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Hall family

jane k

master brummie
I`m trying to find William Hall and his parents Thomas and Lucy in 1841.
William was born in Cheltenham in about 1828. His father was also born there. But according to the 1851 census all of William`s older siblings were born in Birmingham starting in about 1832. By 1851 they were living in Wharf Street Birmingham but William had married and left home by then. (William and Thomas were both plasterers)
I`ve tried searching for William on his own, and for Thomas and Lucy but no luck.
Any help would be much appreciated
 

Astoness

TRUE BRUMMIE MODERATOR
Staff member
hi jane had just a quick look for now but so far no sign of them with parents thomas and lucy on the 41..will keep looking

lyn
 

Astoness

TRUE BRUMMIE MODERATOR
Staff member
found this one in 1841 but not sure as it says born in winchcomb not cheltenham although winchcomb is is gloucester....no sign of a william

GloucestershireCOUNTRY:EnglandREGISTRATION DISTRICT:WinchcombSUB-REGISTRATION DISTRICT:GuitingNEIGHBORS:View others on pagePIECE:360BOOK:19FOLIO:31PAGE NUMBER:7HOUSEHOLD MEMBERS:
 

Astoness

TRUE BRUMMIE MODERATOR
Staff member
hi jane if as you say thomas was a plasterer then that has to be them...living in wincombe gloucester and all born there...as said earlier there is no sign of william...maybe he was staying with rellies..here is the 41 census which states that williams elder brother george was also a plasterer...bit confusing as you say williams older siblings were all born birmingham yet the census says different..always assuming i have the correct family..click on the image then click on the magnifying glass at the top right of the page and it should enlarge

thomas and lucy hall 1841.jpg
 
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pjmburns

master brummie
I think you are right Lyn. As we know things are not always accurate on the 1841 census. There are several Williams born 1828 listed on the census - with families but as no relationships are shown he could be staying with relatives - it would then be hard to find him.
 

Astoness

TRUE BRUMMIE MODERATOR
Staff member
jan could this be william on the 41...living with elizabeth hall who does not have a hubby there...could she be williams auntie...would you say williams occupation is plasterer

wlliam hall 1841.jpg
 

MWS

master brummie
Not sure, none of the children seem to match those on the 1851 census.

Also on the 1871 census Thomas & Lucy are living in Bham with their daughter Harriet. Her birthplace is listed is Great Bridge, Staffs which comes under West Brom. There is a birth for a Harriett Hall listed Sep qtr 1841, West Brom mmn Line.

The other children are a bit elusive but there is a Mary Ann registered Bham Dec qtr 1848, mmn Lane.

On the 1861 census Lucy's birth is listed as Welland and also there is an Eliza Jones listed as sister birthplace also Welland, so more likely sister in law.

There are baptisms for a Lucy and Eliza, both daughters of William and Hannah in Welland about the right dates.

Finally on the 1841 census there is a possible Hall family in West Bromwich but with no first names listed. There is no adult male but the ages of the children are close. Residence in given as Crone Hills.
 

jane k

master brummie
Thankyou very much for all of your hard work - I do appreciate it.

I don`t think the Winchcombe entry is right as the children don`t match the 1851 details. I must admit I am getting a bit muddled as there seem to be a lot of Halls and quite a few were plasterers!
I know for certain that William was born about 1828 in Cheltenham and I`ve got his marriage certificate which says his father was Thomas and that they were both plasterers. I then found a possible baptism for William in Cheltenham in 1828 which says that his father was Thomas (plasterer) and mother Lucy. The rest of my research is based on this, but I am starting to wonder if I am getting different families mixed up!

I`ll persevere!
 

Astoness

TRUE BRUMMIE MODERATOR
Staff member
hi jane have to say i have not seen many if any plasterers in all my years of researching for myself and others this is why i picked up a william hall born 1828 living in cheltenham on the 1841 census...could just be a coinsidence though..also it must be an even bigger coinsidence that we have a thomas hall plasterer and wife jane on the 41 census...it could be that thomas and jane moved to winchcombe dont think its very far from cheltenham and maybe william was living with a rellie at the time the census was taken..just me thinking outloud:)

i wonder if you could let us know the details you have for the 1851 census so we know who we are following...thanks..will start again later today

lyn
 

jane k

master brummie
The 1851 Census is Piece 2052 Folio 149 Page 31. Wharf Street Birmingham St Thomas that`s for Thomas and Lucy and children but not including William as he was married by then
 

MWS

master brummie
So your William Hall definitely married Martha Simmons (listed as Matilda on registration) and his father was listed as Thomas a plasterer.

