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Paradise development 2019

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Views of Two Chamberlain Square starting from Broad Street.

The Symphony Hall footbridge to the Hyatt. And can you see the Town Hall?



You have to walk around the demolition in front of Symphony Hall and into Centenary Square.



Sandwiched between Big Brum and the Hall of Memory from Centenary Square.



Heading onto Centenary Way



I notice some men on harnesses.



This was shot I got too low in zoom in.



Took again.

 
Since I took these Centenary Way photos, the temporary path around the fences has changed again, as they lay the paving stones between One and Two Chamberlain Square.





Today's view top of New Street. Above the Town Hall was Two Chamberlain Square.



And One Chamberlain Square. Still have to walk up Eden Place.

 
Two and One Chamberlain Square seen from the no 50 bus on Bradford Street near Fabrick Square.




The view from the IKON Gallery of Two Chamberlain Square with HSBC UK (with the Town Hall in the middle).



 
Chamberlain Square from Victoria Square. When I went around the diversion along Eden Place and Edmund Street, the way to the main entrance of the museum was blocked off. Unless you can get there now from Victoria Square?

 
Chamberlain Square from the steps of BM & AG. I took a shortcut from the Edmund Street entrance of the museum to the main entrance. As the way from Centenary Way is blocked off (or go the Eden Place route). So approached Diwali on the Square from Chamberlain Square.

 
A bit of Deja Vu for me looking at these photo. This area looks very much as it appeared in the early 70s when the unmourned Brutalist Central Library was being built. I remember coming back from the Longboat pub on my way to catch a bus home and walking along barricaded walkways through the site, just like the walkway pictured above. Plus la change, as the French say... Although I am glad to see the monstrous concrete library gone, I wonder why can't the powers that be in Brum leave things alone? I am thinking in particular of the old Victorian Central Library that was barbarically demolished in the early seventies.
 
i agee with your post john as will a lot of the members on this forum...talking about the the demo of the victorian library we can also mention the wonderful josiah mason college which was opposite that was demolished to make way for the monstrous concrete library... makes no sense to me to demolish buildings such as this only to replace them with rubbish... in this photo showing the college you can just see the edge of the victorian library on the left..in my humble opinion birmingham once a city of admired buildings has almost had it now...

lyn

josiah mason college.jpeg
 
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cookie273uk said:
How can they demolish buildings like that, its absolutely criminal. Eric
Click to expand...

Because Herbert Manzoni, (City Engineer and Surveyor of Birmingham from 1935 until 1963) said and thought as follows:

"I have never been very certain as to the value of tangible links with the past. They are often more sentimental than valuable... As to Birmingham’s buildings, there is little of real worth in our architecture. Its replacement should be an improvement... As for future generations, I think they will be better occupied in applying their thoughts and energies to forging ahead, rather than looking backward"

Mind you we should remember that Chamberlain knocked down lots of historic buildings (some Tudor) to build New Street and Corporation St, but we don't have surviving photos of many of them so cant "look back" at them as much.

However the demolition of Josiah Mason college was a wanton act of vandalism.

I do wonder if people who had lived through WW2, and seen many buildings destroyed by German bombs, had less of an attachment to buildings than we have today.
 
It is lovely building in post #318 but would it still be fit for purpose if it was still here today or would we have workers/students bemoaning the lack of facilities and convenience.

I see some of the pictures of old building and they are full of character and have lovely features. In most though they do look tired and dirty (understandably) and if near to a sparkling brand new 'modern' building can see how people could be convinced it would be better (and cheaper) to replace rather than repair/refurbish. £4 billion for the Houses of Parliament!

Not saying it's right but I think the old buildings that remain are more precious because there's not many of them. Do residents of Lavenham walk around in a constant state of wonder?

Some of the modern buildings look fine to me, others look horrible but some recent ones are starting to look a state because they don't clean them. Modern materials don't weather as well as brick.
 
hi gilbert and yes i take your point about chamberlain but at least his buildings had and still have architectural merit.... they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder...all i can say is that mr manzoni (not even a brummie) should have gone to spec savers before destroying our historical buildings...when i look at that photo of josiah masons college and the workmanship that went into it i cant help but think how much pleasure visitors would have had looking up at it...a walk around town now and i would not give the new buildings a second glance and lets be honest they most likely wont be around in 40 or 50 years time anyway..i tend not to get angry about it these days as it will not bring buildings back...just makes me very sad that i have been robbed of admiring in person so many wonderful buildings...its a changing world and i accept that but i do not have to like it

lyn
 
The biggest vandalism of all in my lifetime in central Brum was the demolition of the Market Hall. Although I can't remember it before its WW2 damage, it was a nice central space with all the plants & other stalls in the period after the war and I always enjoyed my visits there. The destruction of some old streets was admittedly necessary to allow some redevelopment to take place, but did they need to destroy Martineau Street - no. Some are still there in name only, but unrecognisable, and perhaps the most soulless change (and one of the first to be attacked) was Smallbrook Street. Yes it certainly needed tidying up, but did they have to make such an ugly mess of it?

