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Courtyards and yards of brum

Michael_Ingram said:
Two more photographs from Eden Place. My parent's wedding, 1922 - notice the carpet laid out under the chairs - take the street end. My brothers and sister in the 1930s, taken the end away from the street. Just in front of them was the area called the Drying Ground where the washing lines were, adjacent to the brewhouse. Notice the very fancy porch in the background.

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My grandmother was married at St Marys Church Aston Brook and this photo has helped me with the sort of clothes and the times. She married in 1919 Leah Clayton to Harry Jones. Thank you for the photos wonderful
 
Although there is already a pic of Camden Grove in another thread here are two with constrast and sharpness improved. They show No 7 Court, Camden Grove as the inhabitants look at the photographer maybe wondering why he would take a photo of their court. The second photo shows the view they saw when they looked out of their doors.
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oldMohawk said:
Although there is already a pic of Camden Grove in another thread here are two with constrast and sharpness improved. They show No 7 Court, Camden Grove as the inhabitants look at the photographer maybe wondering why he would take a photo of their court. The second photo shows the view they saw when they looked out of their doors.
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Here is Camden Grove from the 1880s. Does it fit?

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The Shoothill Birmingham Library site seems to have its fair share of mistakes, and is this another one? The two pictures placed by old Mohawk of Number 7 Court, Camden Drive do fit well with the "court" that leads in to Legge St. If you count the "courts" from Camden Drive it could be said to be Court 7, but four of the other six have names and not numbers.

The 1881 census for Camden Grove gives housing numbers 1 to 43, suggesting that the numbering goes in and out of the “courts”? There are many mentions of Camden Drive in the Press but none that I can find with a Court number.
 
The 1920 electoral roll also numbers all the houses in Camden Grove consecutively (see one page below)
 

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Pedrocut said:
Here is Camden Grove from the 1880s. Does it fit?
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As often in these old courtyard images the photographer chalked the address on a wall or door etc, and '7 crt Camden Grove' can be seen chalked on a wall in the second pic in post#963. With their 'Deep Zoom' method, Shoothill obviously had no connection with the old photographer so probably just used the chalked address. The view through the gap at the end of the court showing a street and high buildings does not seem to fit with the map so I'm still looking.
 
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In 1895 a notice of lighting from the Corporation does mention Courts 1-7.
Here is an auction notice from July 1909 for Cregoe and Gough Places....with Out-offices!

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oldMohawk said:
Although there is already a pic of Camden Grove in another thread here are two with constrast and sharpness improved. They show No 7 Court, Camden Grove as the inhabitants look at the photographer maybe wondering why he would take a photo of their court. The second photo shows the view they saw when they looked out of their doors.
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In 1917 the Estate of Mr Thomas Priest included 21 houses around Camden Street, Ten being in Camden Grove.

Mr Priest was a corn merchant, one time President of the Master Bakers and Member of the Board of Guardians. In 1890 he was fired 8s 6d for delivery of bread without a set of scales. In 1893 he was fined 20s for cruelty to a horse by working it when in an unfit condition.
 
Looking at the map in post#964 I have drawn an arrow pointing at a court which has a plan view matching the court in the first photo in #963. The houses marked in green, the outhouses marked red and the red circle marks where the camera was.
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A small mystery with this image. The photographer knew where he was and chalked the address 5-10 Station Terrace, Hill St on the wall, but I can't seem to locate it on a map. There is a tall building with a domed roof in the background ... does anyone recognise it?
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It's a possiblity although the cupolas or domes on the Post Office seem more pointed. Looking at courts or similar off Hill Street I cannot yet find any pointed in the direction of the Post Office ... :)
 
I've just looked at another map Lyn, and can't locate a Station Terrace. They look a cheerful group in the court ...:)
 
have to say they do phil...maybe when mike spots this post he can help find us a map showing station terrace....fingers crossed nice photo

lyn
 
At first glance I can’t locate Station Terrace, but there are quite a few mentions of it as being Hill Street.
 
thanks pedro i thought st judes was in or near hill st...will try and find a photo of it to compere

lyn
 
The domed tower is actually on Pinfold St and looking again at the pic in #971 there appears to be building work going on at the end of the court and the last house has actually been boarded off. Perhaps the Central Post Office was being built and near completion when this pic was taken.

On this 1889 map the Post Office had not yet been built. The red dot marks the position (approx) where the tower would be. The pink shaded area marks where the courtyard would have to be in order to have the tower in view. There appear to be alleyways off Hill Street
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This 1905 map shows the Post Office and the tower position is marked. It looks like all of the houses have been demolished.
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Phil,

This search is not made any easier by the enumerator's walkabout sheets for 1881 & 1891 censuses of that area being largely missing from the census images on FMP. Neither does Pinfold Street appear in the 1891 address search on FMP. Also whilst there is no shortage of courts and back houses in that block, there is no guarantee that the enumerator knows them by the name of Station Terrace! :) I will continue to dig, but I guess that most of that area was flattened by 1901.

Maurice
 
sospiri said:
Phil,

This search is not made any easier by the enumerator's walkabout sheets for 1881 & 1891 censuses of that area being largely missing from the census images on FMP. Neither does Pinfold Street appear in the 1891 address search on FMP. Also whilst there is no shortage of courts and back houses in that block, there is no guarantee that the enumerator knows them by the name of Station Terrace! :) I will continue to dig, but I guess that most of that area was flattened by 1901.

Maurice
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There are at least 5 mentions of Station Terrace, Hill Street, between 1890 and 1900 in the Press. It may have not lasted much longer.
 
Hi Maurice,

I must admit I can't pick out a court with the necessary alignment in either the map in #983 or the one in #984. I suppose the occupants were just told to vacate and find somewhere else because the main Post Office was being built.

It seems from Pedrocut's post that Station Terrace did exist ... convenient for the city centre and the station ...

Phil
 
Phil,

I've just spent over three hours going through every image in Piece 2375 of the 1891 Census, which includes all of Hill Street, and parts of the following streets - Beak Street, Station Street, Dudley Street, Severn Street, Navigation Street, John Bright Street, Suffolk Street, Smallbrook Street, Worcester Street, Paradise Street, and umpteen courts and back houses. At the end there is even a long list of empty houses, but nowhere within these images was there any mention of a Station Terrace.

Hill Street does not appear in any other piece number according to the FMP index and neither does a Station Terrace or ironically a Pinfold Street. I've attached below the enumerator's walkabout sheet for Piece 2375.

Swallow Street and Summer Street do not appear to be in this Piece number, though I did search them in 1881 - probably the enumerator's boundaries may have changed, but could that roof be seen from those streets?

Pedro,

If those mentions of Station Terrace in the Press contain the names of any people living there, I'd be happy to do a search for them on the 1891 Census and see what comes up.

Maurice

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This dated 1885, when major re-developments on the approach to New Street station were taking place. This was due to the need of the joint operations of the L&NWR and Midland Railway. 1923 saw the grouping of over most of the 100 plus British lines into just four major ones. New Street became the LMS owned .
The photo looks later than 1885, however, there is the possibility that more track arrangements were made and demolitions in Hill Street allowed for widening newer buildings at a later date.
 
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