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Memorial found in a skip

I wonder if the feather you saw was, in fact, a palm leaf ? A number of headstones and War memorials I've seen do feature palm leaves, (but I can't remember what they signify).
 
cant help with that one..only know what the laurel leaf wreath means...
 
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Yes thanks Mike. I’m sure its case that the majority could expect to go overseas, especially those so young and those coming from cadet units. But not all would have joined the VF expecting to be sent overseas at that time. Viv.
 
i cant help but think that the answer to this plaque is simple but as the saying goes its only easy if you know the answers:rolleyes:

also considering the internet and media coverage not 1 descendent of the men who may still live in brum has either been traced or come forward well not to our knowledge anyway...we were very lucky with our postmans plaque at least 4 out of the 7 names on it had family come forward and family members of 3 of the men were able to attend the re dedication service at the NMA...so onward and upwards ...

lyn
 
Feathers can have an angelic significance or of a free spirit. Palm fronds might suggest an association with those who served in desert regions.
 
Astoness said:
i cant help but think that the answer to this plaque is simple but as the saying goes its only easy if you know the answers:rolleyes:

also considering the internet and media coverage not 1 descendent of the men who may still live in brum has either been traced or come forward well not to our knowledge anyway...we were very lucky with our postmans plaque at least 4 out of the 7 names on it had family come forward and family members of 3 of the men were able to attend the re dedication service at the NMA...so onward and upwards ...

lyn
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The BBC report does say they have been in contact with a relative in Canada.

Anyway I am going to take the bull by the horns and email the vicar of St Agatha's who also look after St Barnabas to see if he knows if there was/is a war memorial at St Barnabas. (The church was old enough) and I will also ask if he has heard of a club. He might have access to records - I know some are at the library (!) but the list did not seem helpful.
 
hi jan yes i read about the rellie abroad but could do with some coming forward who still live in or around brum...glad you are going to contact the vicar of st agathas i know you will keep us informed..

lyn
 
Lyn,

Looking through the newspapers just after the WW1, I am surprised how few reports there are of dedication of memorials. But for one thing, those reports didn't sell newspapers, and people were thoroughly sick of the war and just wanted to get on with their lives. And those in closed groups such schools and clubs just don't get publicised. Those in Moseley School, formerly Moseley Grammar School, for instance, have had more attention in the last two years than they have ever had. Certainly I don't believe they were pointed out to me in the years that I was a pupil from 1947 to 1953.

Only in very recent years have the half a dozen or so websites devoted to war memorials sprung up. So few of those have photographs, let alone names, including the Moseley Schools ones, and I will be writing to The Moseleians Secretary to get that rectified. So whilst the answer is most probably staring us in the face, finding a newspaper report about it is going to be difficult.

Perhaps, as I believe someone hinted earlier, the clue lies in the addition of a solitary name (MASON) for WW2. Why only that one name? Had the membership of the organisation dropped drastically in the inter-war years?

EDIT: What I hadn't spotted when I wrote the above was that MASON was a pupil of MGS from 1934 to 1938 ! His name is also on the MGS memorial, so someone thought fit to also add his name to the mystery memorial.

Maurice
 
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Viv,

Some information about our solitary WW2 entry on this memorial, Flt Sgt James Alfred MASON. As I noted on post #249, he is already mentioned on the Moseley Grammar School memorial which is still in place at Moseley School..

He was the youngest child of Ernest Robert & Minnie MASON nee REA and his siblings were:
Eric Ernest MASON born 25 August 1917, married Lieselotte A. E. RIHA 3 Qtr 1947 Birmingham. In 1939 he was a transport clerk at a textiles warehouse. He died in Birmingham in 3 Qtr 1991
Irene Hilda Coles MASON born 3 Qtr 1919 married Donald J. BALDWIN 4 Qtr 1949 Birmingham and John CHANDLER 3 Qtr 1959 Solihull. She died on 6 March 2009 and Grant of Probate with a Will was at Birmingham on 18 May 2009
Marjorie A. MASON born 3 Qtr 1920. Not a rare surname, so no further information yet.

I have not attempted to ascertain descendants of the above as yet, but believe that none of the aforementioned people are still alive so there should be no problem with placing this information on open forum.

Maurice
 
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Here is the message I sent the vicar at St Barnabas:
Apologies for bothering you but I wonder if you can help or perhaps suggest where I can look. My name is Janice Burns and I am a member of Birmingham History Forum - we are at present helping trace the names on a memorial tablet which was found in a skip. It seems all the men came from the Balsall Heath area so we began looking at memorials in the area.
To cut a long story short our research led to 404 Ladypool Road which in 1915 was listed as St Barnabas Club. On your website you list the names at St Agatha's but I noticed there is nothing for St Barnabas. Do you know if this is because there is no memorial or because it was lost in the fire or just that they haven't been transcribed? If you are unable to answer the questions do you have any idea where I might search for possible records?
Many thanks for your help in this mystery

I have had this reply:

It's strange you have contacted me, because I was wondering about this as well.