Maurice :cool:
 
To me it has nothing to do with the past, it is to do with beautiful irreplaceable buildings being demolished and replaced with boring glass and concrete eyesores. Can you, for example, see Paris demolishing the Louvre and replacing it with a glass and concrete gallery ? Herbert Manzoni as a lot to answer for. Eric
 
Yes we can criticise Sir Herbert Manzoni for aspects of his legacy but when I interviewed him in retirement in 1970, he explained to me that his whole idea was to make the city centre traffic free within the Inner Ring Road which we now call Queensway. Long after he has gone we almost have that with New Street, High Street and Corporation Street no longer open to all traffic. I co-wrote a report back then recommending that New Street be pedestrianised which the City Council dismissed as an absurd idea.
 
Astoness said:
hi gilbert and yes i take your point about chamberlain but at least his buildings had and still have architectural merit.... they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder...all i can say is that mr manzoni (not even a brummie) should have gone to spec savers before destroying our historical buildings...when i look at that photo of josiah masons college and the workmanship that went into it i cant help but think how much pleasure visitors would have had looking up at it...a walk around town now and i would not give the new buildings a second glance and lets be honest they most likely wont be around in 40 or 50 years time anyway..i tend not to get angry about it these days as it will not bring buildings back...just makes me very sad that i have been robbed of admiring in person so many wonderful buildings...its a changing world and i accept that but i do not have to like it

lyn
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It is very sad to our history and beautiful architecture wiped out and replaced with a blank faceless building!
 
Before the Central Library was demolished it was impossible to see the Birmingham Big Wheel from the top of Edmund Street / Chamberlain Square. Now it is possible.

This is just under the link bridge for BM & AG. Photos taken almost a week ago.





Centenary Way towards Centenary Square. This is where Paradise Forum used to be.

 
cookie273uk said:
To me it has nothing to do with the past, it is to do with beautiful irreplaceable buildings being demolished and replaced with boring glass and concrete eyesores. Can you, for example, see Paris demolishing the Louvre and replacing it with a glass and concrete gallery ? Herbert Manzoni as a lot to answer for. Eric
Click to expand...
cookie273uk said:
How can they demolish buildings like that, its absolutely criminal. Eric
Click to expand...
The Louvre has 10.2 million visitors a year, entrance fees start at €15. Do the maths.
 
Ell Brown, that's makes a pleasant change although I prefer red, white is preferable to concrete. Bob I know they make a charge, (they have had enough money of me over the years) but surely that is because of the contents not the building. Just because a building is not financially viable is no reason for demolishing it surely, unless its an eyesore of course like the second library was . Eric
 
Manzoni's plans were a disaster, undoubtedly, but, from this recent article, seem to be the planner's dream at the time. London, apparently almost suffered the same fate;
www.theguardian.com

Concrete bungle: how public fury stopped the 1970s plan to turn London into a motorway

It would have led to the demolition of more houses than were destroyed by the Luftwaffe. But the march of ‘traffic modernism’ was no match for people power
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
mikejee said:
Manzoni's plans were a disaster, undoubtedly, but, from this recent article, seem to be the planner's dream at the time. London, apparently almost suffered the same fate;
www.theguardian.com

Concrete bungle: how public fury stopped the 1970s plan to turn London into a motorway

It would have led to the demolition of more houses than were destroyed by the Luftwaffe. But the march of ‘traffic modernism’ was no match for people power
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...

just read that article mike...very interesting...well done to the people of london for standing up for what they believed...
 
Abercrombie, mentioned in the London link, was responsible for much of the post war (2) re-development of Plymouth city centre. The Luftwaffe left it very devastated, unlike larger cities where the bombing was more widespread.
The ideas, at the time, seemed fine and has resulted in a lot of open spaces, however, it can be a quite draughty place when the wind is strong. Towards the latte part of the 20th. century it had a very Soviet look about it to my mind. Recent developments have contrasted with it considerably.
 
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mikejee said:
Manzoni's plans were a disaster, undoubtedly, but, from this recent article, seem to be the planner's dream at the time. London, apparently almost suffered the same fate;
www.theguardian.com

Concrete bungle: how public fury stopped the 1970s plan to turn London into a motorway

It would have led to the demolition of more houses than were destroyed by the Luftwaffe. But the march of ‘traffic modernism’ was no match for people power
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...
Very revealing article...……….Thank you!
 
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