• Welcome to this forum . We are a worldwide group with a common interest in Birmingham and its history. While here, please follow a few simple rules. We ask that you respect other members, thank those who have helped you and please keep your contributions on-topic with the thread.

    We do hope you enjoy your visit. BHF Admin Team
  • HI folks the server that hosts the site completely died including the Hdd's and backups.
    Luckily i create an offsite backup once a week! this has now been restored so we have lost a few days posts.
    im still fixing things at the moment so bear with me and im still working on all images 90% are fine the others im working on now
    we are now using a backup solution

Kynoch's I C I 1800s - 1920s

i agree froth..great photo..quite a few women there as well..of course when ww1 started it was mostly women who worked in munitions which was not without its dangers

lyn
 
I have a small piece of a picture and the writing below this picture states that In 1916-1918, 212,000 women worked in munition factories. By 1918 almost 1,000,000 women were employed by that industry.
 
Some very young faces amongst them. And they made good money. They all seem reasonably well dressed. One bloke is driving a car through the crowd alongside the horse and cart. Maybe he was one of the bosses.

Any chance of locating this view on a map please ? Be interesting to see where it was. A very undeveloped spot, unlike today. Viv.
 
I think we once looked at this before and could not decide position, though cannot find post today. I still cannot fit it to a position on any available map
 
Ok Mike, thanks for trying. A bit obscure, there's obviously factory buildings in the distance, but could be any part of the factory site. Viv.
 
The difficult thing to me was the two chimneys, the position of which can be seen from aerial shots, do not seem to line up with a road going away from the works with no buildings either side
 
156394D0-7D76-4478-A90C-4FD4DEBA3071.jpeg I just wonder, a long shot. This has been discussed before but I also can’t find it. I think that due to the elevation of the photographer the first thought maybe it’s taken from the bridge by Witton Station, but there is nothing to the left, the main factory is in the distance.

Looking again the road seems quite wide, perhaps this is not Kynochs but Ludlows? Taken from around Holdford Farm on this 1905 OS map, or from the track going over the road towards Holdford Mill?
 
I typed this before I saw Pedrocut's post
When I first ever saw the pic my first thoughts were that it was Holford Drive which went from Holford Mills to the Aldridge Rd as shown in the map below. Looking at another aerial view I can see two chimneys at the rear of those works away from the shell packing compounds. However we can't be certain because I would assume that most of the people in pic would walk towards Witton rather than towards the Aldridge Rd which probably seemed out in the countryside in 1912.
HolfordDrive.JPG
 
oldMohawk said:
I typed this before I saw Pedrocut's post
When I first ever saw the pic my first thoughts were that it was Holford Drive which went from Holford Mills to the Aldridge Rd as shown in the map below. Looking at another aerial view I can see two chimneys at the rear of those works away from the shell packing compounds. However we can't be certain because I would assume that most of the people in pic would walk towards Witton rather than towards the Aldridge Rd which probably seemed out in the countryside in 1912.
View attachment 119084
Click to expand...

If you move the pointer a little more towards Aldridge Road, maybe the fence boundary on the left can be seen and the other fence boundary coming from the right closer to the main building?
 
Just an observation - unusual to see the same type of boundary fence on both sides of the road. So assume the road/lane might be a cutting through the same owned land on both sides - as a form of protection perhaps? Munitions storage/testing etc? All guesswork. Viv.
 
But did Holford mills have two big chimneys?. The area by the gate did, which is what I had assumed was the buildings in the background
 
This aerial view shows the length of Holford Drive from the Holford Mill to the Aldridge Road and the open land around it. There are at least two chimneys in the works and possibly a third smaller one but this pic was taken in 1947 and does not prove that the chimneys were there in 1912 although it seems likely that they were.
image is from 'britainfromabove'
Holford Drive.JPG
 
Last edited:
Yes, but I would have thought from the aerial view that looking back up the drive, one chimney would be viewed on one left of the road and the other the right side, whereas on the 1912 photo they are both on the left. This does not of course mean there was not another chimney on the left at that time
 
When I zoom in on Holford Drive there appears to be low fences on each side in this view dated 1947.
HolfordFence.JPG
image from 'britainfromabove'
 
If only the background was not so misty. Certainly this seems to be the only place that seems at all likely, though I still have afew doubts.
 
