great War the family name was GROGAN I am just trying to piece together their timelines
 
I've moved your post to this Surname Interests section.

If there is specific information you would like to find about the family, please let us know and someone may be able to look up information for you. Names of your husband's grandmother and the full name of her father with any known relevant dates might be a good starting point.
 
Vivienne14 thank you for your kind replies so the family name was GROGAN and it was my husbands Great Grandfather who worked at the eagle foundry he was called Martin originally he came from Ireland he married a MARY DUNLEARY also of Irish decent they married at St Peter’s in Birmingham in 1892 or 1901 I do not have confirmation and lived in 14 Potters Lane Aston Manor also 81 Clarendon Street Aston they had a brood of about 9 children I have just started to make a timeline so some of my details are still incomplete so any local information would help I know one of the sons Edward worked as a Machinist in a Cycle Factory before he signed up and never returned

​

 
hi and welcome..i take it you know martin grogans ww1 service records are on ancestry and have read them ? according to the army record he married mary dunleavy on 13th feb 1902 at st peters..i found it quite sad reading letters sent by one of his daughters asking his where abouts but he must have come back ok as on the 1921 census he is living with wife mary and children..he has his birthplace down as leamington and mary has put she was born in birmingham

you probably also know this but son edwards soldiers effects and medal card is also on ancestery..killed in action in france 31st may 1917

lyn
 
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Astoness said:
hi and welcome..i take it you know martin grogans ww1 service records are on ancestry and have read them ? according to the army record he married mary dunleavy on 13th feb 1902 at st peters..i found it quite sad reading letters sent by one of his daughters asking his where abouts but he must have come back ok as on the 1921 census he is living with wife mary and children..he has his birthplace down as leamington and mary has put she was born in birmingham

you probably also know this but son edwards soldiers effects and medal card is also on ancestery..killed in action in france 31st may 1917

lyn
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Astoness thank you yes I am looking through his WW1 records ( not the clearest copies) & the letters are a nice piece of social history I looked at the leamington connection however I think he was born in Ireland but like most documents things get documented incorrectly I am trying to find his birth certificate but so far no luck I also had 2 dates on the marriage at St Peter’s so I have to try a confirm this I have my tree on ancestry but my paid membership is on hold at the moment as it is costly & I want to organise what info I have I have a list of Martin and Mary’s children & indeed their son Edward lost his life in France I was fortunate to visit the grave a few years also poor soul when right through the conflict & got wounded & died at a dressing station….. so I am now trying to make a timeline of the family however it does not help with fathers having the same names as sons etc martins father was also called Martin again with Irish decent
 
You actually don't need membership (just register) for the RC records - some are free.
Here is the church record not the civil cert (you would have to buy that from GRO).
1775205248858.png

In case your Latin is not good:
year 1892 day 13 month February ego (I) refers name of priest George Williams
joined in marriage Martin Grogan
son of Edward Grogan and Mary Dunleavy
daughter of Francis Dunleavy
in the presence of William Hussey
Maria Anna Raftery
 
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1871 Henry Street coventry
Edward Grogan age 28 b Ireland
Bridget age 27 b Ireland
children all born Leamington
Mary 6, martin 4,Anthony 1.

Martin joined The kings Liverpool regiment at Shrewsbury in 1914
wife given as Mary(Dunleavy)
children Agnes, Nellie, Garnet Francis.Eileen Winifred, Edwin martin

Martin was 'in trouble' a couple of times
1915 Absent from training with Fatigue - 3 days CB
1916 Overstayed pass- 7 days CB
 
mariawilsonryan said:
Astoness thank you yes I am looking through his WW1 records ( not the clearest copies) & the letters are a nice piece of social history I looked at the leamington connection however I think he was born in Ireland but like most documents things get documented incorrectly I am trying to find his birth certificate but so far no luck I also had 2 dates on the marriage at St Peter’s so I have to try a confirm this I have my tree on ancestry but my paid membership is on hold at the moment as it is costly & I want to organise what info I have I have a list of Martin and Mary’s children & indeed their son Edward lost his life in France I was fortunate to visit the grave a few years also poor soul when right through the conflict & got wounded & died at a dressing station….. so I am now trying to make a timeline of the family however it does not help with fathers having the same names as sons etc martins father was also called Martin again with Irish decent
Click to expand...
in that case i must be following the wrong family...if as you say martins father was also called martin..i had martins parents as edward and bridget both born ireland according to the 1871 census..just noticed the above posts and yes martins father was edward not martin as you thought

lyn
 
pjmburns said:
Certainy the 1892 marriage gives Martin's Father as Edward not Martin.
Click to expand...
Yes I noticed that I will check back on the paper records I have , I have found a burial record on find a grave for Martin in 1935 at Witton cemetery but no photo of headstone I will have to see if there is a plan & if the plot is still there
 
mariawilsonryan said:
Yes I noticed that I will check back on the paper records I have , I have found a burial record on find a grave for Martin in 1935 at Witton cemetery but no photo of headstone I will have to see if there is a plan & if the plot is still there
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yes i found that one and also one i think for his wife mary also at witton in 1938

