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Mysterious manoeuvre ……

db84124

db84124

Brummophile
Robert Scott took this photograph in 1985. We’re looking along Church Rd, Yardley, towards the Yew Tree pub/roundabout. It was taken from the Swan Centre multi-storey car park.
My problem is that I can’t for the life of me explain why that bus is turning there.
Could someone enlighten me please?

Bus - mysterious.jpg


 
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Hi,

My guess is that it would have been a short service 11 terminating at the Yew Tree,
and taking advantage of the end of the dual carriageway to turn back towards Stechford.

Its last stop would have been just past the Yew Tree island, so it would have had to carry on to
turn round.

Kind regards

Dave
 
Thanks, Dave,
My thoughts were very much along the same lines.
Was there a Bundy Clock on the No. 11 route at the Yew Tree roundabout? If so, is it just possible that the driver was beginning his shift and had to pass the clock before heading towards Stechford? The bus may have come from Lea Hall garage.
Do you know if Lea Hall provided buses for the Outer Circle route?
Thanks again, Dave,
Dav (they stole my id a couple of months ago!)
 
No, Lea Hall never provided buses for the Outer Circle. The main suppliers were:
Acocks Green, Perry Barr/Birchfield Road, Harborne and there is some discussion about Quinton, but I must admit I never recall seeing a Quinton bus (at least in the late 50's early 60s).Of course in the case of a breakdown, a replacement bus could have come from anywhere, but it would be near to on on the actual route - eg Cotteridge.
 
Thank you, tardebigge,
Could you please offer a suggestion as to why the bus is turning there? If you aren't familiar with Church Road, Yardley, had the bus not completed its turn and gone straight on from that position, it would have found itself on a path running into a recreation ground (The Oaklands). As Dave89 so rightly says, the driver was undoubtedly "taking advantage of the end of the dual carriageway to turn back towards Stechford".
Is it possible the driver was beginning his shift from there?
Thanks again, David
 
Thanks for your reply.
The garages you mention are a good way from the Yew Tree ...... except Acocks Green, of course. But coming from Acocks Green garage, the bus would already be heading in the right direction for the anticlockwise circular route.
This is what struck me as soon as I saw the photograph ...... why is he/she turning there?
Best wishes, David
 
It could have been a School service pulling away from Yardley J&I School on the right of the photo. Perhaps of to Stetchford baths.
 
I cannot place where in Church road that is supposed to be - travelled on the 15 from Whittington Oval to town for 10 years.
Yardley church is distant left, but the flats on the right look like those by the Yew Tree almost looks like it should be Yew tree Lane or Moat lane?
Didn't the 17 turn off at the yew Tree and make it's way to garrets Green Tech via those back streets?

Puzzled

Brian
 
shame you couldn't make out what was on the destination blind it might help give some clues
 
Surely than you are looking down Harvey Road? The school has a long frontage along Church Road, such a small end on view must mean you are looking down Harvey with the bus turning from Moat Lane towards the Yew Tree island - possibly a 17 on it's way to town?
Brian
 
its definately looking down church road from the swan towards the yew tree, the yellowish van is pulling out from The Causeway, the old baptist(?) church hall can be seen along side the van, the sign indicating dual carriage way ahead is indicating the start of where the dual carriage way used to start at the junction with harvey road, which is where the bus is turning,
 
There are at least two possibility's One is that the driver was was on driver training duties, Two is that the bus was on school duties, this does depend on the the time of day the photo was taken, NXWM still send out buses to a small number of schools, what happens is the bus would go to the school at throwing out time the children would board the bus and the bus would then carry on on the 11a ? route till recent times the NXWM used to send two metrobuses to Stratford college in Stratford one on the 220? route the other on the 221? route, NXWM no longer do this run

Any chance getting a scan just of the bus? to see the number of the destination blind

db84124 said:
Robert Scott took this photograph in 1985. We’re looking along Church Rd, Yardley, towards the Yew Tree pub/roundabout. It was taken from the Swan Centre multi-storey car park.
My problem is that I can’t for the life of me explain why that bus is turning there.
Could someone enlighten me please?

