• Welcome to this forum . We are a worldwide group with a common interest in Birmingham and its history. While here, please follow a few simple rules. We ask that you respect other members, thank those who have helped you and please keep your contributions on-topic with the thread.

    We do hope you enjoy your visit. BHF Admin Team
  • HI folks the server that hosts the site completely died including the Hdd's and backups.
    Luckily i create an offsite backup once a week! this has now been restored so we have lost a few days posts.
    im still fixing things at the moment so bear with me and im still working on all images 90% are fine the others im working on now
    we are now using a backup solution

Moor Green connections to Hockley??

L

Lily_Mae

master brummie
Hi this is a long short. I am trawling through my families baptism records from 1822 onwards. My Gt Gt Gt Grandfather William Hudson and his wife had a lot of children. Those Children on the whole were born in Moor Green in the parish of Kings Norton [1813-2831]. I'm not sure why,

All the children were baptised at St Philips in Hockley. His occupation is Sword Grinder / polisher or variations on that, Definately the same people.

I'm not sure why, If Moor Green is the same place as down by Highfield Park by Mosely/Kings heath now - was this part of the Kings Norton Parish then and why would she go there to give birth. ?? Its closer geographically to Hockley than Kings norton today - but even so seems a long way to travel unless there was a railway connection????

Residence must have been in Hockley as that fits with his occupation and the catchment area for St Phillips.

Just really looking for thoughts really and theories to help with understanding this.
 
I can't find a St Phillips in Hockley. If you could supply his wife's name plus some of the children then perhaps we can have a look and come up with ideas. Thanks
 
Right - I think it is St Phillips Cathedral as I have found a baptism there for a John Hudson parents William and Dorothy in 1832. I am not sure where you saw "Moor Green".
Ignore that as I have now found it on the baptism record which I had not opened to see the original. I do know that Kings Norton parish stretched quite a way. I suspect it was a case of wanting to go to the cathedral rather than locality.
 
A bit of digging suggests the folllowing:

King's Norton, the greater part of which was included in the city of Birmingham under the Birmingham Extension Act, 1911, and so is now in Warwickshire, is a large parish situated immediately south of Birmingham, and included the now separate ecclesiastical parishes of Moseley, King's Heath and Wythall.

This seems to imply that Moseley came under the parish church at Kings Norton so I would assume it is indeed Moor Green you found.
 
Update 1841 Census - the family are now living in Moor Green. Definitely the same people. He would have ben 45 at this time and occupation still as a sword polisher. And 1851 they were living in Stirchley Kings Norton.

How would I research more info about residence to dig deeper. Any thoughts. A think even if we are talking walking into work - it would be a good 6/7 miles there and the same on the way back.

Would there be any occupational records for sword grinders / polishers etc

Any help would be appreciated
pjmburns said:
Right - I think it is St Phillips Cathedral as I have found a baptism there for a John Hudson parents William and Dorothy in 1832. I am not sure where you saw "Moor Green".
Ignore that as I have now found it on the baptism record which I had not opened to see the original. I do know that Kings Norton parish stretched quite a way. I suspect it was a case of wanting to go to the cathedral rather than locality.
Click to expand...

The baptism was at the following - Birmingham, St Philip, Warwickshire, England, so I am also assuming its the cathedral. There is only one St Philips in that area. All the children were baptised there from 1813 to the last in 1834. Very large family. It all ties together from the census returns I have. Its just odd that most of the kids were both in Moor Green - as referenced on the baptism records as the place of birth. Which I think would be around the Highbury / Mosely area.

Coincidently I knew the area fairly well as I grew up in Kings Heath. This is just not usual. I think.
 
I found the census records but very hard to read the actual address.
1841 just says "Moor Green" but on the previous page it lists Moor Green House which I have found on an 1884 map. (Earlier maps are hard to find online and tend to be less accurate). It gives us an idea where he lived. I am wondering if he actually worked at home.
1618755787055.png
 
In 1881 the address of the Right Honourable Joseph Chamberlain was Moor Green, King’s Norton.
 
Stirchley Street seems to be an area not a road as I have just found it on an 1884 map - further over nearer to Bournville (unfortunately on a different sheet to Moor Green. NB Hazelwell Mill is marked as gunbarrel and a quick look suggests it was a mill used for metal milling - wonder if it made swords?
1618756656573.png
 
Depending where they lived it would have been about 4 miles from Moor Green to St Phillips.

Baptism records don't list place of birth, they list abode which could have been the same but not definitely so.

I see from the majority of baptisms that they are some days, even months after the birth which implies that they didn't live local and probably waited until the baby was strong enough to make the journey.

And on the burial for William (1829) it lists residence as Kings Norton parish.
 
Brilliant. If they made sword bayonets in 1884 then they probably made them earlier as well. Possibly it was those William polished.
 
Empire of Guns: The Violent Making of the Industrial Revolution (Priya Satia)

“The Farmer & Galton gun firm, like many Birmingham gun firms, also offered other manufactured metalware, such as swords, bayonets, shears, gravers, files, and cutlasses; hence their enduring ties to edge-tool and related trades. Blades, knives, forks, harpoons, and lances were part of their inventory for slave ships and ships sailing for Greenland.”
 
Very interesting thread.
Moseley church was for hundreds of years a chapel in the Parish of Kings Norton. It wasn’t until 1853 that Moseley was granted a fully defined boundary and it became a completely separate parish in 1866. Moor Green was included in Moseley at the dates mentioned.
Moor Green Mill stood at the bottom of a track by the River Rea and in 1838 it was described as a grinding, rolling and blade mill. Was it possible that William Hudson could have worked there?
Stirchley Street was the original name for the area now known as Stirchley and was situated immediately to the South of Moor Green.
 
Some of the Street names are still retained in the Kings Heath area. Hazlewell for example - which is more towards stirchley now but the road does carry on towards the Moor Green / Highbury area around the back of KIngs Heath Park as is now. Another branch of my family lived in that area and my maternal grandfather used to use the Hazlewell pub and my parents were married in Hazelwell Church on that road in the 60s. [I know the area inc Bournville / Stirchley pretty well in the 70s/80s].

Very very interesting responses - thank you all. I have some questions around one of the sons which I'll post under a different thread as I would be interested in any observations - as I cannot trace information and have come up against a block after the deaths of the parents c. 1860 ish which I think left the children struggling - at least I get that impression. BY 1871 the children are living with an older brother and his wife. There is something a little off. But I'll explain that in the next thread :)

I'm wondering if St Philips had a family connection and was used for that reason. I will do some digging on Williams birth if I can. The St Philips records are online so may mean a litle bit of a trawl.
 
Hi - does anyone have any maps of St Phillips area for baptism catchment please. I am keen to understand where Hangmans Lane was (for my direct ancestor George Hudson Born 1816 - baptised 1822 @ st phillips and also Bagot street and Hall street.

Would appreciate any help or at least a point to where to look :)
 
Should have done a search here - now hangmans lane now know as Great Hampton Row - area fits. Hall Street and Bagot Street are also in the general locale. certainly within walking distance.
 
There's a Hall St between Great Hampton St and Warstone Lane/Caroline St and a Bagot St off Newtown Row.
 
MWS said:
There's a Hall St between Great Hampton St and Warstone Lane/Caroline St and a Bagot St off Newtown Row.
Click to expand...
Thank you. They were in this general area until 1822 until they moved to Moor Green (Moseley/Stirchley way) where the father must have got a job in one of the factories/workshops dealing with sword grinding / polishing. certainly a better area to bring up his growing family I think at the time.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top