You've then assumed (reasonably so) that the Thomas and Lucy Hall living in Wharf St are his parents?

Does the marriage give witnesses and address for William?
 

jane k

master brummie
The marriage was in October 1847 in Handsworth Parish Church.
William Hall, full age, residence Handsworth (father Thomas Hall plasterer. Matilda Simmons (father James Simmons),also Handsworth. Witnesses are William and Rebecca Harrison (witnesses and Matilda made their mark)
 
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Alberta

Super Moderator
Staff member
William Harrison m Rebecca Simmons West Bromwich 1838.

Baptisms in Birmingham both on 1st April 1823 parents James and Phebe
Martha Simmons born 4th March1819
Rebecca Simmons born 21 November 1820
 

jane k

master brummie
Thanks Alberta, That`s very helpful. On Familysearch there is a baptism for Matilda Simmons on 31/3/1823 in St Martins, Birmingham - same parents James and Phebe - birth date 15/5/1822. I`m sure Matilda is the one who went on to marry William Hall even though on the 1861 census she is down as Martha!
The two baptisms you found are also on Familysearch and say St Phillips. That`s rather odd isn`t it - christenings a day a part in different churches!
 

Alberta

Super Moderator
Staff member
You say that on the 1861 she is down as Martha.
I have found a William Hall with a different family.
1851 census Bishopgate street Birmingham
William Hall age 22 b Cheltenham Plasterer
Martha age 28 b birmingham
Julia 2 b 1849
William 6 months.

1861 Suffolk street
William Hall age 33 Plasterer
Phoebe Hall age 26
Julia Hall 12
William Hall 10
Charles L Hall age 6 stepson b Bath
John J Hall age 4 stepson b Birmingham
Matilda age 1 daughter b Birmingham

I believe the 2 boys may be
Charles Lee Sheppard b Bath 1853
John J Shepphard 1856 b Birmingham.
although I cannot find marriage of Phoebe and William.

Going forward from William Hall which of his descendants is in your family.

Sorry have amended the wifes name in 1851 as Jane says it is Martha.
 
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jane k

master brummie
Apologies Alberta. I made a mistake, it is actually the 1851 census where the wife is "Martha". I don`t know what it says in the transcription but it is quite clear on the image. However, I still think think this was an error .
I believe the wife Matilda died in 1858. Shortly afterwards William began a relationship with Phoebe Jesse (Jesse is her surname). I haven`t checked my research recently but if I remember correctly she`d had a rather complicated life which produced Charles and John. She then had about 6 children with William Hall but I don`t think they married.
Our family is descended from William and Matilda`s daughter Julie who was born in 1848
 

PoBo

Brummie babby
I`m trying to find William Hall and his parents Thomas and Lucy in 1841.
William was born in Cheltenham in about 1828. His father was also born there. But according to the 1851 census all of William`s older siblings were born in Birmingham starting in about 1832. By 1851 they were living in Wharf Street Birmingham but William had married and left home by then. (William and Thomas were both plasterers)
I`ve tried searching for William on his own, and for Thomas and Lucy but no luck.
Any help would be much appreciated
Hi Jane, William was my Great Great Grandfather. It took me years to track him down but I did do it eventually! The Family came from Charlton Kings in Gloucestershire which is near to Cheltenham. William was baptised in Cheltenham 13 Aug 1828, son of Thomas Hall and Lucy. Bizzarely (and I haven't worked out why yet), Thomas didn't marry Lucy Lane until 17 Oct 1864 where he married her in Worcestershire, England at the Parish of St Clement. Lucy's family originate from Welland / Castlemorton. I have lots of info if you wish to contact me. Pauline
 
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