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Does anyone remember this pub, The Railway Tavern, see attached.
It was and still is on the corner of Park Rd, Norton St and Wharf St.
I spent many an hour and a few bob in here, usually just before going to the match at the Hawthornes, that's West Bromwich Albion (baggies) for those that don't like soccer.
My grandparents at one time lived at 298 Park Road just to the right of the pub.
Hi phil b
i remember the taveren alright went inafew times and a couple of girls friends of mine moved from upper sutton st aston
facing the pub they was patty janet and maggie and there dad was a big guy called fred and his son was also called fred
and also do you remember mr betts the haulage company whom set up this multity million pound bussinesss with wo lorries
that was across the rd from the pub willie betts daughter liveds by me and sheas worked for me
we often talk about the od end meaning hockley and park rdand i remembe were sylv worked as well and a old friend of mine set up a big ware house just along from the pub ronnie chadwick a very wealthy guy now at the end of the houses
best wishes astonian
Sorry I don't know the names you mention, what years are we talking about. I lived in Park Road from 1952 to 1969.
I was 17 when we moved, yes I was drinking at a very early age but I managed to get away with it as I was tall for my age. My first 1/2 pint was passed to me from the back door of the pub by my dad when I was about 15.
By way of a tribute to my brother who died in 2008, the account below was written by him in 2002. It's a copy from the Ted Rudge website for Winson Green about what he thought of our time in Park Road . https://www.ted.rudge.btinternet.co.uk/id24.htm "PARK ROAD (the Flat end)
Looking back you do not realize how small our bit of the world that we lived in was, I reckon that if put a circle with a half mile radius on top of where you lived most people would have lived at least ninety percent of their lives within that circle.
Mine, for instance, I was born in Dudley Road Hospital in 1945 and taken to live at 2/214 Park Road, Hockley for the next twenty year's, ours wasn't a very crowded back to back courtyard like some other's around the area, ours had two houses but only one outside toilet, luckily it was attached to our house, a lot of gentle coughing went on to inform other's that it was occupied but on the good side both house's had their own tin baths but sadly there was no hot water as it all had to be boiled on the gas ring or over the open fire as we only had one cold water tap over the sink.
Our house also had a cellar, where the coal was keep, quite scary at night when you we told to go down the cellar to fill the bucket with only a candle for company, my mom also kept large crock bowls in which she used to pickle eggs and onions.
Although the women were always house proud, insofar as cleanliness, when it came to decoration the houses were that damp that any paper or paint that was put on the walls would peel or flake within months. There was no garden at all just a brick covered thirty by twenty foot court yard
My mom and dad both worked at Rabone's by Hockley Brook, dad being a senior toolmaker and mom a press operator. When I was old enough to get about every thing you wanted was available to us within a couple of hundred yards up or down Park Road, our house was situated on the left hand side of the road just passed Abbey Street, as if you were coming from the Flat. Just up the road, next door to the Sandpitts, was Wessons, which was just like your little corner shop where you could just about get anything in small quantities, further up on the corner of Wharf Lane was Wilkes the paper and haberdashery shop, on the other side of Wharf Lane was Jeff's green grocers and general store, most of the women did their weekly shop there. They all stood, patiently, in a queue all holding their shopping lists which they handed over to Mr or Mrs Jeff (short for Jefferson, I think) or one of their helpers, they would then proceed to dash around the shop getting all on the list.
Mr Jeff was like a human calculator, his main job was to price and add up the shopping lists upon completion, bearing in mind it was pounds, shillings, pence and all the other bits like ha'pennies and farthings, he used to put the price next to the item on the list and add it up at the same time, so by the time he'd got to the bottom the total was put straight underneath, all done at incredible speed, it was a pleasure to watch him at work. I used to have to go there every other day or so to get the bread and on the way home I used to pick the crusty bits off the top of the loaf, many a time I had a clip around the ear for bringing home a bald loaf.
In the other direction and on the other side of the road opposite Abbey Street we had our fish shop and the outdoor, fish and chips for 9d. (6d. for fish and 3d. for chips), about 4p. in today's money, if you were lucky you could get a pile of bits chucked on top.
On the other side of the road, just passed Abbey Street was our sweet shop, can't think of the old guy's name who owned it, I used to go there every week with my pocket money, sixpence on a good week threepence on a bad week, armed with the ration book and try and get as much as I could for my money.
On the way down the road you would pass many more shops, all of a similar nature to those previously described, all making a meager living from the thronging population, nearly opposite Goode Street was the second hand shop, filled from top to bottom with only what could be called junk, us kids used to spend many an happy hour mooching amongst the artifacts, I think the little old lady who owned it liked the company but I think she had a cheek putting ' Antiques and Quality Second Hand Items' on the window.
Onward passed Whitmore Street many more shops selling shoes and the like, ladies hairdressers, men's barbers and another fish and chip shop, used to be owned, I think, by a chap called Reggie, it was the only shop I'd ever been in that had a fryer fueled by coal, the only problem with it was that when the wind was blowing in the wrong direction you chocked to death as the shop filled with smoke but it was worth putting up with as the chips were the best I've ever tasted.
A few yards further on and you were on The Flat, all the shops you've ever wanted, what ever you want you could get it there, all greatly explained by others elsewhere but I know I used to love going down The Flat. There was enough pubs within the vicinity to satisfy the most ardent pub crawler.
I was glad to leave the area when I got married at twenty and moved to my own brand new house, which I built myself, with all mod cons like an inside toilet, bathroom, hot water and believe or not central heating, I now look back with fondness at those times and feel glad to have experienced those, now called, hardships, Keith."
