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charles jesse williams.

H

hewittbj39

knowlegable brummie
hi all I wonder if any one can help me find Charles Jesse Williams born 1903 in Birmingham on the 1911 census. His father was Jack Williams and his mother was Florence I have tried to find them on ancestry but no joy . I have managed to trace them on the Electoral rolls from 1920 onwards when living in Pickford St with a John Curley and on the 1939 census a Florence Williams is living again with John Curley, Charles sister is Ivy Lillian Williams who married Sidney Mole in 1926 no sign of her either on the 1911 any help at all would be very much appreciated many thanks.
Regards Acklam19
 
no luck yet with the 1911 but could this be charles bapt. ?..born 1903 bapt 1903...i know you said his fathers name was jack but but i think that johns were also called jack..no idea why..looks like the bapt has his surname as a double barrelled name of jesse -williams

lyn
 

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also could this be charles j williams on the 39 with wife and 1 daughter who married and became carter ?

tna_r39_5509_5509b_010.jpg
 
He did marry a Lily Beatrice Florence French so most probably.

Can't see John Curley in 1911 either, so if Florence has left her husband for him by then, they could be under assumed names or have purposely avoided being listed. Either can happen.
 
Yes, Lyn I think so. John Henry Williams and Florence Williams seem to marry earlier the same year. How Charles' name is listed is maybe just a mistake. He and Ivy are registered as just Williams.
 
ok thanks mark...so we have charles bapt and with his wife lily on the 39

still no luck finding him on the 1911 but its early days yet

lyn
 
MWS said:
Yes, Lyn I think so. John Henry Williams and Florence Williams seem to marry earlier the same year. How Charles' name is listed is maybe just a mistake. He and Ivy are registered as just Williams.
[/QUOTe

mark do you have a dob for ivy lilian williams

lyn
Click to expand...
 
in 1935 pickford st

charles jesse william
florence williams
florence lilian beatrice williams
john curley.. (who could be just a lodger)
 
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I find Charles birth in Birmingham a bit of a mystery because his parents are given a John Emanuel Williams and Florence Susannah Wells who married in Aston 1881.
In 1901 they are in Islington with following children
the first bernard h b Birmingham 1889
the others born islington
Florence E 1890
Rose b 1891
Daisy G 1894
May Lavinia 1900.

Why Charles was born in Birmingham is a mystery

May Lavinia was not baptised until 15th June 1904
Her birth shown as 24th sept 1899

In 1911 census May Lavinia is in Barnados home in London
her parents John Emanuel died in 1904 age 47 and her mother Florence Susannah in 1906 age 42.
I have tried to find Charles but no joy, perhaps he had been taken in by relatives and was entered with their surname
 
hi alberta mark (see post 4) seems to think charles parents are john henry williams and florence...but you say they are john emanuel and florence susannah wells..

need to have look at this again and we could do with the original poster giving their thoughts or maybe i have got myself confused

lyn
 
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Alberta said:
I find Charles birth in Birmingham a bit of a mystery because his parents are given a John Emanuel Williams and Florence Susannah Wells who married in Aston 1881.
In 1901 they are in Islington with following children
the first bernard h b Birmingham 1889
the others born islington
Florence E 1890
Rose b 1891
Daisy G 1894
May Lavinia 1900.

Why Charles was born in Birmingham is a mystery

May Lavinia was not baptised until 15th June 1904
Her birth shown as 24th sept 1899

In 1911 census May Lavinia is in Barnados home in London
her parents John Emanuel died in 1904 age 47 and her mother Florence Susannah in 1906 age 42.
I have tried to find Charles but no joy, perhaps he had been taken in by relatives and was entered with their surname
Click to expand...
The Charles Williams born with mmn Wells has birth registered in Medway.
1717419692531.png

This is the one referred to in post #1 I think
1717419665830.png
This reg fits with the dob of 2nd July 1903 gven on the 1939 reg posted by Lyn in post #4
 
Hi all thank you all for your useful and prompt replies. MWS. not on FMP so another source has gone, John Curley1874 living with mother in Darwin st on 1911 and it looks like Florence took the Curley name on the 1920, 22, 25, 27 electoral rolls and on 1927 includes Charles Jesse as a Curley.( the plot deepens). I also think Curley is the house tenant. Astoness.I have looked at that baptism several times and was unsure but as MWS says it looks like a mistake so I am leaning towards that now after your input. In 1930, 1935, and 1939 she has gone back to Williams so making it more confusing even though she is still with John Curley.
Pjmburns . Just received your message, great, thanks for that it makes things from my point of view slot into place, I have looked at john Henry many times but something did not click but I think with everyones help its finally come together. Many thanks. Regards Acklam19.
 
John Williams is listed on Long Street on the 1901 census, living with a sister and brother in law (James Whitehouse, marriage witness). The other witness, Amy Rose Satterthwaite, (Williams crossed out) is also John's sister, rather than Florence's.

Coincidently, had to catch the bus for the first time in ages today and went past Long St.

In 1901 Florence is possibly on Upper Highgate St. Her parents appear to have not married until long after she was born.
 
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here is the 1921 census in case its of use...transcript and the original

note florence is down as still married

lyn

add is house 5 court 5 pickford street

Household members (4 people)
First name(s) Last name Relationship to head Sex Birth year Age in years Birth place Occupation Employer
Florence Williams
Wife
Female 1882 39 - Wormer Hattons Screw Works, Rea St South
Charles Jess Williams
Son
Male 1904 17 - Perambulator Works -
Ivy William Williams
Daughter
Female 1903 17 - Press Worker Banks & Davis, Tin Works River St
John Curley
Lodger
Male 1874 47 - General Labourer J Chalwins Coal Merchants, Old Wharf Bham



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As per post #1
I see Florence is on the 1939 reg with John Curley and listed as widow.
Address is Coventry Road
1717505695407.png
 
HI all . Well I cannot thank you all enough for what you sent me over the last couple days it confirmed all I have been dithering over for some weeks now and Astoness the 1921 census was brilliant its the first one I have ever seen, full of useful info. Regards Acklam19.
 
Just looking at possible deaths for John Henry

Possible - from marriage cert he was born about 1880 so this age fits
1717508611079.png
 
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