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Preen Clemantina

C

christy

master brummie
hi, my grandfather was born on 13th,feb,1912, at 40.gough rd [greet] yardley his name john edward newman, he was put into care from an early age.& was given a new name in care[jack preen] when he came out of care, he inlisted into the british army in 1928, he got married in 1940, at the holy family r.c church in small-heath, i phoned the church to enquire about his baptism cert, they could not locate them, i then got intouch with st chads, head of he catholic church in birmingham, they said the church your grandfather got married in should have them. my grandfather was told his real name before he got married. i need help where do i go from here trying to find info on his baptism cert?....or where to go....thanks, in advance....regards,...christy..
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You could try the other Catholic Churches in the area

Corpus Christi Stechford
English Martyrs Sparkhill
Sacred Heart & Holy Souls Acocks Green
 
thanks,gee-em, my grandfather was a catholic, which my mom never knew? if there is no baptism-cert, how on earth can he marry? in a catholic-church?. which i pointed out to the priest. i have his cert in front of me?. is there a list of all catholic marriages in the uk. my guess is they were all binned?...regards.....christy*
 
Do you already have this


Name: John E Newman
Year of Registration: 1912
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Mother's Maiden Name: Colldicott
District: Solihull
County: Warwickshire, West Midlands, Worcestershire
Volume: 6d
Page: 1287

bren
 
As far as I know you have to be baptised/christened to be married in church and should produce your baptism/christening certificate. If your grandfather was in care perhaps he couldn't poduce proof so the priest accepted his word that he had been baptised. We were told that once someone is baptised/christened it can not be done again.
 
that was quick.gee-em, his details, my grandfather never know his father, thats why i was after the baptism cert for more info, of his parents?. his father died in 1915, at lily rd[yardley] i have his death cert,. can you find any info in the 1911,census of his mother, clementina newman,. this is one of many names, she used. i did find 6,husbands in yardley-cemetry. here are some of the names she used.[coldicott-preen-newman-fitzpatrick-flint-moorcroft. i also found some photo,s of her,. she looks, like a hard-nosed ---?.... thanks. for your help....take care....christy
 
thank so much,bren. i have tried for years to get more info on my gfather,s details, i have had so much help of you guys, on the forum. in 1911, john newman age48 was a widower. living in masshouse, in birmingham with his son william newman age 18.both born in london. my grandfathers, mother was still legally married to her 1st husband thomas henry preen in 1903.3 aston 6d 458. clementina had lots, of children, some died young & the rest put into care or workhouses,..if you find any more bren could you let me know,.. it could be my next noval?...thank you all...cheers,...christy
 
Hi Christy,

Did Clementina ever use a different christian name? I have searched the 1911 census and cannot find a Clementina Coldicott, Newman or Preen however, there is a Clara Preen aged 29 in Aston.

Macca
 
nice one,macca anythink is possible with this women, she was 23, in 1903, she used so many names, so it could be?, clementina was on her second man between 1908 & 1912 my ggrandfather,john mullan she liked to live in the yardley & hay-mills areas. if you can check it out we may get closer to her life, i most put a foto of her.[clementina],.thanks guys for your help.....regards,..christy..
 
Is this any help?
Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Births Dec 1880
Colldicott Clementina Aston 6d275

1881 Census
Household:
Dwelling Speedwell Rd
Census PlaceYardley, Worcester, England

Name RelationMarital StatusGenderAgeBirthplaceOccupationDisability
George FARMER Head M Male 40 Burford, Oxford, England Labourer
Lucy A FARMERWife M Female 36 Stoe On The Wold, Gloucester, England Wife
Robert FARMER Son Male 9 Yardley
William FARMER Son Male 6 Winsor Green
Charles H. FARMER Other Male 3 m Yardley
Henry JENKINS Lodger U Male 22 Stoe On The Wold, Gloucester, England Labourer
Charles COLLDICOTT Lodger M Male 30 Tysol, Warwick, England Labourer
Ann COLLDICOTT Wife M Female 25 Brales, Warwick, England Wife
Johnny COLLDICOTT Son Male 6 Tysol, Warwick, England
Charles H. COLLDICOTTSon Male 3 Warf St Bham
Clemint COLLDICOTT Daur Female 5 m Tysol, Warwick, England