Hi phil b
many thanks for your great thread and the story you have written first of all all this lenght of time i have heard of ted rudges site
of winson green i often thought is this the ted rudge whom i knew years ago and by golly it really is and johny dunkley and bill wyman
and dear old chris price i have just dotted is e mail address so i il be contacting him as well are all close friends whom we all associated together
but i will keep it short i did logg on to teds pages and what you have done for me was to flash my past life through my mind
because virtualy all the recipents whom have posted there memoirs on them i knew personaly the froggatts i know them all from the area
my brother told me a very long time ago about this winson green site but ever got around to itand he said i would know every body and cor blimmey he was right also he said the lady wood site i would know every body so in the next few days i wll go through these two sites and restore olf friends and
memories to the full with all these friends and familys phil i have to scoot off now but i will be in touch with you soon
i think our fellow friend and a good friend indeedon this site will also be intrested in seeing this site and the mention of aberdeen st will be our maggie uk as i think she also knows of chris price and and johnny dunkley whom is no longer with us as we discovered john dying with cancer
we spent time with him reliving memoirs of the those people being mentioned and our growing up with the other members of the gang
whom we have not mentioned thanks again phill best wishes astonian
Phil, I sent over to my cousin in Canada your late brother's Park Road memories - and this was her reply. I can absolutely remember everything. Who is Keith ? We lived at 170 Park Road and I bought a second hand bike from the Second hand shop opposite Goode St - it was a mans bike and I remember when I first had it I kept running it into the pavement and really hurting myself. I also remember going up to the sweet shopup by Abbey St - I think that is the name of street and I also used to take the ration book up every Sunday to get 6d of sweets. I remember getting some fish and chips from that shop just round the corner from Ford St And you know - what Keith said is exactly how I feel about it - I have lots of fond memories from living there. Mom used to work at Pascalls opposite your house in Ford Street. She also cleaned in the Abbey pub just at the corner of Park Rd. Our house was on the front but we had to go up the entry, up the yard and it was the last toilet on the left. And we used newspaper tore off a piece of the newspaper hanging on a nail on the back of the door. If I went to someone's outdoor toilet where there were pieces of paper hanging on a nail I used to think that they were posh. I worked at the cake shop on the flat - I just cant remember the name but I worked there and it was in the middle of the flat on the right side. We used to go to the Co-op on Friday and we would go the greengrocer on the left hand side of the flat It was a big shop. Oh my God this has so delighted me - you tell Keith (if you know him that is) that he has brought back so many memories
I have a friend who lived in Park Road - she does not have a computer so she won't have seen this. Her father ran the pub near Factory Road, I think it was called The Railway or The Engine or something similar. Her name was Susan Jenkins. Came from quite a large family, Dot, Maurice (Mossy), Shirley, Linda, Barry - cannot remember the others. Does anyone remember this family? I also had a friend whom I lost touch with who lived on The Pleck, which was near the railway bridge, her name was Carolyn Walker. I have been trying for ages to locate her, but although I know she lived at Frankley for some time, she seems to have moved away and I cannot trace her. Any help would be very appreciated.
In the course of researching my family history I have become intrigued by the property the family rented, from late 1942 to mid 1966, in Birmingham. This was No 274 Park Road, Hockley, which was situated between Wharf Street/Norton Street and Wharf Lane, looking out over Soho Pool Wharf. It was built as a “Grocers and Tea Merchants” shop in the mid 1860’s but for the greater part of the 1900’s it operated as a “Pawnbrokers”. We occupied the property as private tenants before being re-housed, by the Council, prior to its demolition in about 1966/67. I now have a comprehensive history of No274, and the adjacent properties, and I am putting the researched information into a document, as I believe that this shop was a significant feature of the social development of Park Road and Hockley. I would like to include an image (photo or drawing) of the Park Road façade but, although I have seen lots of photographs of other parts of Park Road (including Jefferson’s grocers shop, on the corner with Wharf Lane, and the Railway Tavern, on the corner with Norton Street), I have not seen any of the stretch that includes No 274 or the adjacent, but very much older, cottages. Can anyone help with photos or drawings (plans or maps) of any age or detail – I intend to use my very limited artist ability to produce paintings of the exterior and interior of the “shop” and anything to help my failing memory would be appreciated.
Even the Archives in Central Library cant help - they have an index record of drawings for "a shop and 8 Houses" dated 1867 but the drawings could not be found - it looks like the area was cleared without any record photos.
I will keep trying but thanks anyway
hi glassman..just been flicking though a book and ive found another pic of park road taken in 1953 but i dont think its any good to you...its show jeffersons and wharf lane...i take it you are looking for pics of the other side of the road....
No - the shop at No 274 was on the same side of the road as Jeffersons but mid-way between Wharf Lane & Wharf Street. It was very distinctive as it was built onto a block of 6No much older and very small "white" cottages. These were lower than the road level and went up to the "Manions" shop on the corner with Wharf Street. I have seen several photographs of the Jeffersons and Wilkes shops looking towards "No 274" but none has sufficient detail, even with computer enhancement, for it to be for it to be made out with any clarity.
I remember the white cottages you refer to, and yes they were set lower than the road. I remember there was a small wall were the kerb should be and on top there were railings which we used to climb all over.
You mention that you "have seen several photographs of the Jeffersons and Wilkes shops looking towards No 274", have you got any that you could attach to this thread. I would be very interested to see them.
My Grandfather lived at 298 Park Road, the other side of Norton Street, virtually next door to the Railway Tavern, my local.
This does not show what want but its an interesting photo anyway -- probably late 1940's judging by Mr Jefferesons car (a Lanchester I think with its roof rack for carrying boxes of vegetables from the market). Also the "Red" telephone box is missing from outside Wilkes Newsagent.