View attachment 88870
Click to expand...
 
Ah! I see it now! The school in in the distance on the right, It's the old chapel on the left - not the end of school as I thought!
Schoolbu seems likely!
 
Robert and Brian could well be right when they suggest that it “could have been a School service pulling away from Yardley J&I School”. But which garage would it have come from/ was it heading for?

Robert is right when he tells us that Harvey Road can be seen just to the right of the bus.

Dwilly is correct in tells us that “the yellowish van is pulling out from The Causeway”.
But the old church hall was the Methodist Mission Hall.

Horencart, the driver could well have been on driver training duties, but from which garage?

I’m afraid there’s no chance of getting a scan of the bus to see the number on the destination blind because the photo was “pinched” from another site.

Thanks to one and all for these fascinating ideas and suggestions. David
 
Sadly without the fleet number it may be a case of questions, questions, questions, where was the original photo from as the may be able to answer the questions,


db84124 said:
Robert and Brian could well be right when they suggest that it “could have been a School service pulling away from Yardley J&I School”. But which garage would it have come from/ was it heading for?

Robert is right when he tells us that Harvey Road can be seen just to the right of the bus.

Dwilly is correct in tells us that “the yellowish van is pulling out from The Causeway”.
But the old church hall was the Methodist Mission Hall.

Horencart, the driver could well have been on driver training duties, but from which garage?

I’m afraid there’s no chance of getting a scan of the bus to see the number on the destination blind because the photo was “pinched” from another site.

Thanks to one and all for these fascinating ideas and suggestions. David
Click to expand...
 
It’s an original photograph taken by Mr Robert Scott from the Swan Centre multi-storey car park in 1985. In his caption he makes no mention of the bus. Most of the people that made comments hadn’t even noticed the “strange manoeuvre”.
Thanks again, David
 
There used to be a bus route from Hampstead to Yardley via the City Centre which was the number 16 one way and number 15 the other way. The terminus was Hob Moor Road in Yardley which crosses Church Road - could it be a bus from that route?
 
The terminus for the bus from Hampstead was at Whittington Oval. It was at one time a 15A and the 15B ran to the Chestnuts In Garretts Green lane. The 15B then became the 17 and the 15A became as you say, 15 one way, 16 the other.
 
A Sparks and sheldontony : Thank you very much for your contributions. All the routes you’ve mentioned on their outward journey follow Hob Moor Road, go around the Yew Tree roundabout and then turn into Church Road before going into Yew Tree Lane and then Moat Lane. When coming out of town, they go along Church Road in a north-easterly direction for no more than 70 yards.
From the Yew Tree roundabout, the stretch of Church Road seen in the photograph is south-west of the junction. None of the routes in your posts goes along that short stretch of dual carriageway.
The only route which passes along Church Road between the Swan and Yew Tree is/ was the No 11, Outer Circle.

The routes 11A and 11C are not partial Outer Circle services as implied in one of the posts. The letters A and C refer to the service going either in an anticlockwise (A) or clockwise (C) direction.
Partial circular services are denoted with the letter E.

What I didn’t realise is that the No 11 route, at 27 mile (43 km), is Europe's second longest urban bus route (after Coventry route 360). (Wikipedia)
 
Until Coventry recently created their bus route - the Outer Circle was the longest! And the 'outer' Outer Circle "C" is 1 and 1/4 miles longer than the 'Inner' Outer Circle "A"
 
Another thought.
Sometimes if a bus was running badly behind schedule when it got to a clock, an inspector would turn it round so that it was back on time (presumably so they didn´t have to pay the crew overtime). Used to happen regularly at the Fox & Goose.
 
A Sparks said:
There used to be a bus route from Hampstead to Yardley via the City Centre which was the number 16 one way and number 15 the other way. The terminus was Hob Moor Road in Yardley which crosses Church Road - could it be a bus from that route?
Click to expand...

