• Welcome to this forum . We are a worldwide group with a common interest in Birmingham and its history. While here, please follow a few simple rules. We ask that you respect other members, thank those who have helped you and please keep your contributions on-topic with the thread.

    We do hope you enjoy your visit. BHF Admin Team

Passey Rd Sparkhill

Not sure if I have said this before , but the two were often interchangeable. My cousin's son was named Henry after him (as so often happened), but the elder was always called Harry, and the son Henry, to distinguish them
 
Good morning Jim,

I mentioned in post #4 the pharmacy on the corner of Knowle Road and the newsagents next door. Well your wife's father, Vivian Charles SMITH must have served me as a 12 year old boy to sweets, newspapers, and sherbet. Both Arthur Price (the phamacist) and Vivian had the same number - 940 Stratford Road - in the 1949 Kelly's Directory, although Price's entrance was right on the corner of Knowle Road and Stratford Road, and Vivian's entry was definitely on Stratford Road. Amazing coincidence, and sweets were still on the ration then!

Vera Gladys SMITH gave birth to DERRICK in Sheffield in the 4th Qtr 1921, Vol 9c Page 1133, so unless she travelled back from NZ or wherever to have the child, she couldn't have travelled to NZ until very late in 1921 or 1922. Still looking.....

Maurice
 
Mike,

Agreed, but unless he had another forename, of which we have no evidence so far, a further search of NZ Deaths between 1921 and 1926 has only produced Henry SMITHs who were 80 plus years of age when they died.

Maurice
 
I have never seriously looked into ancestry, however I was fortunate in coming across a fifth cousin; my paternal grandmother and her grandfather were brother and sister. She was able to furnish me with a full family history of both my grandparents back to the end of the 17th. century. Some difficulties in researching, I am sure, arise from irregularities. In the case of my father he had two forenames but was known to everyone - except officialdom - as Jack. My grandmother was widowed during WW1 but remarried again. However, her first married name (the same as mine) was never used by her three sons by the first marriage when at school and were always knows by the second husbands surname. Most unlikely to happen today of course. Which illustrates the difficulties that can occur with memories rather than factual archives and other paperwork.
Incidentally, a few people who knew my father often call me Jack. :)
 
Not sure if I have said this before , but the two were often interchangeable. My cousin's son was named Henry after him (as so often happened), but the elder was always called Harry, and the son Henry, to distinguish them

The reason I suggested Henry for Harry was that until I did some research my Dad never knew his Uncle Harry was actually John Henry on his birth certificate. As you say, they, like John/Jack are or were interchangeable.
 
Hello everyone who contributed to this search for the mysterious Harry Smith, I have carried on with my Quest since I was on here and have found out a few more facts:-
Harry Smith b 1893
Veragh Gladys b1896
Married 1918
Harry was in R.A.M.C
His address in 1917 is 106
Hunsdon Rd Woolwich
Veragh lived at 83 Bolsover Rd Sheffield
On 18/8/1921 Harry emigrated to New Zealand onboard RMS Remuera landing in Lyttleton on 3/10/1921Where he allegedly died
(Or may have moved on to Australia)
Veragh Gladys and Vera Jessie Brooks moved to Bimingham to Passey Rd as far as I know after 1927
In 1935 they were at 234 Knowle Rd.
So Harry still remains a mystery and So does the story of Passey Rd



Veragh Gladys and her mother Veragh Jessie emoved to Birmingham sometime after 1927
As far as I still know to Passey Rd
 
Hello again,

The 1927 & 1930 Electoral Rolls are the only ones online as far as I know, I haven't checked Ancestry, but the only SMITH in Passey Road was a John William SMITH seemingly living alone in 1927 only. If they were ever in Passey Road, I suggest it was for a very short period and could easily fall between the years I have mentioned. Normally the Electoral Roll forms were completed in the previous October, i.e. October 1926 to appear in the 1927 version. The only reasonably safe way of checking this year by year is from the Rolls themselves in the Library of Birmingham Archives. I'll have another search later this evening and see if I can come up with anything.

Maurice :cool:
 
Hello again,

The 1927 & 1930 Electoral Rolls are the only ones online as far as I know, I haven't checked Ancestry, but the only SMITH in Passey Road was a John William SMITH seemingly living alone in 1927 only. If they were ever in Passey Road, I suggest it was for a very short period and could easily fall between the years I have mentioned. Normally the Electoral Roll forms were completed in the previous October, i.e. October 1926 to appear in the 1927 version. The only reasonably safe way of checking this year by year is from the Rolls themselves in the Library of Birmingham Archives. I'll have another search later this evening and see if I can come up with anything.

