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Villa Cross

Ray Griffiths

Ray Griffiths

master brummie
Villa_Cross_28129.jpg
 
I was surprised to learn that the Vila Cross Tavern has probably not always been a tavern. I was reading about Charles Geach MP in Edward's Personal Recollections of B'ham and B'ham men (1891) and in that it claims that Geach married Mr. Skally's daughter, who kept a school at Villa Cross which is 'now the Villa Cross Tavern'. As well as becoming an MP, Geach was a founder of the Birmingham & Midland Bank (later Midland Bank, and now HSBC). Here are two nice photos from the Digital Handsworth site (but I have seen these on BHF before, pre-hacking days) of the Tavern. It's not too hard to imagine the building as a home. Geach married the schoolmaster's daughter sometime around 1830, so the building must at least date back to that time. Viv.

Villa_Cross_Tavern_1890_from_Digital_Handsworth_site.jpg


c1910_Villa_Cross_Tavern_from_Digital_Handsworth_site.jpg
 
Yes Viv . it does look very like it was originally a house. In 1867 it was the Villa Cross Inn, and in 1862 the Lozells Inn. Earlier directories do not cover this area, or at least I cannot find it, so cannot go back further
mike
 
Thanks Lloyd. It looks like the house has been halved, maybe bomb damage? Or maybe it was partially demolished when the cinema was built. There have been many adaptations to the front of the Villa Cross Tavern too. This gable was added (a 1984 photo from Digital Handsworth site). I'm guessing but this might have been added around the 1930s as several of the pubs around the area had Dutch gables. Looking at the canopy, perhaps it was trying to fit in with Villa Cross cinema across the road. Quite a few fireplaces must have been added since it was first built too judging by the number of chimneys on the present day building. I'd hazard a guess that the tavern dates from around the early to mid 1800s, but don't quote me on that! Viv.

Villa_Cross_Tavern_1984.jpg
 
Excellent photo Big Fella. The cinema really was a wonderful addition, great style and interest. The Villa Cross Hotel has yet another type of porch. The front seens to have gone through quite a few changes in its time. Viv.
 
great pic of the villa cross big fella..such a shame the cinema is no longer there..for members who may have missed it if you go to the villa cross cinema thread i have posted pics of the demolision of the cinema...

lyn
 
Yes Big Fella there are a few threads covering The Villa Cross/ Villa Road subject. Bit of cross referencing might be of interest to readers, although sadly quite a few of the photos were lost from these after the site was hacked. Viv.

https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=37268&highlight=Handsworth+Villa+Road This thread shows a couple of wonderful interior views (posted by Astoness).There are also a couple of demolition views on there, again posted by Astoness.

https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=34107&highlight=Handsworth+Villa+Road
 
A wonderful evocative photo Caroline, i used to go there every Saturday morning for the Matinee ( 6d ) or (9d ) on the balcony .
I even travelled there from Erdington with my new girlfriend on our first date, we saw Psycho !! i went on to marry her our marriage lasted just short of 40 years, when SHE went Psycho LOL. Thanks for the Pic.
 
I took this Photo last year (2011), i know it only looks like a gate but to me as a kid it led to excitement, beyond was a stone staircase that went up to the carpark of The Villa Cross pub.
 

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Big Fella said:
A wonderful evocative photo Caroline, i used to go there every Saturday morning for the Matinee ( 6d ) or (9d ) on the balcony .
I even travelled there from Erdington with my new girlfriend on our first date, we saw Psycho !! i went on to marry her our marriage lasted just short of 40 years, when SHE went Psycho LOL. Thanks for the Pic.
Click to expand...

Are you taking any blame for her state of mind?
 
Not for one second. LOL the Menopause comes to mind, i should i call it the Metamorphosis ? it was in her case cus i never knew anyone " Change " so much.
 
Lovely photo Stitcher. I grew up in Handsworth and walked down Villa Road regularly - also went on the tram from the Villa Road terminus to Lozells. I wonder what date this photo would've been taken?

Judy
 
I have no idea Jayell, I have always been one for intending to do things in a minute and with many of my pictures I should have dated them when I got them because something else always turns up to distract me.
 
mikejee said:
Yes Viv . it does look very like it was originally a house. In 1867 it was the Villa Cross Inn, and in 1862 the Lozells Inn. Earlier directories do not cover this area, or at least I cannot find it, so cannot go back further
mike
Click to expand...