The alternative is they could be walking along Holford Road which is now called Noble Way. This would probably put the chimneys in the 1947 pic in the correct position as shown in the original pic ie: to the left of the road.
 
This view dated 1920 shows Holdford Road on the left (red spot) and once past the houses it is quite open. It seems to me that a view from there would put the chimneys on the left. Also I would think that the crowd in the original pic would be heading towards the trams and trains in Witton (red spot) rather than the Aldridge Road.
Munitions1920.JPG
image from 'britainfromabove'
 
Vivienne14 said:
This is a BBC audio clip about the production of ammunition at Kynoch's during WW1. Viv.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p023tcyk
Click to expand...


The narrator of the programme sounds like Paul Franks, the chap that does the football phone ins on Radio West Midlands.

Any road, at the start of the story the Managing Director of Ely, Andrew Lane, says that Kynoch was located at Witton as George Kynoch had decided to move the factory from Whittall Street after the explosion of 1859.

Kynoch started with Messrs Persall and Phillips at Whittall Street in 1856, and it was as that Company that the explosion took place. It was not George Kynoch’s idea to move to Witton, although he would be involved, but the regulations that were set up to stop munitions factories being located in dense areas of population.

It was after the move to Witton that G Kynoch took over the Company.
 
Vivienne14 said:
This is a BBC audio clip about the production of ammunition at Kynoch's during WW1. Viv.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p023tcyk
Click to expand...

Another thing mentioned in the short programme is the large contracts that Kynochs received during the Great War.

Arthur Chamberlain, was then running the show, and there was many who believed it the contracts were achieved with the help of his brother. It was obviously denied, but Lloyd George remarked that the Company should be called Chamberlains as the family had about £150,000 in shares!
 
Last edited:
But surely Kynochs were one of the major manufacturers of ammunition. I fail to see how they would not receive large contracts in a war , unless, of course some influential politician was of the opposite sect (party)
 
mikejee said:
But surely Kynochs were one of the major manufacturers of ammunition. I fail to see how they would not receive large contracts in a war , unless, of course some influential politician was of the opposite sect (party)
Click to expand...

I’m sure that the Camberlains would produce their own arguments as to why contracts should be received.

The point I make is not whether the firm Kynoch should receive or not receive contracts, just that there were some who questioned them, including Lloyd George.
 
Vivienne14 said:
Kynoch's Cordite leaflet, no date but hopefully this is the place to post it. Viv.

View attachment 120460
Click to expand...

This leaflet features on the site “History of Ireland” in an article concerning the little talked about Kynoch factory in Ireland....Arklow’s explosive history: Kynoch, 1895-1918.

“In fact Chamberlain only managed to secure the initial order to manufacture cordite in Arklow by putting political pressure on the British government. The government understood that Kynoch would be supplied with ‘cordite pulp’, an almost completed product, from another manufacturer and that Kynoch would only be doing the final processing in Ireland. This was Chamberlain’s original intention, but once he visited Arklow and purchased the Arklow Chemical Works this was no longer the case. When the government discovered that Kynoch would not be manufacturing the product in Britain but in Ireland they objected, and it looked like the order was going to be withdrawn. Not to be thwarted, Chamberlain approached John Redmond, leader of the Irish Parliamentary Party, to lobby the War Office not to obstruct the building of the factory, and following a deputation to London the objections were dropped and approval was given, somewhat begrudgingly, to manufacture cordite in Arklow.“

https://www.historyireland.com/20th...y/arklows-explosive-history-kynoch-1895-1918/
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top