1891 Census
Place: Solihull -Warwickshire
Civil Parish: Yardley
Ecclesiastical Parish: Acocks Green

Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born
COLDICOTT Charles Head M M 37 Agricultural Labourer Warwickshire -
Tysoe
COLDICOTT Ann Wife M F 34 Warwickshire - Brailes
COLDICOTT Tom Son - M 16 Plumber(Em'ee) Warwickshire - Tysoe
COLDICOTT Charles Henry Son - M 14 Telegraph Messenger(Em'ee) Warwickshire - Birmingham
COLDICOTT Clementina Dau - F 10 Warwickshire - Tysoe
COLDICOTT Ada Ellen Dau - F 7 Warwickshire - Olton

Tysoe. lies in Northfield, so-called because it lay at the extreme ... on a ridge of high ground south of King's Norton, Birmingham.


[SIZE=+1][SIZE=+1]Surname First name(s) Spouse District Vol Page[/SIZE][/SIZE]
[SIZE=+1][SIZE=+1]Marriages Sep 1903 [/SIZE][/SIZE]
Colldicutt Clementina/ Preen Aston 6d458
Preen Thomas Henry /Coldicutt Aston 6d

[SIZE=+1]Marriages Dec 1921 [/SIZE]
Fitzpatrick Peter /Newman Aston 6d1043
Newman Clementina /Fitzpatrick Aston 6d1043

[SIZE=+1]Marriages Sep 1926 [/SIZE]
Fitzpatrick Clementina /Flint Birmingham S. 6d550
Flint Thomas Fitz Patrick /Birmingham S. 6d550
 
nice one,pomgolian. the help of you guys, has been great"". after 4-6,years of searching on clementina, i have got so far what you have posted to me on the last post, what you guys have done in a short time its, taken me years,?. my gfather died in 1975, he never said much, of his upbringing in boys, homes,[summerhill & shenley-fields,] he was a very quiet man, i wish he was around today so i could tell him his father which he never met is buried at yardley . maybe one day we will find clementina on the 1911,census, under what name i don,t know?.... many thanks to you all. take-care....cheers....christy*
 
hi guys, when i went looking for clementina parents we ended up in [brailes] lower-brailes & upper brailes[shipton on stour] we found there marriage in a small church. i for got to say if the church has no record of my gfather baptism cert, where else can i try,..i have tried st chads....regards....christy..
 
pomgolian, clementinas, marriage to peter fitzpatrick in dec 1921.[6d1043] did it have her last name as newman?. regards,...christy..
 
Pomgolian said:
Yes Christy it did
Newman ClementinaAston 6d1043
Spouse
Peter FAitzpatrick Aston 6d1043
Click to expand...
pomgolian. can you help me out with this? dose it mean when clementina got married to fitzpatrick in dec 1921,did she used newman as her last name? or was she married to john newman [i wish] can you explain[newman-clementina aston6d1043. what it means,. please help? as i am still a novice at this? P.C stuff...thanks again pomgolian...regards...christy..
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The entry says that Clementina Newman married Peter Fitzpatrick in the Oct, Nov Dec qtr of 1921. You would have to get the marriage certificate for the exact date and place of the marriage.
 
ok guys the penny is droping, why did clementina use newman if she was not married to him, she had her first daughter to fitzpatrick in 1918, anne?. this women did not hang around? i am sure we could make a film of her. we have great writes, on the forum?... i will put up a foto soon of clementina...& she was my gggranny?....regards..christy*....
 