Maurice :cool:
Jim Houston
 
Jim,

I've searched the whole of the Birmingham Electoral Rolls for all years & both spellings of Vera. Both of them only appear in the 1930 and 1935 Electoral Rolls at 234 Knowle Road, which means that they were at least at that address by October 1929. No other address is mentioned for either of them. So unless they were in Passey Road for say 1928 and/or early 1929, which I can't check, then they either were never there or they never returned an Electoral Registration Form. I'll look at the New Zealand deaths tomorrow as it is almost midnight here in Crete.

EDIT: I just had a look at New Zealand between 1 October 1921 and 31 December 1930 and only these are listed:-

1922 Harry Ernest SMITH aged 64 years
1924 Harry SMITH aged 19 years
1925 Harry SMITH aged 85 years and the cloest one in the following ten years to end of 1940 is still wrong:-
1933 Harry SMITH aged 37 years.

Australia will have to wait until tomorrow! :)

Maurice :cool:
 
Last edited:
Hello Maurice, we have had communications before as I think I remember you are an old Sparkhill lad, thanks very much for your time and efforts on this, The Smiths are my wife's family and very little is known about there movements I can only relate what my wife's Father Vivian told my wife.Harrys Wife Veragh Gladys did marry again to Leslie G Field I need to find out on her marriage Certificate if she is listed as a widow for sure.Harrywas 29 In 1921 so any deaths of Smith and their ages can be cross checked from then.I have acopy of his marriage Certificate his Father is Harry Smith of Vickers Rd Sheffield and a wedding announcement in the Sheffield Telegraph . has his parents down as Mr and Mrs Smith so no clues to a name of his mother but from what I have researched I think his Father Married again when Harry jnr was young after his real Mother possibly named Kate died.There is a Harry Denis Smith listed at 32 Vickers Rd in 19 with an Elizabeth(Irons) Smith.
Kind Regards Jim
 
Jim,

Yes, I lived at 215 Knowle Road throughout the 1940s. Antipodean death index information is very sparse unless you buy the certificate. I haven't looked at Oz yet because several other things have got in the way, but I hope to do so over the next two or three hours.

Maurice :cool:
 
Maurice, I lived at 664 Stratford Road just up from the Bear opposite the Park from 1952 to 57 with my Aunt Jean .Sparkhill was a good area and the Park was a great place to play especially in the pond.Do you remember the Sons of Rest building and the bandstand? I served my apprenticeship at A firm in Greswolde Rd.Happy Days.
Jim
 
Yes indeed, Jim, and in the 1940s the funfair was a regular visitor - I think that was Pat Collins.

Getting back to Australian Deaths, there are 121 listed on FindMyPast including the dozen or so in NZ, but there is a big problem - very few have birth dates/ages and the only means of possibly identifying a feasibly correct one is the parents' forenames. Any idea of those or even where he was born?

Maurice :cool:
 
Harry's Father was definitely Harry Smith possibly with Dennis as a middle name
His mother once again possibly Kate(nee)Clarke she died 1902 in Nottingham
Harry snr married Kate Clarke in Nottingham 1892 from free BMD
Harry jnr birth registered in Basford from GRO Index
Harry snr married to Elizabeth Irons on 6the Aug 1906 at Mountsorrel.
I hope some of this may help Maurice.
JIM
 
Jim,

A search of Oz/NZ didn't turn up anything verifiable, just one in 1927 in Queeensland with absolutely no details (so could have been any age), and similarly one in Queensland in 1930 and one in Warren, NSW also in 1930, but no other details.

I then turned to the UK to see if I could actually verify his birth, but this seems difficult as a Kate nee Clarke died in 1 Qtr 1892 so was highly unlikely to have been the mother of Harry born in 1893, especially as she was aged 50 at death.. However there is this birth in 1892 of a Harry SMITH with a mother's maiden name of CLARKE, which makes more sense. But then we have to assume that Kate didn't die within the next two years because the deaths are of elderly women. So I have look closer to the date he married Elizabeth IRONS, unless you have any concrete evidence to prove otherwise. So until tomorrow I'm going to take a break from this.

Maurice :cool:
Smith_Birth.jpg
 
I think Kate Clarke died in 1902 as
Harry Dennis Smith remarried in 1906 to Elizabeth Irons.In 1911 Census they are at 32 Vickers rd
Sheffield with 18 yr old Harry junior.
JIM
 
Jim,

Yes, I lived at 215 Knowle Road throughout the 1940s. Antipodean death index information is very sparse unless you buy the certificate. I haven't looked at Oz yet because several other things have got in the way, but I hope to do so over the next two or three hours.

Maurice :cool:
Knowle Road 1940.jpgKnowle Road 1950 map.jpg

Maurice are you aware of this photograph taken in 1940? Recently I made a friend of the gentleman whose Grandmother lived at 203 Knowle Road, 3 houses to the left bombed my grandmothers house backed off to the Springfield club on Solihull Road. No 203 was the air raid wardens house which my Grandmother took over Mrs Ethel Holmes.
The shed at the back on the left was still there when my Grand parents left in 1968.
 
Back
Top