I know the PCC Minutes mention members of the congregation who died in the War, but I don't have the list myself. I will forward your email to ......., Churchwarden, whose were connected with St Barnabas for many years before the fire. He has more knowledge about the parish than anyone else

So I wait and see - will let you know.
 
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pjmburns said:
Maurice there is a photo of the Moseley School Memorial WW2 here https://www.warmemorialsonline.org.uk/memorial/237042
The ww1 has a photo but the actual memorial is missing.
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Janice,

The Imperial War Museum site has the memorials listed, but no pictures, and that goes for quite a few on there. I think that should be rectified as that site is the prime national site for this information.

Re: your post #254, this is the problem we are facing a hundred years one - no one has much knowledge of the memorial sites at that time.

Maurice
 
Right - we can rule out St Barnabas - I have had the following from the churchwarden:

I confirm that the war memorial at St Barnabas' was destroyed in the fire of 12th April 1970.

There is a list of 11 names which do not match any of our list - I have asked if I may put them on here for future reference and await a reply.
 
pjmburns said:
Right - we can rule out St Barnabas - I have had the following from the churchwarden:

I confirm that the war memorial at St Barnabas' was destroyed in the fire of 12th April 1970.

There is a list of 11 names which do not match any of our list - I have asked if I may put them on here for future reference and await a reply.
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The reply you received, Janice, confirms my opinions that I made regarding St. Barnabas, in post 228.
 
Janice / Mike,

In 1939 two of James Alfred MASON's siblings, both unmarried at that point, were living at 46 George Street, Balsall Heath. Next door to their house today is a single storey building with the words True Jesus Church across its front. Somewhere close by in that street is/was St Joseph's Roman Catholic Church. I just wonder if there is a chance of a link here.

Incidentally, I omitted from post #252 the previous addresses of the MASON family:-
1920 - 34 Brighton Road
1922-1935 - 10 Kingswood Road and then they moved to somewhere in the Solihull area, all apart from Marjorie & Eric who moved around the corner to 46 George Street. By 1945 they'd moved.

Maurice
 
Peter, in your attachment to post #216 I notice that the young man's mother comes third in the bereaved list after her dead husband (second) and the boy's uncle who, because he was a 'Sir' came first.

Alan, you post #228 - our church had a very serious fire in 1965 and was almost entirely re-built but I don't remember any fire damage on the memorial as the fire started at the other end of the building.
St Michael's memorial has a good range of ages for the men so I'm still going along with the church memorial theory, at least so far.
 
Lady Penelope said:
Peter, in your attachment to post #216 I notice that the young man's mother comes third in the bereaved list after her dead husband (second) and the boy's uncle who, because he was a 'Sir' came first.

Alan, you post #228 - our church had a very serious fire in 1965 and was almost entirely re-built but I don't remember any fire damage on the memorial as the fire started at the other end of the building.
St Michael's memorial has a good range of ages for the men so I'm still going along with the church memorial theory, at least so far.
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My observations were based on the report - such as it was for a newspaper - and the photographs, plus experience. ;) Your church, was fortunate, in so far as some artefacts are concerned it seems.
 
Re #260 Nearby is St John & St Martin RC Church. Also a Pentecostal Church.
Also the Gospel Hall which was in Wenman Street at the relevant time .

Lyn - I did wonder but it was demolished in 1970 which means the "plaque" was homeless a long time.

Just found that in the records at the library for St Thomas there is reference to "Faculty for the erection of a war memorial tablet inside the church. Dated 1923"
 
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jan do we know for certain that the plaque has only been homeless for about 5 years which i believe is when it was handed in..the postmans plaque was homeless for over 40 years...this is me just mulling again lol

lyn

St. Thomas in the Moors Church, Cox St West, Balsall Heath was built in the Gothic style and designed by Bateman and Corser. It was consecrated in 1883. A parish was assigned out of St. Paul's, Balsall Heath the following year (1884). The living which was a vicarage since 1884 was in the gift of public trustees. Part of the parish was taken to form part of the parish of St. Patrick, Bordesley in 1900. From 1923 until the Second World War a parochial hall in Clevedon St was licensed for public worship. In May 1955 the parish of St. Thomas in the Moors, Balsall Heath was united with that of St. Mary and St. Ambrose and the church ceased to be used as a place of worship
 
Not wishing to rain on a party :D, but a Memorial Tablet is usually, I believe, made from some type of stone.
 
Viv,

I'll add a bit more about James Alfred MASON, although he comes under the "Unaccounted for" category in RAF terms. At the time of his death he was serving at RAF Aston Down (formerly RAF Minchinhampton during WW1) in Gloucestershire with 55 Operational Training Unit and flying a Typhoon 1b serial number JP433. His service record and flying logbook are, like all of those relating to WW2, still with the RAF and have not yet been released to the National Archives.

During the two years previous to his death on 20 March 1945, JP433 had been involved in several crashes with other pilots and had been patched up, but I fear we are not going to get information about the circumstances of his death until the records are released for public consumption.

Maurice
 
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