If she had been known as 'Newman' from when your Grandad was born (as that was the name she put on his birthcert) then it would have been easy for her to use the name when marrying Peter. Things were not the same back then as today, people often never had to prove who they were or even their ages.
I have a Step-granddad and My grandmother who both used My gran's
Surname for years before they splitup (which was actually my gran's first husband's and my granddad's Surname) and also both another granddad and grandmother who were not honest about their ages on their marriage cert', by the way did you know that Jack is a form of John....john edward newman / Jack Preen,... )
If you get the marriage cert of Peter and Clemantina it will have the names she was also formally known known by (Which should be Preen and or Colldicutt) you will then know for sure it's her.

Chris/Pom :angel:
 
pomgolian, thanks, for your info, i guess it will say on the marriage cert of fitzpatrick, the name newman, as she past her old partner,s name onto the [NEW] one?. thats, why she marryed in 1921, she was still marryed to thomas henry preen,when he died in 1920, she was free again, how can she get away with putting her son in care under a false name, when his birth states, his real name?. i surppose what gos, on today went on years, ago, what checks, did they do, my grandfather served 17,years in the army with this name,[jack preen]. i have his war book the name is crossed out with his real name in place,, if you find any more info please give me a bell...take care...regards....christy*
 
Hi Christy,

I am the Secretary of the Preen family History Study Group. We are currently doing a Booklet on Clementina Preen and I have been reading the thread all about her. I am wondering if you would put the Photo of Clementina you mention you have on the forum or send me a copy via my e mail address to include in our Booklet, this would really be helpful. By the way the Clara Preen someone mentioned is my Grandmother and she is also buried at Yardley cemetery along with my grandfather Richard and their son and daughter. I visit this grave regularly would you mind giving me the grave numbers of Clementine's husbands and hers if you have it so I may take a look. I was born Preen and my sister lives in Bilton Grange Road not far from Lily Road and my aunt in Waterloo Road round the corner from the Speedwell Road also mentioned. I do hope you dont mind helping with our Booklet with the pic. Many thanks Angela. e mail Eaddress removed for safety reasons. Please use PM instead.
 
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Hi Christy,

By the way I will willingly send you a copy of the Booklet it should be done ready for our meeting in early June - give me your address if you want a copy. Regards Angela.
 
angjim said:
Hi Christy,

By the way I will willingly send you a copy of the Booklet it should be done ready for our meeting in early June - give me your address if you want a copy. Regards Angela.
Click to expand...
. hello..angjim..
yes i would like a copy of yr booklet
i also have a history of the preen family,s..book.. i did not know there were any preens, left..in brum.. will be intouch again ... cheers,....christy..
 
Hi Christy, It would be good to meet at Yardley Cemetery, a coincidence is that we have just had Richard & Clara's grave renovated (at a cost) and I have to pay the money so maybe one day next week we could meet up it would be very intersting for me to see these graves and of course any photos you dont mind sharing would be so good. My family originate from Gloucester a lovely place called Kings Stanley you find lots of Preens come from there as they worked the Woollen Mills and brought the cargo down the river and eventually ended up staying in all the places upstream including Birmingham. My dad was Albert Preen one of 10 children and I have traced the family back to the 1600s. In our group we have three main Preen families Church Preen, Kings Stanley and Bridgnorth ones defined by DNA. My friend has traced Clementina's family a short way back in the Booklet she is doing. If I can help with any Preen info just let me know. Hope to meet up soon Angjim
 
that would be great,next week, i did go to a meeting a few years ago with my mom, there was preens, from all over the world, who came,... the preens, clementina, married were tailors,..thomas henry preen,... it would be good to meet & a chat...send me the time & date, that suits you...ok...cheers,...christy..
 
Hi Christy, I am sorry for the delay in getting in touch, My husband and myself will be coming to Birmingham on friday this week to settle up about my Grandad and Grandma's grave with the stonemason and I would love to meet up and take a look at Clementina's husbands graves and take some pics. We do have a way to travel so it would be around 12.30 - 1pm when we arrive. Is this convenient for you or would some other time suit? Look forward to meeting you. Regards Angela.
 
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