lyn
 
i think this is the birth record for your martin grogan should you wish to purchase it..there is another martin grogan born in ireland same year parents martin and mary but given the information you have given us that is not your man

lyn

Martin Grogan
1867[1867]
Apr-May-Jun
Warwick, Warwickshire, England
6d
494
 
Astoness said:
yes i found that one and also one i think for his wife mary also at witton in 1938

lyn
Click to expand...
I thought his wife might be buried with him but I have no location As Witton is closed to new burials I have tried the council to see if there is a plot number as I know a lot of graves have been removed & I am not sure if there are family cousins etc still in the area that might have kept it going if so I can plan a visit as I am only in Lincolnshire … I think I am going to have to write all the info I some sort of order and see if the puzzle pieces fit together
 
pjmburns said:
You can search and purchase burial information here

Bereavement Services | Birmingham City Council

birminghamburialrecords.co.uk birminghamburialrecords.co.uk
Click to expand...
Thanks Janice I will also wait for some confirmation that the grave is still there as it looks as if martins wife Mary is also buried there in 1938 maybe I will find more Grogan’s as according to the list it’s a popular name but I don’t know if any family connection
 
1921 81 Clarendon Street
Martin Grogan age 54 , born Leamington, occcupation Kitchen Range fitter, employer Eagle Range.
Mary age 50
Nelly 17yr/6months
Garnet 15/5
Eileen 10/11
Edwin 8/6

This fits the person in your original post
 
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Alberta said:
1921 81 Clarendon Street
Martin Grogan age 54 Kitchen Range fitter employer Eagle Range.
Mary age 50
Nelly 17yr/6months
Garnet 15/5
Eileen 10/11
Edwin 8/6
Click to expand...
Thanks Alberta I have counted up to about 7 children in their marriage my husbands grandmother was Elizabeth who moved to London and married Cecil Wilson I just have to see if I can find census access after 1921 until Martin and Mary’s deaths in 1935 & 1938 as most of the living children moved down to London apart from Edward (WW1 casualty)
 
pjmburns said:
You actually don't need membership (just register) for the RC records - some are free.
Here is the church record not the civil cert (you would have to buy that from GRO).
View attachment 221129

In case your Latin is not good:
year 1892 day 13 month February ego (I) refers name of priest George Williams
joined in marriage Martin Grogan
son of Edward Grogan and Mary Dunleavy
daughter of Francis Dunleavy
in the presence of William Hussey
Maria Anna Raftery
Click to expand...

pjmburns said:
There are no published censuses after the 1921.
But there is the 1939 register.
On Ancestry you can access erolls.
Click to expand...
Thanks i am getting confused between looking for census dates in the Uk & ireland the irish 1901/1911 are readly available free online oh.. regarding the FMP access i can not seem to register free before i did a free trial but i can not do another on my e mail address
 
pjmburns said:
If you did a free trial surely that address and password will let you in?
Click to expand...
ha ah ... i can view some of the details ... i am just trying to sort through all the bits of information that i have collected & i am starting to see where some confusion on the dates are Martin ( lets call him jnr) my husbands gt grandad i believe married mary dunleavy then his father also Martin ( lets call him snr) married a mary darcy now Martin snr's father was Edward Grogan so with the 1892 marriage cert i am bit confused if he married the right "Mary" however i have original birth certs for Elizabeth ( my husbands grandmother) & Edward ( the chap from WW1) who were Martin jnr's children & the mother on the birth certificates is Mary Dunleavy & to top it all i have a birth cert for Martin jnr which gives his birth in ireland Cloonbullig Ballyhaunis County Mayo in 1867 but then the 1911 uk census states his birth place as leamington but nationality irish .......those "paddys" sure like to confuse matters .... time for a large G& T me thinks
 
The Martin who married Mary Dunleavy has Father Edward. That is on the marriage cert.
The children on the 1921 census are registered mmn Dunleavy.
Why do you think the Martin who married Mary Dunleavy has Father Martin?
Post #11 has Martin with parents Edward and Bridget in Coventry and a young Martin born in Leamington.
 
pjmburns said:
The Martin who married Mary Dunleavy has Father Edward. That is on the marriage cert.
The children on the 1921 census are registered mmn Dunleavy.
Why do you think the Martin who married Mary Dunleavy has Father Martin?
Post #11 has Martin with parents Edward and Bridget in Coventry and a young Martin born in Leamington.
Click to expand...

unless i have the wrong Martin Grogan ???

1775236760752.png
 
Is that an Irish address?
If so then it doesn't fit with the census info where "your Martin" repeatedly says he was born in Leamington.
He is Irish because his parents came from Ireland
 
pjmburns said:
Is that an Irish address?
If so then it doesn't fit with the census info where "your Martin" repeatedly says he was born in Leamington.
He is Irish because his parents came from Ireland
Click to expand...
Yes it is in county mayo which also appears in my husband’s DNA results dunno maybe I am not on the right path I think if I dig into Martin jnrs life in Aston I know the connection with the eagle foundry is correct and his daughter Elizabeth and son Edward plus the other daughter who wrote the letter in his military records & that he was laid to rest in Witton I just need to see if his parents show up in other documents to confirm
 
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