Pedrocut
Master Barmmie
The Church existed on the 1883 OS Map.
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Great Barr Cottage
- Thread starter oldMohawk
- Start date
Radiorails
master brummie
To be the church, the gable end should be looking into Sundial Lane. It isn't, it looks into Birmingham Road.
The 1885 and 1914 maps do not show the cottages but another smaller building.
The 1885 and 1914 maps do not show the cottages but another smaller building.
oldMohawk
gone but not forgotten
The gable end of the church has always faced the Birmingham Road. This shows in the old cottage pic and somewhere between the church and the cottage is Sundial Lane. The map in post#206 clearly shows this and aerial pics also show this.
The Google streetview from the Birmingham Rd agrees exactly with the maps etc.
michaelj68
proper brummie kid
I agree Mohawk
Was wondering if the triangle sign warns of a ‘hidden’ road at that point ? (Ie Sundial Lane). So vehicles might sometimes emerge from there. Viv.
Bob Davis
Bob Davis
An open red triangle was a warning or hazard, Wikipedia has a whole history of road signs, Google British Road signs prior to 1940 and it should be there. So where the photographer was standing, somewhere behind him there must have been a road.
Bob
Radiorails
master brummie
Which, is why I have doubts about the building beyond the cottages being the Methodist Church. The gable end seems to be incorrect . The cottages are also larger than the 'church hall', or whatever it was, that is shown in the maps.The gable end of the church has always faced the Birmingham Road. This shows in the old cottage pic and somewhere between the church and the cottage is Sundial Lane. The map in post#206 clearly shows this and aerial pics also show this.
The Google streetview from the Birmingham Rd agrees exactly with the maps etc.
Eric Gibson
master brummie
There's a place here that might throw up some chapel information if anyone has the patience to go through it.
https://www.british-history.ac.uk/vch/warks/vol7/pp434-482
https://www.british-history.ac.uk/vch/warks/vol7/pp434-482
Radiorails
master brummie
That would make the cottages on Birmingham Road I presume and not Sundial Lane. However, the official address of the church is Sundial Lane.
Pedrocut
Master Barmmie
I had looked several times with the idea of the cottages and the Church both being in Sundial Lane, being the address of the Church. It doesn’t fit.
But then it was suggested that we are looking along the Birmingham Road with different cottages. The problem now I think is why we don’t see a distinctive Sundial Lane, as on the maps it is quite wide.
The chapel won’t be found under Warwickshire places of worship as, it would have been in Staffordshire. Viv.
those that know the scottish maps site slide the blue dot to see what is there now...we know the chapel in sundial lane is still there but the sunday school that was next to it has gone to be replaced by a new community hall..to me those girls were coming back from either church or sunday school and they would have crossed the road as there is no pavement on the right hand side
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Eric Gibson
master brummie
I popped the Warwickshire one up because it was the first one I came across Viv but I think there are links on the site to the other counties.
oldMohawk
gone but not forgotten
I can see signs of Sundial Lane in the original post#1 photo and there is even a road sign to warn that it is there. The foreshortening in the photo makes the lane look a third of it's actual width and also makes Pages Lane look much nearer than it actually is. In the different photo posted in #192, the cameraman would have been standing on the Scott Arms crossing and the foreshortening in that photo is very noticeable. If you stand near the crossing today, Pages Lane looks much further away.
Radiorails
master brummie
The post 226 and 227 do seem to show what we are searching for. One issue that has thrown me a little is that in the photo (of the original) the road looks like it is a a T junction whereas it does not seem to be according to maps but is a curve to the right continuing the road. It would be interesting to find the history of the chapel, date of built etc. The chapel web site does not give that information.
Pedrocut
Master Barmmie
From post 213 here is a start to the history...
Great Barr, Wesleyan Chapel erected 1868 at a cost of £1,657, and will seat 150 persons
(This is the only Methodist mentioned for Great Barr.)
yes phil thats how i see it it was just that your red arrow looked a tad too far up but there again i do need to go to spec savers soon lol
lyn
oldMohawk
gone but not forgotten
I've edited my first pic I put in post#230 adding a red arrow pointing at a telegraph pole which is on the curve of the Birmingham Road and these poles continue along to the Bell Inn and further as shown in this pic linked from post#184. This pic looks south towards the Scott Arms.
Pedrocut
Master Barmmie
I've edited my first pic I put in post#230 adding a red arrow pointing at a telegraph pole which is on the curve of the Birmingham Road and these poles continue along to the Bell Inn and further as shown in this pic linked from post#184
Magnificent set of poles!
Radiorails
master brummie
Good. That date of 1868 fits my latest search. My search, in this thread, was the maps of 1885 (post 106) anf the two of 1914 (posts 198 and 206). The cottages are not shown there. It suggests that they were demolished prior to the earlier map (1885). As some point after the church building - or around the same time maybe - the Sunday school was built. Possibly the cottages were used as a Sunday school before their demolition.The amount of land encompassed by the site does allow for the newer Sunday school and other open areas replacing the cottages.
michaelj68
proper brummie kid
Well it's obvious to me Mohawk.This photo linked from post#192 is taken from the Scott Arms crossing so Sundial Lane must be somewhere along on the right. With Sundial Lane there then the Methodist Church must be there.
michaelj68
proper brummie kid
Is the white building on the left of the photo our cottage ?This photo linked from post#192 is taken from the Scott Arms crossing so Sundial Lane must be somewhere along on the right. With Sundial Lane there then the Methodist Church must be there.
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oldMohawk
gone but not forgotten
That's a brilliant photo and I think it definitely confirms the location of the 'Great Barr Cottage' ...
I had noticed it in the 1936 pic below but detail was not good enough to be sure and it looked like a pub. The 'Players Navy Cut' advert shows in both pics. The church roof also shows in the pic below.
This image only visible if logged in.
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michaelj68
proper brummie kid
I just came across another photo you might be interested in,the description is Birmingham Rd looking south from Sundial Lane ,i think we have another case of foreshortening here,That's a brilliant photo and I think it definitely confirms the location of the 'Great Barr Cottage' ...
I had noticed it in the 1936 pic below but detail was not good enough to be sure and it looked like a pub. The 'Players Navy Cut' advert shows in both pics. The church roof also shows in the pic below.
This image only visible if logged in.
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Eric Gibson
master brummie
That's certainly the same cottage as the first post, telegraph pole is in the right place and the trodden path to the house is the same.