The 15 service began as a tramway feeder service running between Small Heath and Stechford via Green Lane in Dec 1924 and was eventually extended into the City and diverted via Hob Moor Road (in leiu of Yardley Green Road and Newbridge Road) to "Church Road Yardley 15" in September 1928.
From June 1929 it was joined with the 16 route (running through to Handsworth Wood) and extended to Barrows Lane as "Yardley Barrows Lane 15A". A final extension came in March 1949 to "Whittington Oval Yardley 15A"

The 16 route began in Jan 1925 running between the City and Brownes Green/Handsworth Wood - becoming joint with the 15 /15A in June '29. It was extended to Beauchamp Avenue in Oct '37 and numbered 16A. A further extension to Hamstead took place in Sep '39

a sister service to the 15 /15A began in Nov '38 running between City and Horrell Road as "Garretts Green Lane 15B" this was extended to Sheldon Heath Road (traffic island) as new build estates emerged in Jan '49.

Interestingly the large island at Sheldon Heath Road would have made an ideal trolleybus terminus - The Corporation had mooted the idea of converting the "east of City" services to this mode of transport following the success of the Coventry Road conversion - but that's another story!!

The 15A and 16A were renumbered 15 & 16 in Dec '58 along with the 15B which was extended to the Meadway as "Meadway Garretts Green Lane 17"

Birmingham possessed a strange numbering system. Buses Running from Hamstead would show "Whittington Oval Yardley 15" (Hockley buses) or "Yardley Whittington Oval 15" (Liverpool Street buses) and the return journey would show "Handsworth Wood and Hamstead 16". Journeys not travelling the full route would show something else! ie a bus running from Hamstead to the Yew Tree would Show "Church Road Hobmoor Road 17F" so it was actually possible to catch a 17 in Hamstead. The reason for this is that all of the short workings on the buses blinds were geared toward the 17 route and to avoid duplicating the same display but with a different number it was easier(!) to do it this way.

A branch service to the 17 began in Nov '67 to "The Radleys Sheldon Heath Road 68".

Oh well that's my little ramble over.
 
When I lived on Moat Lane in the late 40s early 50s we had a 17A and 17B stop in front of our house at 126 Moat Lane. I THNK? the difference was the final destination. John Crump Parker. Co USA
 
John, it was a 15 and a 15b not 17a& 17b .The 16 and the 16b went to Whittington oval and back to Handsworth. You have got them mixed up you Nelly!!!
 
The photo is taken with a tele lens and it has compressed the whole photo. I do not want to be a killjoy but it is just a bus turning at the most convenient turning and safe place. We have all seen this happen in our life.
 
As a former inspector sometimes working on the Outer Circle I can assure you that turning buses was not to avoid paying overtime to crews but to try and maintain as regular service as possible. Although I do know this area I was based at Perry Barr and did not travel this far whilst on duty, Perry Barr's responsibility was for the section between The King's Head and The Fox and Goose. There were six bundy clocks on the circle which were situated at (Inner Ring) King's Head, Sarehole Mill and George Road Witton and (Outer Ring) Fox & Goose, Swanshurst Park and Handsworth Wood. For the period of the photograph buses operating on The Circle were provided by Perry Barr, Acocks Green and Harborne Garages with a couple of all day boards being operated by Quinton and peak shorts from other garages.
 
Hello there, PB7229,
Thank you for your highly informative contribution.
Very interesting to be told that there was no Bundy clock just before the Yew Tree roundabout. When I first saw this photo several months ago now, my eye fell immediately on the bus. The only route which follows that stretch of road is the No 11. My initial explanation – to myself – was that the bus had come from Lea Hall garage and because there was a clock at that roundabout – but just before it coming from The Swan – the driver had had to continue beyond the roundabout to turn his bus around at the other end of the dual carriageway.
Since then I have been told that (a) Lea Hall didn't supply buses for the Outer Circle route and that (b) there was no Bundy clock in that location …… so my very personal theory was quashed.
A bus from the closest garage, Acocks Green, wouldn't have had to turn at that point as it would have been heading in the correct direction to serve the anticlockwise route.
Thanks again, David

PS Is your user name a direct reference to your former occupation? :friendly_wink: D.
 
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