Hi Mikejee. Are you certain of the dates? Another website states that it was called the Villa Cross Tavern by 1879.
https://billdargue.jimdofree.com/placenames-gazetteer-a-to-y/places-v/villa-cross/

862-0.jpg
Resource Details - Birmingham Images
The photo above shows it as the Villa Cross Inn. If these dates are correct then the street lamp show on the LHS might be the original founders lamp of Aston Villa FC. If this can be proved it would be fantastically significant for Villa fans. The name Villa Cross Inn is on the sign on the LHS of the inn. The road on the left is Heathfield Road. Where the three roads cross was called Villa Cross. However, I have also been told by a historian of note that the cab stand, shown on the right of the Inn on Lozells Road was not there in 1873 but it was there in 1882. Even so it does appear as if this might be the closest photo to 1874 when the four founders decided to recommend that Aston Villa Wesleyan Chapel's cricket club played soccer not rugger. This is the only photograph I can find where there is NOT a street lamp in front of the tavern, inn, hotel. There are also no chimney pots on top of the chimney stacks of the inn. The three main street lamps are all of the same design. There is vegetation climbing the front wall. In all the other photos the chimney pots are there, there is a street lamp in front of the Inn, there are no climbers, and in some the position of the LHS lamp has been moved. This is a plea from my Villan heart. Please help to date this photograph.
 
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I would have been going by directories,which can refer to a year or so previous yo the publication date, but the reference you gave refers only to 1879 and not before.
 
Thanks for that, Mike. Is there a way to find the years for which the building was definitely called the Villa Cross Inn? We know it was in1867. Do you know if it's name change to the Villa Cross Tavern in 1879 as stated in the link?
 
Myrddin
I think that is difficult to determine, as the " everywhere. official " name may not be used (indeed WILL not be used). Looking at newspaper reports from the newspaper archives it is listed as the Villa Cross Inn in papers there from 1849 to 1894 (see below).

Birm post. 15.2.1894.jpgBirm. J.21.4.1849.jpg

Searching for Villa Cross Tavern we get a mention in 1849 (below) and then 5 in period 1850-1859, 5 in period 1860-69, 4 in period 1870-79, None in period 80-89 (though that may be because relevant newspapers were not in the rchive, which is far from complete), 5 in period 1890-99

Aris Birm Gazette. 10.9.1849.jpg
 
Oh dear. My hopes are dashed. But thanks so much for showing me the error of my ways. It's really kind of you to help out a mad Villa fan whom you've never even met. For the moment then I just want to determine if the photo in yesterday's post really is the earliest photo and if so to date it approximately.

Ogden.jpg
Resource Details - Birmingham Images
The above photo is listed as 1894. It shows the Inn had been bought up by Holt Brewers and the manager was John Ogden in 1894. Compared to the first photograph I posted, this one shows a new lamp post in front of the Inn, the climbers are gone and the clock face too, the cab stand is just visible, chimney pots still missing, the globe light on the front right of the Inn has gone, but it's metal attachment to the wall remains, as does the lettering - MERCHANTS. For these reasons I think the first photo is earlier, but not much so. On the first photo the text on the wall is maybe - FOX Co's. ENTIRE. and perhaps it means 'We sell the entire range of Fox company's ales". Perhaps it means the Inn was owned by Fox Co. brewers. Perhaps something entirely different, no pun intended. If so can these companies/signs be used confirm or challenge the listing of c1890? Any further help gratefully received. Fingers crossed.
 
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You may not have seen this, but might also be of interest to others. It was originally posted in the Villa Road, Handsworth thread by Richard McNeill - post #39. It refers to this Iron Room article https://theironroom.wordpress.com/2012/11/15/guest-blogger-the-original-aston-villa/

Villa Road Handsworth

thanks viv thats is very interesting..i will print that off and put it in my ever bulging folder that i have which contains 10 years of research (still ongoing) i have done on the area where i grew up.. so that snippet was dated 1832 and as richard said in post 31 the aston villa school was...
birminghamhistory.co.uk birminghamhistory.co.uk

For info re the building, I’m almost certain we came to the conclusion on another thread that the building had been significantly modified in a number of respects over time. The frontage especially changed and so might have street furniture have changed because of this. But shall have to track down the discussion to be more specific about changes and dates though.

Viv,
 
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And for those interested in the Wesleyan Chapel connection already mentioned, it’s explained here in this extracted contribution by Whiskeypapa in the Aston Lower Grounds thread :

In 1874 a new sports club had been founded by the Villa Cross Wesleyan Chapel Cricket Club in Birmingham whose members yearned for some sporting activity in the winter. The first sporting event played by the new club was a rugby match against Aston Brook St Mary's Rugby Club, followed the next week by a football match. It was decided that football was the way forward. The team prospered and took on the lease of grounds at Wellington Road, Perry Barr. The club's management instigated the football league and of course the renamed Aston Villa was a founding member. By the end of the century they had won three FA cup finals and 5 league finals. This success enabled the club to buy its own ground and as the site of Mr Quilters enterprise was available it was purchased outright in 1897, the year the club won both the FA Cup and the League.

Extracted from https://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/index.php?threads/aston-lower-grounds.15945/page-2
 
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